Norcalguy's Residency Application Process

<p>Update:</p>

<ol>
<li><p>Signed up for ERAS. Haven’t filled out much of it yet but it looks similar to the AMCAS in format. Won’t certify the application till Sept.-Oct. so no rush there.</p></li>
<li><p>Perfected a rough draft of my personal statement to send to my reviewer. It’s actually the third entirely different version of the personal statement I had written. The consensus seems to be that, unless you’re an ultra weak applicant or have some superb life experience, to keep the personal statement as vanilla as possible. Mine is definitely vanilla.</p></li>
<li><p>Started trying to come up with a list of radiology programs to apply to. Will likely apply to around 40 programs. The thinking seems to be that if you can rank 8-10 programs (meaning that you’ve interviewed at at least that many programs), you are virtually guaranteed to match based on the computer algorithm. Even with the ability to apply to 40 programs, it’s still pretty daunting to pick programs. My parents want me back in CA although I don’t have too much of a shot at academic programs out there and am probably even a marginal candidate for community programs. I’m not super picky about location so I might try my hand at some good programs in less desirable places (Henry Ford in Detroit, UAB, University of Indiana, Wisconsin programs, etc.). Won’t bother with the Mass Gen, JHU, Stanford’s of the world.</p></li>
</ol>

<p>About #2, what tips have you gotten about writing a personal statement for residency. I’m not to that point yet, but its seems like it would be hard to write a PS for the specialties that laymen crowd don’t associate with being the typical doc like radiology, pathology, and anesthesiology.</p>

<p>Generally, in a PS, you’ll want to convey why you want to enter into that specialty, what you look for in a residency program, and what your career goals are in that specialty. I didn’t put a lot of my CV stuff in my PS since my qualifications are on the app already. Typically, the PS is only around 4 or so paragraphs, 3/4 of a page long.</p>

<p>2 days into my radiology rotation, loving it so far. Attending #1 comes in at 2pm and promptly takes a 2 hour lunch. Attending #2 comes in at 4pm and stays till 6 pm. Residents were all gone by 4pm so I hung out with attending #2 for 2 hours. It’s a lot busier in private practice (and you earn a ton of money) but nothing can beat the hours of academic radiology. Not to mention what we’re doing from a diagnostic and therapeutic radiology standpoint is pretty amazing and rapidly evolving. All my textbook knowledge is usually answered by “we don’t do that anymore.”</p>

<p>

That sounds …not so bad. First positive news I’ve read. lol. </p>

<p>My kid really hates the application process. Any application process. She’s decent enough at it, and loves the interviews, but truly hates the app itself.</p>

<p>for residency, do you just fill out one app and thats it? no extra stuff like secondaries. im guessing no since you’re applying to 40 programs.</p>

<p>Update:</p>

<p>It’s almost August! Just finished my radiology rotation and loved the nature of the work (although I personally think radiology is pretty boring to watch as a med student). Hopefully, I get honors for this rotation as I’ll need it.</p>

<p>My goal is to have my application turned in sometime in September, definitely before October 1st. Hopefully, all of my letters of rec can get in before then and I won’t have to pester my letter writers too much. </p>

<p>The annoying thing for radiology and some other specialties is the matter of applying for 1 year programs in addition to the main residency. These 1 year programs require their own personal statement (although most people just tweak their radiology PS) and LOR’s. From what I gather, my application is probably strong enough for transition year programs but I will apply to a few 1 year medicine prelim programs as well. In all, I’m probably applying to around 12 or so 1-year programs, all of them either in Northern California or around my current city. Hopefully, I match into a transition year program. I love the variety and flexibility that comes with transition year programs as opposed to the more traditional 1-year medicine prelim programs. </p>

<p>As for radiology programs, I’ll apply to around 45 programs total. I’ve since talked to both my dean as well as some radiologists. I don’t think I’ve ever been so humbled in my life. If I do say so myself, I was a top tier applicant for both college and medical school. It’s definitely tough to be a middle-of-the-road applicant for radiology. I had a chance to see the results of how past applicants (with my stats) from my school have done. I think I was initially pretty correct to say low/mid-tier academic radiology residency for me. </p>

<p>Will be taking Step 2 in October after my medicine sub-I.</p>

<p>I’m really disappointed by this aspect of the process.</p>

<p>What aspect?</p>

<p>This never-ending series of hurdles and applications and interviews. So, during this 1 year, you are already applying for the next program? Sounds like running for the House. You are always campaigning. And then the next? When exactly does the butt-kissing resume-building crap end? lol</p>

<p>I sure hope my kid picks something straight-forward where she just has one combined start to finish program, but knowing her…</p>

<p>And 45 programs? kill me now.</p>

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<p>We’re in complete agreement. I’m a dork in that I love being a student and I love studying medicine. But, it’s unnerving and tiring to be constantly evaluated. There are so many useless things we do as third-year med students for no other reason than to beef up our subjective clinical evaluations. I’m really not a fan of how we are evaluated on third-year rotations. If I always show up on time, do everything with a smile, and am polite to both the doctors, staff, and patients, how do I get a 6/9 on professionalism from one attending and 9/9 from another attending that I had on the same block? I had one attending give me a 6/9 in performance and under “what to improve on” wrote nothing. Maybe it’s just me. I’m sure those who ended up with 5 or 6 honors during third-year would beg to differ.</p>

