New 3.0 to 3.3 (GPA) Parents Thread

Parents Forum
981

<p>Soozie…I resent the PM.</p>

<p>I think I may be the only one on the thread whose son does not want a small school! Of course, that rules out a lot of the schools being discussed, but it does seem that there may be a few state flagships that will work for him. My biggest question throughout all of this though, is whether good SAT scores can ever “make up” for the GPA…for instance, one school that came to visit his high school made a point of saying that they don’t accept anyone into their business school with less than a 3.4 GPA. But what if they have two students…one with a 3.4 GPA and 1500/2400 SATs and another student with a 3.2 GPA and 2050/2400 SATs? Would they really accept the first one and not the second? Is it that simple when it comes to large schools because they use a computer/need to have a cutoff/etc? I really wish I knew the answer to this one.</p>

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<p>RtoR…I got your PM and responded to it. </p>

<p>I honestly have not read up on your posts about your son enough to know his profile. I think when you look at a GPA, it cannot be looked at in a vacuum, however. Context matters. First, you need to compute an UNWEIGHTED GPA as that is what colleges go by as everyone has that and not every high school uses a weighted system, nor are these alike. So, when you examine the stats of admitted students to a college, they are giving you the unweighted GPA average for admitted students, just so you know (maybe you know this already). Then, a college will examine the rigor of the student’s chosen curriculum in the context of what his high school offers. So, a 3.2 GPA with a more rigorous curriculum is not going to be looked at the same as a 3.2 GPA in a less demanding course load. What was taken matters too. Also, GPA is ideally examine din the context of class rank or if class ranks are not provided, then percentiles (such as top 10, top 25 or top 50 % of the senior class). </p>

<p>Now, you mention “large schools.” Well, there are large public unis and those often are more numbers driven but many examine the entire application. But there are very large private unis too and for example, at my D’s university, NYU, it is huge but they truly examine the entire application…several essays, recs, rigor of coursework, extracurriculars and so on besides just GPA and test scores and so it is not like there is a numbers cut off itself. </p>

<p>I don’t think your question can be answered with a blanket statement but more “it depends on the school.” You want a school that looks at more than some numbers only and most schools do but some publics may not. </p>

<p>Also, one issue for a kid with very good SAT scores but a low GPA is that sometimes adcoms may conclude “underachiever”. It is better in some ways to have a higher GPA and lower test scores. But again, the GPA needs examination in CONTEXT. And most schools WILL do that and not have an actual “cut off” with the GPA. </p>

<p>Have no idea what your son is looking for (sorry to not have read the posts) and I don’t know his stats enough to recommend schools. There are many large schools for B students though…U of Rhode Island, Pitt, Indiana U, U of NH, Hofstra, Suffolk, Temple, Drexel, and many others.</p>

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<p>I think that an excellent SAT score could make a difference. Here’s my story: I applied and was accepted in to USC’s Resident Honors Program – it’s a program where kids can go to college after their junior year. Now if you look at their site, they have all these high standards in terms of GPAs. And I think the acceptance rate is around 9 or 10%, so pretty low. My GPA was nowhere near good enough – I had a 3.5 or so going into junior year, but then it took a dive (I got a C in one of my classes) which lowered my overall GPA to a 3.2 or 3.3. I only took one AP class (US History) and one Honors class (Physics). So my academic record wasn’t anything impressive, kwim? However, I also managed to snag a 1600 SAT (this was before the test was revamped, so at the time it was a perfect score).</p>

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<p>Yeah but a perfect 1600 out of 1600 is not like the scenario that ReadytoRoll mentions of 2050 out of 2400 and so we’re talking apples to oranges. </p>

<p>However, a 2050 is a pretty darn nice score.</p>

985

<p>Thanks so much for the input. Yes, I know about the whole “underachiever” thing…and they are right, he was an underachiever who didn’t work that hard in class, although was pretty busy doing other things. He did take a rigorous (but not most rigorous) curriculum (Calc and Physics by junior year, but only a smattering of honors and one AP yet to be taken as a senior). But his unweighted GPA is even lower than his 3.2 weighted GPA…not sure how much lower since our school only weights and does not rank, but I’m guessing around a 3.0. His strong points are the SATs (except for the whole underachiever thing), and his ECs (four year varsity sport and student government officer all four years, a part time job, and one other, very unique EC)…but my impression is that most public schools won’t look at them if he doesn’t even make the GPA cutoff. </p>

