No coach /no summer programs

College Majors Musical Theater Major
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@momma2a my S did have 2 auditors tell him he was refreshing at Unified. I attributed that to lack of coaching, but its quite possible I was just looking to feel better about not having a coach. What I know without a doubt is each school got my true S. He’s a big personality, big voice, big smiley kind of guy and I wonder if coaching would have tamed that down. I actually thought he needed to be “tamed” a bit, but that wouldn’t have been fair to him. So the refreshing comments made me feel pretty awesome.

@toowonderful that look was present last year also. They did stick out when together. I wondered if that was the intent?

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We saw that look this year too. Everywhere we went! Funny. I didn’t even think it may be due to a coach recommendation.

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I want to add that several of the kids I know this year that didn’t have a coach but all work with the same director said they ended up not taking the directors advice about certain monologues as they felt best with other things. They knew they needed to feel comfortable in auditions. Again - nobody can ever know for sure if that helped or hurt. And to be honest it probably did both depending on the school. What I know for sure is that these kids feel good because they remained true to themselves Hard to do with all the advice and input.

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@bfahopeful You make a good point… each student needs to feel comfortable in auditions. If a coach provides that, then I can see the investment being worth it.

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Yes I think that “look” is pretty standard and safe so you see it a lot. D struggled a little to find audition dresses that represented her , and yet met audition appropriate guidelines. Throughout the audition process she kept commenting that she didn’t look like everybody else, from clothing to hairstyle and honestly amount of makeup. I think her young, fresh, vintage style helped her stand out a little from the crowd based on the number of comments she received at Unifieds.

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My D lightly used a coach and wasn’t advised to change materials depending on the program (besides basic audition requirements, of course).

I have heard 4 faculty members/program heads/adjudicators at 3 different programs talk about how they could tell when someone had been coached (in all cases, especially from one “national coach/place”), and it wasn’t complimentary. They used words such as “robotic,” “inauthentic,” and “over coached,” and there was eye rolling and exasperated sighing.(Two of these people had direct conversations with me about it; two were sitting right next to us at a breakfast at Unifieds, and we very clearly heard their entire conversation.) That said, every coaching person/company discussed on this forum has nice results for most people, and two of the three aforementioned programs take people who have been coached. I bet the third does, as well, but, since they were from an acting only program, I don’t know much about them. Part of it is that these people (2 of them, anyway; I don’t know about the 2 I overheard) are disgusted by the fact that coaches are needed, and they wish this process hadn’t ballooned like it has. But, that’s not necessarily the fault of the coaches; they are filling a need. To me, it’s like the debate about the chicken and egg. And, when these coaches do their jobs well, they help the students present their most authentic selves and target places that would most likely fit them.

But, yes, people will say to stay off CC or not get a coach or make sure your auditioner stays off the auditioners’ FB page… You know what? I absolutely needed CC, and I’m really glad D had a national coach. In fact, I wish we had hired her earlier. (We didn’t hire her until August/September of D’s senior year.)

And, yes, now the word is out to bring focus to one’s face by wearing solids and avoiding obvious patterns, make girls’ legs look long (thus the nude heels–although my D ended up going with either character shoes or blue shoes after not feeling as comfortable in the nude ones, which was supposedly a big no no), avoid jewelry or scarves that distract, etc., and so, of course, everyone now auditioning for MT tends to look the same! (It doesn’t seem to be the same for acting only auditioners.) I’ve read this advice from programs themselves and in coaching materials. Again, what came first: the chicken or the egg? In this case, it appears that some programs advised this, coaches learned it and advised it, and then it became universal to anyone who has any knowledge of this process. If the programs don’t like it, it seems they have the power to fix it. I bet they could effectively get the word out in one audition season. I’m not saying they would want to. The reasons for dressing like that are, IMO, valid; it does help bring focus on one’s face and own physical self. It is difficult to stand out among others with those strict parameters, though; my D searched for months before she found a dress she thought simultaneously satisfied those guidelines and showed her individual personality. (And, she’s a very picky shopper, which made the hunt take even longer, I’m sure.)

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My son started off the audition season in khakis, a solid-color buttondown, and dress shoes. He quickly realized there were other boys dressed exactly like him. They even joked about it, especially when their dance shirts matched, too. From there, he switched it up a bit and went to a somewhat dressy version of his usual look–dark jeans, boots, and a lightly patterned shirt. He also changed both his audition songs–one after prescreens and the other on the first day of Unifieds. My feeling was that the dress changes didn’t matter a bit to the auditors–but they made him feel more “himself”. We saw lots of khaki-solid color-shirt combos at Unifieds…

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Agree with so much of what has been said! We really will never know what made the difference in certain auditions. I have some hunches, but who knows. To clarify, in the UMich info session, he warned that there was a lot of misinformation and overanalyzing, really thought the seniors should go home after auditions and be seniors. So true, but this is such an unusual journey, that for most of our kids that is easier said than done. We still don’t know where she is going, on April 7th. LOL.

