<p>I <em>believe</em> that the higest amount of merit aid that Denver offers is around $21,000 - $22,000 per year. </p>
<p>Sounds like Denver might be off the table then. 
What you are saying makes sense and we will go back to the drawing board and try to add more schools that are a good fit and might give him some merit aid.</p>
<p>I will run the net price calculators at the ivies and see where we come out. I don’t know exactly how much I will make this year but it should be around100k or a little more. I’m a small business owner (50% partner actually), and a divorced single mom of 2 boys (dad has zero money, pays no support and will pay nothing towards college). Even though I make a decent income, I’m pretty broke, and even in debt, after paying for an expensive boarding school for the last two years so I’m not really in good shape financially to take on a huge college bill. But I don’t know that they will consider any of that; I’m afraid they may just look at my income and assets (a small amount of real estate and a tiny college fund for the younger child). And as a business owner I’ve heard it can get complicated, although this is a pretty small business with zero physical assets. </p>
<p>I suppose if Chris was accepted at Stanford I might go out on a limb and pay more than I’m comfortable with, just because it is really his dream school and even I am fully on board with everything about Stanford except the difficulty of getting in and the potential cost. Not sure I’d do the same at Harvard or the others though…I actually really like U of Miami for him for a number of reasons and I’m glad to hear it’s about on par with Tulane. I think we need some more in that category. I personally would be happy to have him nearby at The Barrett Honors College at ASU, but I don’t want to sell him short since he may have better opportunities elsewhere based on his stats. And I definitely don’t want him to feel a huge sense of failure or disappointment over the outcome; college should be a fun and happy time. I’m fairly certain he would feel a lot better about U of Miami, but I need to make sure. We are actually going out there this weekend for a visit, so I guess I will find out pretty soon!</p>
<p>Being a small business owner makes many of the NPCs dicey. Business deductions that are taken are frequently added back to income increasing your expected ability to pay. And if Dad is remarried to some money some colleges will consider that income as well. Definitely run those NPCs but also have a heart-to-heart with your S about your limits on what you can pay. My BIL attended Stanford and it’s a great school, but no school is worth incurring a lot of debt to attend.</p>
<p>Yes I hear you. I feel like I can’t predict what kind of need-based aid we might get, if any. So we are really shooting for merit aid. I think he’s got a shot at U of Miami, now we just need to find a few more in that same category. Thanks for all the input. :)</p>
<p>Oh and his dad is remarried and I don’t know what kind of money the wife makes (but she is supporting him, so she must make something). That would really be a bummer if her income affected Chris’ aid, since I know they won’t help out. :(</p>
<p>I just ran the Stanford net price calculator using fairly high estimated numbers and it came back with about $19,000 per year, which would actually be doable for us. Now if he could just get into Stanford!!!</p>
<p>Yes, a 5% chance based on last years admission rates.</p>
<p>So, we visited the U of Miami today. It’s a beautiful school and I think it would be a good fit in a number ways. I do worry though that it might not be terribly challenging for Chris over time. Also, I don’t know if it would be affordable, unless he got a full tuition scholarship, which I’m sure is hard to get. </p>
<p>He is still very much interested in Stanford, Duke, Harvard, Princeton, Yale, and now he’s added Dartmouth, just to roll the dice at one more Ivy. </p>
<p>But something came up today…he now thinks he wants to forget about law and major in Business with a minor in Computer Science/Computer Programming. This is actually a good plan for him I feel, since math and computer programming have always been his strongest areas. But it means we have to rethink his college list I’m afraid. Small LACs are probably out, I would imagine, for computer programming. With an 800 on the math portion of the SAT and an interest in computer programming and business should we be looking at a different sort of school altogether, like a tech school? I’m also getting a much clearer idea of what type of school he wants to be at: a medium to large university that is reputable, preferably in a warm climate, though he is willing to be in the NE if the school was really good. </p>
<p>He is NOT very keen on ASU, though he did read today that they are good for business and that improved his opinion a bit. Also, he is applying for the Flinn Scholarship here in Arizona, which is a full ride scholarship with lots of additional benefits (like travel), and if he got that, ASU would be much more appealing. He is completely negative about other safety ideas like U of Alabama, so I think ASU is going to remain the only true safety on the list.</p>
<p>We are aware that he needs more match schools, particularly ones that might offer him some merit aid, so we are thinking about adding Vanderbilt and USC. He is also thinking about Swarthmore, but I’m sure its a reach, and I also wonder if it is too small and whether it has computer programming. Also, the University of Rochester invited him to apply last year when he won a math award, and they said they had an automatic scholarship for him, however I don’t think the amount was terribly big, if I recall maybe “at least $8000 per year,” which doesn’t make much of a dent in a high tuition. But it wouldn’t hurt to apply if the school was a match in other ways, although I really worry about that weather for him.</p>
<p>So, new list:</p>
<p>Stanford (top choice, super reach)
Duke (super reach)
Harvard (super reach)
Princeton (super reach)
Yale (super reach)
Dartmouth (super reach)
Vanderbilt (match?)
