No more college dreams...

Parents Forum
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<p>I feel very reluctant posting this, but things like this affect me very deeply.</p>

<p>Yesterday, after school, a group of four students from my son's high school were driving home. Just a few hundred yards from my house the driver went around a curve and lost control of the car. The small Neon collided with a Suburban. One girl died immediately and another girl was airlifted to the hospital and is barely hanging on to life. The two boys in the car had lesser injuries.</p>

<p>I cannot imagine getting a phone call saying that your teen has died...</p>

<p>Unlike the last fatal car crash in our school, I did not know any of these kids. But I still can't get that image of a phone call out of my mind. On the news last night, they had some statistics on young fatalities and it was overwhelming. </p>

<p>Coincidentally, we had a parent's organization meeting last night and I was impressed by how the school was prepared and was gearing up to handle this when today's classes begin. An entire plan of action had been put into place. This preparedness might be seen as good, but then you realize that the reason they ARE prepared is because they've faced it before - several times before.</p>

<p>Please do all you can to make your kids as safe as they can possibly be. My son has never understood why we don't in general allow him to be a passenger when another teen is driving (yet we trust HIS driving). Maybe this is a little overprotective, but I can't help it.</p>

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<p>I feel really sorry about the incident.
Pray for peace.</p>

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<p>Every parent feels the way you do, even if we don't so eloquently state it. It should make us stop in our tracks and do what we can for those directly affected, and keep in mind that ALL the other things - getting cut from a sports team, not making the score you want on SAT, getting deferred/rejected from dream school, even breaking up with gf or bf - simply pale in comparison. Life can change in an instant and we need to remember to be grateful for what we do have.</p>

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<p>Many states are changing driving license regs to dissallow people under 19 from driving with passengers also under 19 without an adult in the car. The stats have shown marked reductions in fatalities suffered by teen drivers.</p>

<p>As you may remember from high school days, a car full of friends can be very distracting.</p>

<p>This may be a good time for Colorado to look at this issue.</p>

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<p>Colorado does have graduated driving regs for teens, but the driver was above the age of the restriction for peer passengers.</p>

<p>I said that I was reluctant about posting this. First, it is off-topic, and a depressing topic at that. Second, and this is the worst part: It's not uncommon. So many of us parents could post similar stories, and it happens here much too often. But it is such a powerful reminder to hug kids and instill the concept that all of our nagging about driving is there for a reason. I know my son hates to be driving when I'm in the car because I'm constantly telling him that he's going too fast.</p>

<p>One statistic that I saw was for Colorado in 2002: 77% of the teen fatalities were NOT wearing seat belts!!! Huh??? In 2003, that dropped to 57% - quite a lot of progress. But most teens I know would NEVER drive in a car without buckling up.</p>

<p>Last year, my wife and I bought a new car. Originally it was to replace my wife's car, but it quickly became my son's car. Why? Just because it was safer than any other vehicle we had. It had driver and passenger air bags as well as side impact air bags for both front and back seat passengers. It also had MUCH better visibility than the pick-up truck he was driving before.</p>

<p>We got a lot of grief from some other parents about letting our son have the new car while we rode around in two vehicles with 225,OOO miles and 145,000 miles on them. But the peace of mind was worth it. And of course my son thinks it's GREAT!!</p>

<p>I see so many parents handing down the oldest car to the kid. I don't think that's a good idea.</p>

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<p>Dig, I'm so sorry. When things like that happen they are so shocking. Even if we don't know the children involved, it still feels like a punch in the parental stomach.</p>

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<p>I, too, am saddened by this. What a tragedy. Such news also impacts our teens- their own perceived immortality is threatened. A former classmate of my son's was the boy who died at CU-Boulder in September in the fraternity hazing incident. My son was affected more than I would have predicted. When a peer suddenly loses his or her life, it is very hard to comprehend. Of course, for parents the fear of losing a child is the greatest one we face.<br>
K.</p>

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<p>My heartfelt sympathy goes out to the parents, peers, and community of this tragedy. It only takes one bad decision, one moment, to change lives forever. My daughter's high school has suffered the loss of 4 very bright young people in less 4 years (2 this year)...all by automobile accidents. Her school is also very prepared to handle these situations...a sad result of repeated tragedies. I can't help but thinking each time that maybe this time they will learn, but alas...teens seem to think they are invincible (as we did when we were that age). I give my d the safe driving speech every time she walks out the door...to her chagrin, but at least it makes me rest a little easier. A tragedy like this does make you think that all of the rest we deal with is so insignificant.</p>