I had only been on this site a handful of times prior to d’s first audition in January. Having had all this knowledge in the beginning, it might have altered the path. As parents, we can second guess this all day long, but in our case the lack of knowledge might have made the path a little clearer for her. I will post the full story soon, we are close to a decision here:)!!!

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If our D was “too coached” it would not have been from our national coach. The national coach simply helped choose appropriate material, went through her monologues twice with her, and helped make a list of schools. Oh, and she went through a couple of songs as well. After the material was selected, nearly all of the coaching came from her local “team”, so to speak.

Regarding clothing options, the national coach did recommend bright solid color dresses for the girls, with simple lines. Of course, if you chose to wear something different, she wouldn’t chase you down. To me, it made sense and it helped narrow the choices. My D wore a red sleeveless dress with black heels. I did see some poor choices on the audition trail–a young woman beautifully dressed with so many layers, including a gorgeous scarf, that the auditors probably looked at her clothing more than they looked at her. This was the exception, of course, not the rule.

Working with a national coach is very much a personal choice. For us, it made clear the path and so was worth every penny. My D attends a public, non-PA high school. She knows of two others from her high school who pursued a BFA in MT, and that was last year, and a handful who pursued BFAs in VP. She had absolutely no help from anyone in her high school, except for the academic recommendations, and the solid academics overall. In preparing her audition package and getting her head in the game, D relied entirely on her voice teacher, a monologue coach, her national audition coach, and her own gut instincts.

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To read-or-not-to-read CC? I met several families at Unifieds who had not read CC–some of their daughters had applied to only six or eight schools, which I think is risky. Often, five out of six were big-name schools, with one in-state back-up. I bit my tongue rather than offer unwanted advise, but I do think these families could have benefited with the excellent resource that CC has become. Sure, take some of it with a pinch of salt, but it really helps to read the same basic advise from expert parents like @soozievt, @toowonderful, @emsdad, @halflokum, and many more. If nothing else, pay attention to advise on list selection, safety schools, and financial matches. Frankly, I think it is a bit disingenuous of schools to warn parents off CC–what have they got to lose? Oh, maybe fat tuition checks at schools that offer virtually no scholarships. …

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We didn’t use a coach, but we did several summer programs. I think a coach would have been helpful. Our result was two BFA programs in MT.

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D said she wished she had a coach for reasons listed in other posts. Material selection, help, school fit.

I would have liked to have an outside opinion so that every suggestion didn’t come from me, sometimes very unpopular but necessary suggestions. A prophet gets little respect in her own home!
Yes, it’s expensive. But D only had a voice teacher so we could have used the extra help.

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@momma2a - I think the word coach is misleading. The coach we used did more advising than “coaching”. Of course she did help with monologue prep. That included in depth character analysis, discussion of different plays and playwrights, etc…that really connected with each student before selecting pieces and cuts. They also offered lots of helpful advice in addition to critiquing the actual monologue presentation. Because it was such a personal approach, there was never anything robotic or similar about her students. The coach recommended the song coach - so song presentation was advised by a different person and there was a choice of song coaches. So again, any sameness in one organization’s students I think is more perception than reality. Each student is coached individually, given material that suits their talents and personality, and is advised based on their personal situation. There is no one size fits all so students coming out of coaching should only be a better version of themselves, not a copy cat of anyone else.

As far as dress, the advice to wear solid color dresses with nude heels is not specific to one coach. And I believe the criticism of that look is much ado about nothing. In fact, If you google videos of college freshman showcases, you will see students at CCM, Indiana, Ball State, Montclair, Western Michigan and many others wearing exactly that. If that is what the schools want their freshman to wear in showcase, I would think it is a perfectly reasonable look for college auditions IF it is something the auditioner is comfortable wearing. It keeps the attire simple and puts the focus on their talents. If you want to wear something else more unique, have at it. But I don’t understand all the criticism about those who choose to dress simply. Wear what makes you comfortable and let others wear what makes them comfortable.

One last thing about coaching - because I do think there is a wrong impression of what coaching entails - for us, it was the advice we got about schools that fit our child’s talents, wants and needs along with our budget that was invaluable. We hadn’t heard of most of these places. And the personal consultations along the way were great. The ability for D to dissect what happened and what was said in the audition room was so helpful. Was it positive? Do they say that to everyone? Coaches with years of experience are able to give some insights into how to take what was said and done in the audition room based on their past students’ experiences (not because they have some sort of insider knowledge with the decision makers). And ultimately a coach was someone who could assist in analyzing all the choices on the table when it was decision making time.