<p>It would be nice to find a public school or a large private (not in a city) that looked at things more holistically…Syracuse might be one. You’re right, IU is a safety for him…or at least was before the economy tanked. Now, who knows?</p>

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<p>Sooz - Was there a reason you added the parenthetical that you don’t personally have a kid in this range? Oh, I apologize. Perhaps this gratuitous statement was added to let us know that your own kid is below this range. </p>

<p>It’s reflective of CC’s approach to college admissions that there are 65+ pages for kids in this range, but there aren’t corresponding threads for kids applying in other ballparks, such as kids with GPAs of 3.5-3.8, 3.8-3.9, 4.0 etc. </p>

<p>For law schools, there’s a site with “Top Law-” in its name. If you go on that site, you know what to expect. CC is open to all college applicants, and it’s a shame that its focus has become so narrow that families with kids’ in this range have only one thread to exchange information without fear of one-upmanship or self-congratulatory superiority. </p>

<p>I know that others have said it often through the 65+ pages, but thank you again OP!</p>

<p>Pitt may be a reach for kids in this range. Syracuse may be a match, but beware the scholarship trap since the school is so costly. Several prior posters over the years have reported some sad stories about losing their scholarships after Yr 1 at Syracuse. While this can occur at any school, there were some heartbreaking posts on CC about 2-3 years ago from a kid who lost his scholarship at Syracuse and had to move back home for financial reasons.</p>

<p>Ready - One of my kids had a bad year, and did submit a separate Personal Statement explaining the grades from that year to the large universities where he applied. When we did college visits, he asked to speak to an admissions person and went over the explanation that he supplied. He got in everywhere he applied. Both he and his GC believe the personal statement, his ECs and interview helped, except at the largest schools such as Penn State that are clearly numbers-driven.</p>

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<p>ReadytoRoll -
Some of the large state universities have different colleges under their umbrella (sometimes on the same campus) maybe he could apply to the less stringent college within a system he likes and than transfer after the 1st year. For instance Rutgers Newark & Camden are not as hard to get into as New Brunswick (and even within the NB campus there are a few schools which have different requirements).</p>

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<p>This is a great thread, but so many pages! I don’t have the time to read everything. Is it possible to start an entire forum with threads for specifically our B average kids with SAT scores below 600? Maybe I’m not even the first one to suggest it here, but there’re too many pages read through to find out.
DS is class HS class of 2012, so it would be a great new forum to hang out in for the next couple of years :-)</p>

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<p>Yes, there is a reason. I will explain. I know that participants have been frustrated on this thread when a parent of a current college applicant who doesn’t fall into the range that this thread is about comes on to participate to discuss their child’s stats and possible schools and so on. So, while I ALSO am not a parent of an applicant with a 3.0 GPA, I am not the parent of ANY applicant at all. I came on to read this thread out of interest because I am a college counselor who advises many students and parents about their college admissions process as my job. In fact, I work with many applicants with stats in this range (or even lower stats) and currently have a student who fits this thread and I was perusing it to see what schools others were discussing and what they had to say about those schools. I wasn’t here about my own children. Then, a question was posed of me and so I tried to answer it volunteering my time to be helpful. I attempted to clarify that I wasn’t here about my own kids and I was well aware that there was some angst that only those with kids in the 3.0/3.3 range were being embraced to participate. So, I was basically saying that while I don’t have a child who falls into this range who is applying to college, I’m offering to participate to be of some help. That is why I bothered to mention that given the comments of not wanting parents of kids with higher stats to be discussing their admissions process on THIS thread. However, I do think that those without kids in this category applying this year who want to participate in order to be helpful should be able to participate. That is different than someone wanting to discuss admissions for their kids in this year’s cycle with higher stats. But anyone should be able to participate to answer questions or to give advice. That was my intent. But I felt I had to qualify it after reading posts on CC discussing not wanting parents of kids with higher stats to participate here. But since my intent was to help, please forgive me. Otherwise, I don’t need to bother to volunteer to help. I have so much work to do right now that I put aside to answer the questions here. </p>