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<p>Dig, I'm so sorry for you and your school community. Just know that, today, you are surrounded by the considerable compassion and warmth of the parents in this online community. ::::slugghuggz:::</p>

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<p>Digmedia, yes, this is very very very tragic and that call is the unfathomable call that will change the parents' lives forever. My heart breaks for them. </p>

<p>Your post is kinda good timing, though tragic. My second child got her license YESTERDAY. Today is the first day she was allowed to drive alone, though only to and from school (will get home at 7 PM in the dark though), but it is ten minutes away. I have driven WITH her many times now with the permit and frankly, I am a nervous wreck when we do so and I am very nervous about her driving. I have likely given the lecture about how one minor mistake or error in judgement (like those kids likely driving too fast on a curve....one of the many examples I have given her), can cause death or something else pretty bad in a split second. It does not take much. You can put your loving care into every detail of their lives (college admissions process included) and it can be snuffed out in an instance of poor driving judgement or even a mistake beyond their actual control (another driver, etc). </p>

<p>I am not happy that my D got her license at this time of year because most of her ECs end in the dark and also long distances on rural roads are involved and I don't want her to do that alone until she has done it alone in the daylight many times. Further, we have wintry weather here and it can change while she is at her EC activity. My other D got her license in late August the year she was 16 and that gave her more light and better weather to start her driving "career". Since my D does not get home til 11 tomorrow night from her activities, she will not be driving. She begged to just drive to school today being her first day so we let her but I was a bit reluctant because there is a tiny bit of snow on the roads this AM. I told her she had to call when she got to school before going into Jazz Band and if she broke that trust, no driving for a week. She is off on the wrong foot...she did not call. I am not happy. </p>

<p>In Vermont, the law came out about two or three years ago that when you get your license at 16, the first six months you cannot drive others (like friends, etc.) without an adult over 25 in the car and I think this rule makes perfect sense. Get used to driving without the many distractions of friends in the car, first. I can't tell you how many parents do not make their kids follow this law and I am dumbfounded. First, it is the law and if caught, their license gets taken away but second, it makes good sense and what are you teaching kids by breaking this rule? My D's best friend got her license a couple months ago (her parents made her wait six months to get it after being eligible til she brought up her grades.....so on one hand were strict) but recently, when my D was supposed to go see a local show with this friend, she told me the friend's parents would drive since the friend by law cannot drive other kids yet. So, we dropped her at friend's house earlier for dinner. I went out to dinner with my hubby and ran into said friend's parents at the same restaurant and I was like, so are you guys going home now to pick up the kids to take them to the show and they were like, no, M. will just drive them down to the theater (about 2 1/2 miles) and I am like, she doesn't have that kind of license, right? And they were like, yeah but it is not far, and I am like, sorry, she can't go, we'll take her ourselves. I got on the phone and called that house and luckily my D said, I was just gonna call you because M's parents are not driving like I thought and I know you won't let me ride with her. She was absolutely right. Even my D is surprised her parents let her drive other kids (much farther now too) and on the other hand made her wait to get a license due to her grades. Also, even with kids who have the kind of license that lets you drive others, I do not always let her ride with them depending who it is, how far, the conditions, etc. I may be strict but I can't take that chance. Last night, was a case in point because after my D got her license in a particular city 25 miles from home, she had ballet class and that was followed by a rehearsal of her show (Broadway revue) that she was asked to put on this weekend in that same city and she asked if a cast member, who is 18 and lives in our town, could bring her home and I said no because it was calling for snow and while it was mostly a light dusting at that point, I stayed for the whole night and brought her home myself. I just cannot take these chances though at some point must let go. Believe me, the fact that my D did not call from school this AM when she knew this meant something to me, will not be good for her and she can't give any excuse she wants but I am not playing with life and death matters and I surely will tell her of your post. </p>

<p>I hate that such a terrible tragedy happened in your neck of the woods but I think your posting it is just another lesson to pound away at with our kids who are of this age of new drivers or passengers of new drivers. The risks are so great and I keep mentioning that no matter how much she does not want to hear it. The other day she was making a joke of how her mom, when riding in the car with her, will say "you know, kids can die when they make mistakes driving and they never come back" and she thought that sounded funny (ok, she did a good job mocking me and she is an actress afterall) but it is NO JOKE. She will have her little lecture tonight so thanks for posting it, though I am sorry it took tragedy to have another example to tell her. </p>

<p>Susan</p>

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<p>thanks for posting this, Dig. It's a sobering reminder of how fragile life is. I'm so sorry for your community's loss.</p>