A good coach makes sure each student shines in their own way with their entire package (songs, monologues, dress, resume, ability to answer questions in the room) . Students should not look or sound like anyone but themselves. And the goal of coaching is not perfection. It is to present what talents you have presently in their best possible light. They are not teaching you new techniques. Kids with coaches have imperfections and plenty of room for improvement too! They too are hoping the auditors spot their potential. They are not perfect nor do they strive to be. They have just worked a coach to hopefully show what talents they do have off to the best of their current abilities.

To have a coach or not is a completely personal decision. Ultimately, for us, knowing they were there to help guide us through this crazy process and offer advice was money very well spent.

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Perhaps it would be better to call the coaches “advisors” instead. Coaching has a negative connotation since you envision someone “coaching” your kid on what to say and how to act and what to wear, etc. Advising may be a better choice of words. Providing guidance and information etc. helping select material after the student has presented some choices etc. as for the dressing thing, I think you need to wear a basic outfit. Perhaps add a small item that shows a bit of your style or personality. My D is very fashion oriented & leans toward a preppy conservative look, so she’s always looked appropriate and put together . I don’t have any issues with college audition dressing as I know she’ll have that covered. I think a nice basic dress is fine with perhaps a statement necklace to make you stand out a bit. I think even pants and a nice top is fine. Shoes I think basic is better and no high high heels. No character shoes either. At SETC I saw tons of these & I think they aren’t in the right venue. They’re for a show and you’re not in a show when you’re auditioning. I will say I saw a lot of kids in jeans and sweatshirts which I thought was not appropriate.
As the OP in this post I would say we are going to probably consult someone who is well versed in this process but not hire a national coaching company. I think that will be sufficient.

The coaching thing will always be controversial because to be honest it’s annoying that it has to be that way and that parents feel they need to have this person on board or they’re short changing their kid. And it is expensive regardless. Yes I know it’s the same as a summer program but a lot of kids can’t afford those either & don’t qualify for the scholarships offered. We jokingly refer to musical theatre (MT) in our house as “money taker” as it truly is. I know at my D’s school the other day I was asked by a teacher how much the summer intensive was that we were looking into . I felt all eyes on me and quietly said the price ( and ours is considered cheap in comparison to some that are $3-$4000) and it was like crickets in there. I mean we are using money from a relatives gift for it so I didn’t want them to think I was some wealthy individual but it was awkward & I know a lot of kids there that this would be way out of their option. Like WAY out. Coaches too.

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Hi! While I absolutely see the benefit of having an audition coach, I did all of my auditions without one, because I simply couldn’t pay for travel, application fees, etc. PLUS the cost of a coach. I worked mainly with my voice teacher, and I had some friends who are in BFA MT programs give me their opinions on material, but I was on my own other than that, and I’ve been accepted to 7 MT programs! If you’re doing this without a coach, I would recommend picking material that you love and staying organized, because that will keep you sane throughout this process. Best of luck!!!

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@vvnstar - I agree that there is nothing wrong with the idea simple lines (don’t distract), strong color (looks good with skin tone), and nude shoes (make legs longer). It’s a solid choice, if you look at showcases etc you will see it often, and you will see a variation on that look at open auditions too. (reminds me of the “climbing uphill” scene in “Last 5 Years”) The girls I were referring to were MUCH more uniform than that. Several of them had the SAME dress in differing shades, and they all had the same hairstyle (half up- curled, like something you would see at a homecoming dance) and makeup. They looked like a posse - and there were easily 30 of them. Kinda freaked me out

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Do you know any good coaches? I am not very good at googling I guess, because I am not finding any.

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@theaterwork Love MT/Money Taker! hehe

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I know a girl who was accepted to CMU who wore all black, pants and shirt, and sneakers, with her bangs held back with a barrette on top of her head. It suited her. I know of a boy who got into Juilliard who auditioned in jeans. In both cases, they were pursuing Acting, not MT, but both got into top programs. Regarding heels, my D wore HIGH ones and she wore them very well. She rehearsed her music and monologues in them and knew she could mange well wearing them. She took them off in her CMU audition for her monologues. She was priority wait listed there and was accepted to other programs. I think it’s important to know yourself and go with who you are … To a point. You don’t want your wardrobe choices to be a distraction. You want the auditors to be captivated with your performance and not wondering about your clothing choices. It’s really common sense.

And regarding @theaterwork’s comment about the cost of a national coach, we chose to hire the coach and not spend that same amount of money, or more, on college visits and on-campus auditions. We also stayed in the less-expensive rooms in the Palmer House and brought snacks from home (we drove). I know of another girl who lives in Eastern Ohio who took the Mega-Bus to Chicago Unifieds for her auditions and squeezed in as many auditions as she could in two days to save money. She used the same coach as D. Like the discussions about colleges, it’s about what you feel your D or S needs and what financially makes sense for your family. It’s about YOUR priorities.

Finally, I echo @vvnstar’s sentiments. I think we used the same college audition coach.