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<p>Me too! I’d be proud to have them as productive fellow citizens and get a positive return on our investment. </p>
<p>No wonder my kids want to avoid red states. </p>
<p>Where do I make my tax-deductable contribution?</p>
<p>“have to be “punished” for it by giving them benefits and jobs?”</p>
<p>I don’t view it as a punishment to pay my share to support public education in this country. I will get punished if there’s a permanent underclass in my country, but it’s putting money in my own pocket to help pay for good public education, including graduate school. The profiled students who attend CUNY are not taking anyone’s spot, either – anyone can attend CUNY. This enterprise is much, much cheaper than the tens of billions it would cost to deport all these American-raised young people, which no one in Washington seems to be proposing. It is an interesting idea to imagine them leaving voluntarily, but it will not happen.</p>
<p>Even if they end up doing under-the-table work, they’ll be more productive if they are educated. For example, a lot of undocumented New Yorkers work as nannies – the next generation will surely benefit by spending so much time with well-educated caregivers.</p>
<p>Anyone can NOT attend the CUNY senior colleges. There are limited slots. I don’t know why you would think anyone can attend.</p>
<p>Hanna,</p>
<p>It is very easy to make them leave voluntarily. All you have to do is to make it hard to live here undocumented. If there is no access to jobs with fake/stolen social security numbers, no access to public schools (both secondary and post-secondary) for children of illegal immigrants, no access to any public-funded programs I guarantee you it will be much easier for illegal immigrants and their children to make a decision to leave. </p>
<p>As far as educated nannies are concerned. One would think that New York families able to hire nannies have resources to send their kids to good schools with well-educated caregivers. I also presume that well-educated illegal immigrant will not want to work as a nanny. As soon as we make it easy for illegal immigrants to access higher education, they will start making demands that for access to work opportunities that require that higher education.</p>
<p>Just another way to buy votes, do not even need to use taxpayers’ money, just support and mention that you did…very clever… what is the next peace of info that will prove the samo, samo, samo…? Very impressive and rsourceful…</p>
<p>Where do I make my tax-deductable contribution?</p>
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<p>lol…so then you want your fellow taxpayers to help you help illegal aliens? I think that’s one of the things at the bottom of this issue. If people want to give solely from their own pockets then fine. But, to take a tax deduction for it means you’re not really doing all the paying. this charity shouldn’t be identified as one that can receive tax deductable payments since its purpose isn’t one of clean hands.</p>
<p>And, I’m not surprised that non/low-tax paying students want to go to school in blue states. When they’re actually paying taxes, they may enjoy living in red states…where they will pay a “fair share” and not get gouged to cover all the wild-haired programs that come down the pike.</p>
<p>ClassicRockerDad…Perhaps if you actually lived in a red border state like mine (Texas), your attitude would be different. For instance, the public schools in my area are composed of more than 60% Hispanics. Many of these students are ESL, and they cannot communicate in English at all; nevertheless, they are mainstreamed into high school classes, and the teachers are forced to water down the rigor. Students whose American citizen parents are actually paying for these illegal children to be educated are having their education vastly shortchanged. If financially feasible, many bail and are attending privates. So now their parents are being forced to pay exhorbitant property taxes as well as exhorbitant private school tuition. Does this seem fair? </p>
<p>As a high school teacher in the public sector I decided my time was done when a proposal from my district suggested that I, along with other faculty members, attend night classes to learn Spanish (as if I had the time after my 60+ hour/weeks, 200+ students, 4 preps) so I could be bilingual and communicate. Strangely, though, the students were not being asked to spend their evenings learning English. </p>
<p>Education is not the only thing that has been affected. Come take a look at our hospitals and clinics that are losing money hand over fist because of illegals who don’t pay and/or are on Medicaid, so these facilities/employees are receiving only a fraction of the actual cost. Then look at our jail overcrowding and crime rate and see how it has also been impacted. </p>
<p>This gravy train has got to stop, or it’s going to devastate our country.</p>
<p>*It is very easy to make them leave voluntarily. All you have to do is to make it hard to live here undocumented. If there is no access to jobs with fake/stolen social security numbers, no access to public schools (both secondary and post-secondary) for children of illegal immigrants, no access to any public-funded programs I guarantee you it will be much easier for illegal immigrants and their children to make a decision to leave. *</p>
<p>Very true. Other countries that truly do make it hard for illegals to live have far fewer illegals. If you have to show proof of legal status when enrolling kids for school, then you wouldn’t bring your kids here…and then you would less likely come, either…or at least not for extended stays. Other countries do expect people to demonstrate that they are legally in the country. They are not providing free education, free breakfast, free lunch, etc, etc. No wonder this country is a magnet (which is funny since another thread features an immigrant who dislikes this “greedy country” and can’t wait to leave it…lol. This country gives more to charity and more to disaster relief no matter where the disaster happens.)</p>