<p>As far as places on CC for such students…there are many forums for a wide variety of colleges on CC and not just Ivy school specific forums.</p>

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<p>Soozievt, I for one welcome your input to this thread, and if Nonzeus had read what is printed under your name (CC College Counselor) I suspect he wouldn’t have written his response to you.</p>

<p>Please, leave the lovely ivory towers of Olde Ivy and come join us here in the real world!</p>

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<p>RTR have you looked into Coastal Carolina. It near Myrtle Beach and has a lot of out of state students. I haven’t seen it but my friend’s daughter really liked the school.</p>

<p>I’m planning on getting an unofficial transcript tomorrow so that I can figure out what my son’s weighted and unweighted GPA are. I hope it’s not worse than I think it is. Two of the schools that my son is planning on applying to said that he needed at least a 3.0!!!</p>

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<p>Soozie,</p>

<p>As I’ve said many times, all are welcome on the thread, and even parents whose kids do not fit the profile. The problem is when a parent comes onto this thread and starts talking about their 3.3 kid who is applying to a school that would be an impossibility for our kids, and then happens to mention that, “oh by the way…that 3.3 is unweighted and my kid’s weighted GPA is a 4.0”. Then most of us are thinking, “And the point of you talking about your kid applying to Cornell** on this thread was…?”</p>

<p>**Not necessarily Cornell, but you get the idea…</p>

993

<p>^^^^ Yes, that is what I have understood and I see why that is most frustrating. Knowing that is how people were feeling on this thread and having observed it, I was saying that I also don’t have a child in this situation of my own but was offering to help out even so and that was why I was participating. It is not like I am discussing my own children’s stats (though don’t post them anyway) or their application process.</p>

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<p>Warriorboy…thanks for the suggestion. I’ll look it up. He really wants a school with a sports team he can root for, and a Greek system. (Oh yeah, and a business school.)</p>

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<p>Lafalum wrote:</p>

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<p>Actually one misconception I have read many times on CC is that people think that those who hire college counselors are those seeking elite colleges. To the contrary, I have MANY students with average stats and some with very low stats! I only have one student who has any Ivies on her list. People who are applying to ANY kind of college could use advice! So, you won’t find me in an ivory tower. I hardly deal with Ivies that much frankly.</p>

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<p>ReadytoRoll, I’ll make another pitch for my alma mater University of Oregon. They just raised the GPA for a guaranteed admission (no essay required) to 3.4, but there will still be about 50% of their admitted class that won’t meet that guarantee (but have at least the required 3.0). It is a Pac 10 school with a VERY spirited student body (football team on the cover of the west coast edition of Sports Illustrated this week), has an excellent business school (including a sports marketing program that is one of the best in the country) and a Greek system. They are OOS friendly, too.</p>

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<p>Baseball is the bread and butter at Coastal Carolina.</p>

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<p>Yup. I had a college counselor and I was looking at schools like BU, American, Pitt, Indiana, Temple, UMass, etc.</p>

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<p>Mom0809
The thread you suggest would be duplicative of this one. I know its length has gotten daunting, but that is because a terrific group of committed parents keep offering observations and advice on it.
Since your child is not a rising senior, if you think a separate thread is needed, I suggest you give it a title which includes the class year. Nonetheless, I suspect it will reach 50+ pages very rapidly becuase there is such intense interest.</p>

<p>Alterrnativley, if your college interest is limited to a specific region, you might include that in the title if you wish to keep it shorter.</p>

<p>Oddly, the B+ students thread, which is very helpful, too, did not, for whatever reason, gain as many participants, and is thus much shorter.</p>

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<p>I think she was suggesting moving the thread into its own selfcontained subforum.</p>

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<p>My child is interested in engineering either mechanial or aerospace. We are Va. residents and have schools available to us but not sure if we can get in. While my child’s GPA is 3.5 the SATS are low. I know engineering requires some pretty high stats. Any suggestions. We are open to all areas of the country. ECs are good.</p>