<p>Here are the average number of apps submitted for various specialities:
Anesthesiology: 22
Derm: 44
Radiology: 40
Family Med: 10
Internal med: 16
Ortho: 46 (the most of any specialty)
Pathology: 16
Peds: 16
Plastic surgery: 26 (deceptive low because there aren’t that many programs to begin with)
Psych: 15
Gen surg: 22</p>

<p>Obviously, the more competitive the specialty, the more programs you have to apply to.</p>

<p>The matching algorithm is really set up to favor the applicant. The computer scans down your list and tries to match you with the highest ranked program possible. Most applicants get somewhere in their top 3-4 choices. Thus, it actually behooves you (if you have the time, money, and energy) to apply to a lot of places and interview as much as possible since you’re likely to get one of the choices high on your rank list. So, I’m going to apply to some reach programs.</p>

<p>Yeah. That part. My kid has always done great on objective measures but…sometimes she doesn’t win the beauty/popularity contest. Sometimes she does, but to have your career opps at this stage determined by one attending who gives you zero feedback…don’t sound right to me. He might have to see how he likes waking up to a horse head in his bed. ;)</p>

<p>My kid doesn’t suffer fools gladly. Has no time for them, actually. She works very hard and expects others to do their part. And she ain’t real shy about telling you about it. That gets her in a wee bit of trouble from time to time.</p>

<p>not surprised at otho having so many apps. its really competitive but understandably so. those guys make bank.</p>

<p>OT: Yeah. Tell me about it. I think I may have bought my orthopedic surgeon a hyundai for his maid this week.</p>

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<p>Even before MS1 is started, somehow I have the feeling my kid may choose one of these specialties which require only 16 in the end. Considering his track record of the “aggressive” scale of his medical school application (he barely blew his horn) maybe his reach is the pathology, which I heard may be quite competitive because of its life-style. I guess he may not allow himself to get so “low” to become the one that requires 10 only. His match may be the IM which requires 16 only – This is just my own wild guess though – judging from his occasional comment: “Can I get an MD but then work as a government employee?” (I think this ignorant parent replied that he might also need a degree in public health for that. I do not know whether my reply made any sense. kind of like “the blind leads the blind”)</p>

<p>Regarding the subjective nature of the 3rd year, I keep suggesting him not to care too much about it, on the ground that, even if he becomes the one which requires 10 applications only, he will still have a “noble” job, and there is no need to “sell his soul” for that HP, etc., as the life is too short for that.</p>

<p>LOL curm–your D sounds like my D. She’s got her daddy’s peculiar sense of humor and his temper. She is a kid who’s most likely to to make the perfect cutting quip if she’s had enough.</p>

<p>And we’ll see how D1 fares. While she’s freely admitted she will likely change her mind, her strongest interests going in are : radiation oncology; interventional radiology: anesthesia and trauma surgery. She’s a bit of odd duck–likes the very intellectual AND the adrenaline rush. (Otherwise she wouldn’t think rock climbing & bungee-jumping are great pastimes)</p>

<p>Example A of the never ending process of applications, interviews and hurdles right here!</p>

<p>My own round 2 with ERAS/the Match is much accelerated compared to NCG’s, I have already submitted my application and am waiting for my last two LoR’s to make their way to the central clearinghouse. Despite lacking a fully complete app, I got my first two interview invites this past week and have one interview completely set up including travel/hotel. That program just so happens to have a greatly informative website and so I spent my time while moonlighting last night falling in love with the place…</p>

<p>During NCG’s Transition year (which have considerably less call than regular IM pre-lim years), he’ll - fingers crossed - already have his radiology program figured, so he won’t have to go through the process again. Fellowship is a different beast…
While the constant evaluation process continues during residency, it should get better. I’m not exactly sure what constitutes a large rads program, but my peds program is quite sizable (especially compared to all the other specialties who take fewer than 10 residents per intern class), but you actually get to know the attendings on a much more significant level, than you do as a student. Youre there working with them multiple times a year for 3 or 4 years instead of 1 or 2 weeks. I’m just one of 24 3rd year peds residents, and there’s also the lack of competition that’s inherent with med school evals. There’s still a fair amount of subjectivity - I personally seem to strike a love-him or leave-him mentality with the neonatologists as I’ve gotten some of my best and worst evals from various attendings despite what I feel is performing the exact same way for all of them - but overall, the evals are more consistent and thoughtful (when they’re done)…</p>

<p>I do feel like things will improve during residency. There’s a lot of work to be done but you don’t feel obligated to do inane tasks simply for the purpose of showing off. In addition, you get more consistent time with attendings. Currently, I only work with attendings for 2 weeks at most (usually limited to a couple of 3 minute presentations each day). So, it is difficult to have to ask for LOR’s from someone you’ve only known for 2 weeks.</p>

<p>I assume the attendings rely on the residents and interns to flesh out the letters or do they actually write it just based on those short interactions?</p>