<p>Vandy's feel is not that far off from most other SEC schools. This obviously is a great thing and was/is the reasoning behind the now defunct "Why Vanderbilt" essay. Best idea is to visit the school. I just read something about a YouTube channel. Really, this site, the admissions site, Vanderbilt internet videos, etc... aren't really going to show much about how you'll fit into a school.</p>
<p>I don't see how it's possible to establish in an objective way how important Greek life is at Vanderbilt. Certainly it's important to Greeks - also maybe to those who love to hate Greek life, and those who choose not to participate but are ambiguous about that decision. But half the female students and 65 percent of the male students are not Greek. Are they all put off by the T-shirts, conversations, events, etc.? And if so, why? There are hundreds of non-Greek organizations and activities at Vanderbilt. I guess I'm saying that Greeks aren't going to dominate campus life at any school unless non-Greeks agree to let them. I'm one of those people who have posted often in the past that I know many happy non-Greek students at Vanderbilt. And I do! </p>
<p>On the harshness of the grading - I think that depends to a great extent on the individual's school, major, and freshman schedule. The average GPA for female freshmen in 2008 was 3.167; for men, 3.153. The overall undergraduate GPA was 3.317, indicating that GPAs do rise appreciably as students learn to manage independent living, core requirements, and the demands of being at an academically challenging institution. </p>
<p>My d would not agree that the required curriculum is particularly extensive - most peer schools have similar ones. A good adviser can make a big difference here, so that the student doesn't sacrifice taking courses of genuine interest just to fulfill the core requirements.</p>
<p>My post may have seemed like the opinions I expressed were exclusively my own, but I know for a fact that many of my peers feel the same way. Mirimom is correct in saying, yes there are different types of people, yes there are people frmo all over with all types of interest, but that doesnt mean vanderbilt is the best school for those types of people. To be honest, if I was an artsy liberal type, I would not want to go to Vandy. Not saying I couldn't be happy at Vanderbilt and find ppl with similar interest but more likely than not I could be HAPPIER somewhere else. </p>
<p>After re reading my post I feel like I'm giving an extremely negative vibe about the school. I do like Vanderbilt, but I just feel like I was misinformed about the social aspects about the school. The academic quality and other academic type features that I heard about before matriculating seem pretty accurate. So when I come on to this board and you have parents, and others (sometimes parents of students who don't REALLY get the social scene) ranting about how ANYONE can be happy at Vanderbilt, and how amazing of a school it really is. I feel like this is very misleading and the true aspects about Vanderbilt's social scene should be recognized by prospective students. Also, to the parents, I do not completely express my true feelings about the school and the social scene to my parents. I am not wallowing around during winter break, so many some of the parents information isn't completely correct. But being a student at this school I think I am giving very accurate information to what the social scene is like. </p>
<p>On the other hand, Vanderbilt is a good school, but I really wouldn't recommend it to everyone. I would have trouble recommending Vandy to a student who I felt wouldnt "fit in' at the school. Prospective students REALLY need to visit Vandy for themselves, and they really need to understand the Greek system at vanderbilt, and how it plays a roll in the social aspects. One of my good guy friends really summed it up when he said "it's really hard to be a guy at vanderbilt and not in a frat."</p>
<p>I have to agree about the core courses/grading not being an issue. As the previous poster said, most other peer institutes have very similar requirements and grading systems. I would assume most kids wanting to attend a top university would have already gone through 4 years of a fairly demanding high school schedule thus are used to a big work-load. Speaking for my own S, he has taken 7 academic classes EVERY year of high school, NO free periods in addition to a bunch of extra-curriculars, SATs, ACTs. etc. I can't imagine he will be overwhelmed by any college schedule. I'm afraid he won't know what to do with all that extra time!</p>
<p>
[quote]
One of my good guy friends really summed it up when he said "it's really hard to be a guy at vanderbilt and not in a frat."
[/quote]
Do 65 percent of the guys find it really hard at Vanderbilt because they're not in a frat? I don't understand this. Are they struggling socially, or just plain unhappy, for 3 years because they aren't in one? Vandy's freshman retention rate is excellent - 97 percent from 2007 to 2008, per the most recent common data set. To me, these numbers (substantial majority of male students not in Greek life; very high freshman retention rate) just don't add up to a Greek scene that dominates all else.</p>
<p>FWIW, I've never said that Vanderbilt is the best possible school for every type of 18 y/o that's out there, and I've never "ranted" about how "ANYONE can be happy at Vanderbilt." I wouldn't say that about Harvard or Oberlin or Michigan or Washington & Lee, either. It is not just a school for preppy rich Christian conservative Republicans, though, as my d's experience attests. </p>
<p>nicole, I'm sure you're reporting your experience at the school accurately. My d is a senior who has had a great experience both socially and academically at Vanderbilt, and really has no reason to misrepresent its social life to me. And I have no reason to misrepresent what she and her friends have shared with me here. Their experiences have apparently been somewhat different from yours. I'm sorry that you feel it's misleading when I indicate "how amazing" a school it really is.</p>
<p>What I meant by using the quote from my friend is that the greek life can affect students in a negative way because it is so pervasive on campus, and a huge social outlet. I think one of the reasons for vandy's high retention rate is that it IS a great school academically. I didn't mean to say that 65% of the guys at Vandy are unhappy, this is obviously not the case. But I think prospective students are not always given an accurate description of the social scene here. Also, a lot of this could be because I am from the North, and didn't really understand how a greek system affects a schools social scene. I literally knew nothing about greek life before I came to Vandy. But I do remember asking people at the school and current students about the impact of the greek life on campus and specifically "can you be happy without going greek." I just feel like a lot of students gave me a sugar coated version of the truth. Most of their responses was, of course, easily! And I think thats a very very superficial answer, and this didnt allow me to fully realize the extent of the greek system at Vandy. So maybe some of my posts do seem a little extreme, but I really just want prospective students (especially ones from the North, who don't know as much about greek life) to know that it is hard to simply ignore the greek life here. I think it is much harder than people make it out to be.</p>
<p>Stop dumping on Nicole07 for expressing her personal experience at HER school. I really appreciate the honesty, it's good to know both sides of a story...then you have the liberty of choosing which perspective to closer associate yourself with in hopes of finding out if a school is right for you. If you don't have both sides you'll never be able to make such a huge decision as which college to attend unless you pay the couple hundred bucks to fly down and visit (which not everyone can afford...especially not now) and it doesn't surprise me that there are varying degrees of honesty when it comes to informing prospective students about a school.