USC (match?)
Swarthmore (reach?)
U of Rochester (match/reach?)
U of Miami (match)
ASU Honors College (safety)</p>
<p>Any thoughts on the new list? Does he have a shot at merit aid at any of these?</p>
<p>Due to admit rates, both Vanderbilt (about 12%) and USC (19%) are reaches… These universities are “reach for everyone”. because they turn down a vast majority of qualified applicants. A match would have at least 30% admission rates.
URochester would be a match (36% admitted).
What about LACs in a consortium? The Claremonts, for example, form a 6,000 student university divided into a college of engineering (Harvey Mudd), a College of Economics/Finance (McKenna), a women’s college (Scripps), an “intellectual” liberal arts college (Pomona) and a “socially conscious/politically involved” liberal arts college (Pitzer).
Would a smaller school that’s in a big city be a good compromise for him (for instance, while there may not be D1 sports, there may be a professional team)?</p>
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<p>? How is Barrett HC a safety? The school is a safety, but the HC isn’t. Would your son go there if he doesn’t get into Barrett? If not, then it’s not a safety.</p>
<p>I think you need 2 - 3 financial safeties and right now, you may not have one. </p>
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<p>How much merit do you need? How much can you pay each year? Merit gets applied to need first, so if it’s not enough, it may not reduce your cost at all. </p>
<p>What is his major and career goal?</p>
<p>The ex and his wife’s income will be considered at most/all of those private schools. Your son needs to realize that </p>
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<p>I think the list needs tweaking again now that we know that there is an ex-husband and a new wife who won’t contribute. </p>
<p>I’d tell your son to choose 3 top schools and then the REMAINING schools should be schools that don’t need NCP info. I’d only have him apply to the top schools that give super aid…like Stanford, Yale, Princeton, Harvard, and Williams. Forget the rest. </p>
<p>Then choose 3 schools that might give him large merit.</p>
<p>Then choose 3 schools that FOR SURE will give him large merit.</p>
<p>As for going to law school. Any good school is fine for a pre-law student. Top law schools accept students with high GPAs and high LSAT scores. Your son is a good test-taker. you are right to avoid debt.</p>
<p>Be empathetic to your son about these issues. None of this is his fault. He’s gonna feel that he did his part (great stats) and he’s being let down (you haven’t let him down…you shouldn’t feel any guilt…sounds like you alone are financially raising your son.). Try using the SET technique when dealing with disappointment…Support, Empathy, Truth. </p>
<p>I will go out on a limb and say that with his stats he will almost certainly get into Barrett. The average SAT score of a Barrett admitted student (CR+M) was 1297, average GPA about 3.8. I can also say with complete certainty that he will get the President’s scholarship of $9500/year to ASU: <a href=“https://scholarships.asu.edu/estimator”>https://scholarships.asu.edu/estimator</a>. Just remember that Barrett costs an extra $1k per year when you calculate the total cost. I would say that Barrett is a true safety for Chris. It’s the safety for my DS also who has very slightly lower stats.</p>
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<p>This is exactly how he feels. 
The truth is, he could get admitted into any number of really great schools with his stats, and certainly somewhere like U of Miami if he wanted. But it is going to be very hard for me to pay more than about 20k per year anywhere, and even that is a stretch. So what he really needs is a full tuition scholarship somewhere. The problem is, he’s really stuck on top schools. Although he is actually warming to Barrett Honors College at ASU a little bit now that he wants to major in business and now that he understands the financial problem. (And yes, I’m pretty sure he will get into Barrett.) We are still going to put out applications at a bunch of schools and cross our fingers though.</p>
<p>Interestingly, at the info session at U of Miami today they said that if you don’t have your 2014 tax info when you apply, you can use your 2013 info. My 2013 income was much lower than this year. If I applied with my 2013 income we would definitely get some need-based aid. But would that go away later when I filed FAFSA? Or would he lose the aid the next year? I wouldn’t want to send him somewhere for a good price and then have the price increase dramatically the next year.</p>
<p>Look, OP, you’re not alone in feeling this way and in having a child who feels this way. Thousands of parents each year go thru this experience with their kids. It’s an important and good lesson for kids to learn that life isn’t fair and that sometimes you deserve better than you get because of forces beyond your control. He’ll get over it, in part because he has you; there’s no sense that you have been anything but supportive of your child and so have nothing to beat yourself up about. I went thru all those emotions last year, and I’m still kicking my butt a little bit, know it’s irrational, and wish I could stop. Whatever negative effect this will have on your son, it will be outweighed by all the positive effects of having a parent as caring and empathetic as you have demonstrated yourself to be. Yay, mom!</p>
<p>that would go away when they ask for the latest tax forms. X_X </p>
<p>Thanks jkeil911 
Yeah, I figured there was probably no point in trying to use last year’s lower numbers, but I thought I’d ask! </p>
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<p>I might go out and sit on that same limb with ya, but that still doesn’t make it a safety. </p>