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<p>Oh Digi! I know how you feel with not wanting to post something like that, but feeling so moved and overwhelmend with emotion about it. I am actually looking forward to my S going to live on campus and not having his car to drive everyday. He had a bad accident (totalled his first car, an older Accord wagon-his fault-he walked away unharmed) a month after getting his license. I answer the phone with the "what happened" voice everytime he calls and I know he's out in the car. Yesterday was especially worrisome with all of the snow and ice on the roads. It takes years of experience to learn how to drive on ice and snow - and no 17 year old can do it well, guaranteed. </p>

<p>I'm glad that your school knows how to handle this, but feel sad that they had to learn the hard way.</p>

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<p>This is horrible. My heart goes out to all the families. My children are WAY too young to be learning to drive, but it is something that at times, I dread. I know they will grow and learn to become (hopefully), wiser and more mature. But I cannot yet imagine them hopping in the car & driving away...I hope I will be able to handle it when the time comes.</p>

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<p>Thank goodness for cell phones. When my son first began driving, we had him call every time he left somewhere and every time he arrived. And if he forgot to call, we'd let him have it, sometimes even getting in the car ourselves and showing up where he was with his friends (or date or at school) and saying "Just checking since you didn't call!" He was sufficiently embarrassed that he rarely forgot to call after that. Now that he's 18, we don't do that as much now, but we still wait up for him no matter how late he's supposed to get back. And if he's more than 15 minutes late without calling, he knows he'll be getting a call from us.</p>

<p>On the driving in snow and ice, we gladly paid for a special course that offered a lot of time on their "skid plate" where the instructor would do something to cause the car to go out of control and the student would have to get it back under control. And he continues to proactice that a lot. Just Tuesday, I was down in our little meadow when I saw him coming home from school. He didn't see me watching and as he turned onto our road (which was snow-covered and very icy), he intentionally skidded the car sideways on the ice, then recovered nicely. I went back up to the house and yelled "What were you doing!!" "Just practicing, Dad," he said.</p>

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<p>One reason I like having Wild Child at boarding school is that he isn't driving there. (the trade-off is that he goes into NYC some weekends and is on the loose there) When he was home over Christmas break and driving, I was always nervous. He was good about calling and I could reach him on his cell phone. One night he wasn't in by 12- or 1- 0r 1:30 and I couldn't reach him on his cell. I was in a panic and H was snoring away! I roamed around the house and finally wandered upstairs to S's room. He was sound asleep and the cell was on the charger and on silent! I felt like an idiot. I told him the next morning that he needs to always come in and tell us he is home. He asked me why there were 25 missed calls from me on his cell phone..... Kids....</p>

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<p>I empathize with all of you, as similar tragedies have, unfotunately, occurred around here as well. I actually rest easier with my son at college (without a car) 3000 miles away than I did when he was a high school senior driving all over the place. My daughter drives to school as a high school senior, and the snow we had yesterday afternoon in the Philadelphia area made me extremely nervous. I think it made her nervous too, as she did not give me an argument when I told her I would drive her when she needed to go out last night!</p>

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<p>Dig, I am so sorry. At S's school a similar car accident last summer claimed three of the four boys in the car.</p>

<p>S must be the only male California teenager who hates driving. He drives to school and back and to his community service. That's it. I think that's why he considered colleges only in cities with great public transportation.</p>

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<p>
[quote]
soozievt writes: I have likely given the lecture about how one minor mistake or error in judgement (like those kids likely driving too fast on a curve....one of the many examples I have given her), can cause death or something else pretty bad in a split second.

[/quote]
Maybe I'm mis-reading your post, but I think you might want to approach this slightly differently. While I understand and share your concern for safety, if you've emphasized "minor mistake or error in judgement" this may actually make driving worse rather than better. </p>

<p>Malcolm Gladwell had an interesting article in the New Yorker a few years back talking about choking and panicking (the 2 are different). In choking, a performer stops acting from "muscle memory" and instead deliberately thinks thru each step. This processing is nowhere near as fast or smooth as relying on learned patterns. For example, think about throwing a ball; you just pick it up and do it. Now try to think thru the steps (bring back the arm, go forward, accelerate the arm, etc) and the motion is nowhere near as smooth or accurate. The article is at <a href="http://www.gladwell.com/2000/2000_08_21_a_choking.htm%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://www.gladwell.com/2000/2000_08_21_a_choking.htm&lt;/a>, BTW.</p>