<p>“If there is no access to jobs with fake/stolen social security numbers”</p>
<p>Wait, you’re saying this will be an EASY change to implement? Well, we disagree on that.</p>
<p>^^^^
Hanna,</p>
<p>I think there is a system that employers can use to check the numbers. I don’t recall the name of it now. Right now the employers are not required to use it. If the law imposes harsh penalties on employers for not doing their due diligence, many employers will start using it. Will this arrangement catch everyone? No. However, coupled with other changes (no publicly funded program for illegal immigrants), it will make it hard to continue living in this country illegally.</p>
<p>P.S. The thing is, all we have to do is to enforce existing laws.</p>
<p>lerkin, the name of the system is EVerifiy. Some people complain it is not accurate. It could have been made accurate. Its not that hard. FAFSA matches person with SSN and spits out mismatches.</p>
<p>Yes, there is a system, but empoyers do not want to do that, which is known fact.</p>
<p>Part of stimulus money should never exist, as stimulus should never been mentioned…</p>
<p>huh Miami? OK</p>
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Why should it matter if someone is brought to the US by a stranger or a relative? Why should it matter if you were born a year before or after your parents crossed the border? </p>
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How would creating a path that allows young adults who were brought here as children to become legal open a can of worms? They are already here and they are not going anywhere, so we could at least give them the basic rights to make a dignified living. That, or be more aggressive about deporting undocumented immigrants so that this country never does become the one and only home of these children.</p>
<p>I am not supporting illegal immigration, by the way. What I do hope is for this country to pick a firm stance that’s “fair” to all parties involved. I would fully support the measures proposed by lerkin to discourage and uncover illegal immigration. However, tolerating them here without access to basic resources seems unfair - not so much for them (it’s their own fault) as for their children who got here through no fault of their own. At some point this does become their home and it seems super unfair to give them a choice between staying illegally with no chance of success, or returning to a country that they have no ties to - and without money or education or friends to help them get off the ground.</p>
<p>borlum, if we went with your proposal, how do we define young adults who were brought here as children? How old would you define children? 2? 5? 10? 12? 15?</p>
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<p>I’d be in favor of the law coming down hard on employers who hire illegal immigrants. That’s where the problem starts. Many countries have some illegal immigration and it would be impossible to eradicate it completely, but we have more than most. In part that’s because we share a long border with a much poorer country to our south, but mostly it’s because our economy has a seemingly insatiable demand for low-wage undocumented workers to do the undesirable grunt work that U.S. citizens apparently don’t want to do: picking vegetables, washing dishes, cleaning hotel rooms, processing chickens, etc. Illegal immigrants (the adults, that is) are overwhelmingly male (estimated 59% male, 41% female) and have a higher workforce participation rate (96% of the adult males are employed) than U.S. citizens or legal immigrants. Many employers like to hire illegals because they’ll do undesirable jobs, they’ll work for low (often sub-minimum) wages, and because of their precarious status they’re less likely to complain about harsh working conditions or otherwise call attention to their status. As a nation, we send illegal immigrants a bipolar message: we offer them jobs, and then we assail them for coming and taking those jobs. And as long as we keep offering them jobs, the problem won’t go away. So in my view, that’s who we should go after: the employers who hire them. Not the children who are staying in school, studying hard, and trying to educate themselves to build a pathway to a better life.</p>
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<p>Sorry, I couldn’t help poking a little fun at the discussion, but you betcha!</p>
<p>I’d like to see my fellow taxpayers invest in kids hungry for opportunity who if educated will deliver more to the economy than they take in via the cost of services. We’re taking about scholarships for college here. </p>
<p>I’d trade the Dream Act kids for the squeegee guys anytime!</p>
<p>My grandparents came here with nothing, I got educated for free, and I know that over my life, I’ve paid far more in taxes than I’ve taken. I’m worth it. So are they.</p>
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<p>LOL! A close friend of mine, originally from Texas, is a native Spanish speaker and his family has been in the San Antonio area for hundreds of years. It used to be part of Mexico if you recall. Remember the Alamo?</p>
<p>Bclintonk,</p>
<p>I hear what you are saying. However, this problem requires multi-facetted solution. Only going after employers will not work as well as coupling it with enforcing other existing laws.</p>
<p>Regarding filling undesirable jobs, there are legal ways to do so with migrant workers. If you ever visit Wisconsin Dells during summer, you will encounter many seasonal workers who clean hotel rooms and wash the dishes. The all go home after a while. </p>
<p>And once again I would like to repeat is that the parents who’s the very first act in this country was to break the law created a problem for their children, not you or I.</p>
<p>P.S. Also, can you explain how you are able to quote other people’s messages on this board?</p>