<p>AND…even if he gets into Barrett, I would NOT have that be his only safety. We’re Americans, we like CHOICE. No one wants to face the spring with only ONE affordable option. That isn’t good for morale. When everyone else at the lunch tables is debating their choices, your child isn’t going to want to be saying, “I have to go to Barrett because it’s my only affordable choice.” He should have at least 3 affordable choices…so he’ll feel that he got to pick.</p>
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<p>Absolutely. Once the real numbers are known in spring of his senior year, the pkg would change. I believe what the person meant is that people do “temporarily” use 2013 numbers, but then they later correct them when the real numbers (th 2014 numbers) are known. I highly doubt that Miami would actually AWARD money based on old numbers. Even if they sent a FA pkg after an ED application using old numbers, they would later adjust that FA pkg if the new true numbers were much different.</p>
<p>For many/most people, using old numbers will still give them a fair assessment of their aid since their incomes won’t change much…but for you, as you are rightly concerned, you would get a better pkg sent to you, but then some money would be taken away once the real numbers became known.</p>
<p>I’m not nearly as hard over as @mom2collegekids with regards to having more than one safety. Yes, some kids want a choice. If the student would be happy attending the school (which should be the case to make it a safety) then one is fine.</p>
<p>I think that in this case, with Chris really set on attending top schools that are really hard to get into and that don’t give any/much merit aid, several safeties are necessary. Hopefully, it’ll turn out all for the best and he’ll get into several of his schools and will get a great financial aid package, but that’s too many ifs.</p>
<p>I agree that ASU Barrett is a safety for him. But one isn’t enough.</p>
<p>Also, M2K is right: he’ll want to be able to brag and have his senior dilemma, like the others. So he needs to add more schools. These schools won’t be ideal, but if he’s given a choice betwen ASU and another school, they’d qualify if he can say “I’d like to go there rather than ASU”. He should imagine: he’s only gotten into ASU and three other schools not already on the list. These schools must have 30+% admission rate. What would these schools be?</p>
<p>There’s a book about Honors Colleges about to be published, hopefully on time for the Dec1 deadlines, otherwise there’s a 2012 edition.</p>
<p>You may want to ask him what States he’d like to go to college to: Perhaps Massachusetts? California? New York?
Then find information about the Honors Colleges at the flagship(s) there: how big are the scholarships - how easy is it to get full tuition&fees? What about colleges in a similar state or colleges in that state that are slightly less highly ranked than the flagship but still very good, such as UNC-WiIlmington, NCSU, James Madison, Virginia Tech, Michigan State, Wilkes of FAU? What types of scholarships do they offer? Would he be interested?</p>
<p>Next, try to make him think of cities he’d be interested in: Chicago? Atlanta? Boston? Philadelphia? Have him look up (or look up together) all the colleges in the city (or within a reasonable distance). Are there any that he’d compromise his criteria for, since they’d be in the “right” city?</p>
<p>For instance, for a good match, what about Macalester? It’s a small school and it’s not a big D1 school, but it’s in a major city with major sports, in one of the greatest urban neighborhoods, not to mention the easy access to nature (parks, lakes, etc), and the Fortune 500 headquarters/companies. The students are bright and politically involved, often interested in international events and cultures.
There’s also Occidental in Los Angeles (I know I’ve already brought it up): sure, it’s small, but it’s in LA! Surely he can’t imagine being bored in LA? 
There’d probably be good merit to be had at Chapman, too.
There’s also Pitt Honors, but he’d benefit in applying as soon as possible. Big, dynamic city + cool college neighborhood + great honors college. </p>
<p>@chris17mom you are willing to go way out on a limb financially, or does Chris realize that there is limited money involved and therefore he needs to look at those big schools that provide the excellence he is looking for while he receives enough merit to not have you so financially stressed? Try to keep no/low UG debt, so he can fulfill his academic plan if it includes graduate school.</p>
<p>UA would be a great safety. Have you visited campus yet? The freshmen class has lots of high stat kids and they have great honor programs. My Civil Eng. daughter in honors and in two special programs (one with 300 students; one with 400 students) and is thoroughly happy.</p>
<p>What happens when the school Chris ‘loves’ just isn’t financially feasible?</p>
<p>Support. Empathy. Truth.</p>
<p>Sounds like Chris has ideas that can change. He does need a school big enough to offer him what he wants, and have the varying degree fields based on the possibility of changing majors.</p>
<p>Investigate what options you might have with Western Undergraduate Exchange program.</p>
<p>I would suspect the EFC will get very dicey with taking in ex’s household income and data.</p>
<p>Is this your only child, and how far are you from retirement? How will a major cash drain affect you?</p>
<p>Think about giving real life answers, not enabling or entitlement answers. Chris needs to face reality at some point. The financial picture is not going to change, no matter what Chris’ wishes are.</p>
<p>@chris17mom If business is a thought for your son, you should look at the Bloomberg list of undergraduate business colleges. Several warm weather schools: UT; Texas A&M; Wake Forest; Emory; USC; SMU; UNC; Georgia Tech; U San Diego; UF; Elon; UGA; Miami; etc. U Arizona and ASU also make the list.</p>