<p>Where this all ties into driving and your post is that if a teenage driver becomes terrified that at any instant some mistake can have dreadful consequences, they are nervous and constantly monitoring every action. Instead of driving smoothly they become erratic and in effect worse drivers. Its better to be attentive but accelerate, brake, and turn under muscle memory. And practice, perhaps accompanied by an experienced older driver, helps build this muscle memory.</p>

<p>What we do need to emphasize, over and over, is to avoid getting in dangerous situations in the first place. Driving after a few drinks, driving fast down roads, zooming around curves for the thrill of the "g" force, driving when tired because home is "almost here", these are dangerous situations where any problem quickly surpasses the ability of a teen driver to handle. The key to safe driving is to avoid being in these situations in the first place, and this is where we need to fight against kids belief they are immortal.</p>

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<p>With my 18 year old, from the day she got her license on her sixteenth birthday, she was to call as she left the location so we knew how long to expect her and same with when she arrived at a destination. She faithfully did that every single time. Even then I was nervous but she was mucho responsible. Once when she did not call from her piano lesson and a lot of time went by, I called the piano teacher's house and nobody answered and I called my D's cell and nobody answered and so I went into panic mode. Well, that 45 min. or so was a living hell for me even though I KNOW this piano teacher often goes WAY over the allotted one hour lesson time and so it is not far fetched that my kids may be at her house a very long time but this time was just very very long and nobody was answering. One big problem where we live is that cell phones do NOT work a lot of the time due to the rural nature, plus the mountains. Most of her route it did not work and in fact, it does not work near our high school either or the entire route to our dance studio 25 miles away. My daughter did stop to use her cell where she could get it to work when she realized she had not called from the piano teacher's house and that was the end of that worry, but that is how I can get. Same with once when I let my younger D ride with older kids who drove and she did not show up when she was supposed to and knew I was waiting to take her to ballet and it made no logical sense to me and I was a nervous wreck. Turns out the kids she rode with wanted to drop another kid off first (very spread out where we live) and my D should have said, I need to call my mom because she will worry as she expects me a certain time or else drop me off in the village so I can have her pick me up for dance but she did not think that way and believe me, that was not a nice night here. I never took her to dance, was too late and I had been through the ringer with worry and it aged me. </p>

<p>Now this second child is going to get the whole, you have to call when you arrive and leave lecture but today was the first day and with the older one, she did not have to call when she arrived AT school but for everything else she did. This being the first day and a little snowy on the roads, I insisted on a call and I can't believe she started off on the wrong foot. I figure she is truly at school and my hubby drove that route on his way to work shortly thereafter and it is callbacks for the musical right now, and I am sure she has to be there so I did not fret with worry, but it is typical of her and this is gonna be a big problem for me if we don't get this ironed out. Too much for me and too many gray hairs will grow, as if the process were not nerve wracking enough even if they do call. The lack of cell phone service adds to the worries. Add in winter weather on rural dark roads, another. </p>

<p>Now that my older one is in college, of course she does not call with every move she makes and I don't want her to because this is the "break" in becoming an adult. However, when she came home for vacation, and drove places here, she went back to the calling on arrivals and departures out of respect for me. One night she went to a movie about 30 miles away and did not call when she arrived and I got a little worried but I also envisioned a big reunion scene with high school friends meeting up at the theater and that she had gotten out of the routine of calling mom. Indeed she was extremely apologetic when she called after the movie to head home when she realized she did not call when she had arrived and mentioned that she had fallen out of sync of that routine at college. She is now away with her ski team in NH for a month and has a car there and has called me each time she got to NH or left it and it really helps. I gotta get the second child up to speed. Just not the same in this one way as her sister. It only adds to my nervousness about the whole driving deal.</p>

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<p>Concerning use of cellphones...
My d also has always been instructed to call me when she arrives at/leaves a particular location (to ease my mind), and she has always done so very responsibly. HOWEVER, that same cellphone could have cost her her life. I have always told her NOT to talk on the phone (or even to answer it) while she is driving. One morning on her way to school this year, however, her phone rang and as she reached down (it was on the seat) to pick it up, she took her eyes off the road for only a second. When she looked up, she had run off the shoulder of the road and a dump truck was broken down right in her path. She swerved to miss it, but hit it anyway, veered across two lanes of traffic (with airbags deployed) and landed in a field facing the opposite direction. Thankfully, she was fine...the car was totaled though. How many times did I tell her not to use the cellphone while driving? As your child gains more confidence in driving he/she often "thinks" he/she is capable of doing such things and is not as cautious as in the beginning. I still want my d to have the cell phone for emergencies, but it sure makes you think!</p>