WashU, Yale, GWU, UMich..a wide a variety of schools are not immune to "sugar coating" and I wouldn't expect anything differently of Vandy. It all depends on who you talk to, and I think it's exceedingly myopic to look at numbers and percentages as the sole indicators of the emotions people feel regarding the greek life at Vanderbilt. This 97% percent retention rate is clearly indicative that most of the kids at Vanderbilt are happy enough to stay, but that doesn't mean they love 100% everything about the school, and perhaps the ONE thing they can't stand is the pervasiveness of the greek life. Another thing is that it may not seem SO pervasive to those who are involved in frats/sororities themselves, or to the parents whose children these are.</p>
<p>Anyways, Nicole07, I really appreciate your individual perspective and I think it's a valuable way to assess the varying viewpoints about ONE school so thank you for baring the brunt of most of the responses to my concerns :)</p>
<p>Not going to get into the debate over how pervasive Greek life is because I don't know, but can I ask why being Northern means not knowing things about Greek life? Serious question, since I've lived in the South all my life and know nothing about it beyond the fact that they do silly things for a week to get in and use letters for names (and of course the drinking stories, but I saw plenty of that on TV, not exactly a local source). My high school has a "sorority," half the girls had classes with me, and I STILL don't know anything about the things. What's supposedly different down here than up there? </p>
<p>(Heh, sorry if that sounded like I'm doubting you, it's just curiosity. I'm a little in the dark when if comes to that stuff. I've never even visited a state north of Kentucky. That makes me curious when northerners tell me I'm different. :P)</p>
<p>Can someone please tell me why Greek life has anything to do with Nothern/Southern??? Syracuse, DePauw, Miami Univ in Ohio, Princeton, Union College in NY, Colby in Maine, etc, all have some of the oldest greek organizations in the country. I grew up outside of DC and know lots of people who grew up north of here and I have NEVER met anyone who doesn't know something about the greek system. They are on many, many campuses ALL over the country!! If it is such a big issue, just go to a school that has NO greek life because I'm sure lots of people would say "greek life dominates" on just about any campus that has it. A friend's son attends Cornell and to quote him "I had to join a fraternity to have any type of social life" -- can't get much more north than Ithaca!!</p>
<p>See, that's what I thought. That's why I asked...</p>
<p>See, that's what I thought. That's why I asked...</p>
<p>Edit: Ugh, it double posted. -_-</p>
<p>I think happiness at Greek dominated colleges [when you don't want to go Greek] just depends on your resistance to peer pressure and need to comply to social norms.</p>
<p>It doesn't have anything to do with Northern/Southern in my opinion...I know exactly what sororities and frats are..that's why I asked about there existence at Vandy...couldn't have done that if I didn't know what they were, now could I? </p>
<p>The original purpose of this thread wasn't to get North vs. South or to get greek lovers vs. non greek lovers. It actually, believe it or not, wasn't to get anyone facing off at all! I merely wanted to know what different people had to say about their experience, but some people started commenting on the validity of others' experiences, which is a little ridiculous. </p>
<p>It's fine to have an opinion, I'm interested in hearing them!! (hence my above post in which I said I wanted both sides of the story)..so everyone can calm themselves, take it easy, don't worry, be happy!</p>
<p>I hope my posts didn't sound like I was encouraging a "vs," I was just curious as well. :)</p>
<p>"No one would deny that there may be individual students here and there who are outside the Greek scene and do not drink and are happy, but my d. says they are rare and invisible."</p>
<p>My goodness, mirimom. I had no idea my daughter was so ... unimportant. Maybe if I don't tell her, she'll continue on being ignorant and happy, so obviously clueless about her lack of relevance on Vandy's campus.</p>
<p>"No one would deny that there may be individual students here and there who are outside the Greek scene and do not drink and are happy, but my d. says they are rare and invisible."</p>
<p>How are they invisible? How can you tell just by looking at people that they don't drink and are happy? </p>
<p>I'm proud of the fact that I'm straight edge [no smoking, drinking, drugs]. I wear my sXe shirt and sometimes put the black X's on my hands (call me lame, but I don't care). I certainly make my lifestyle evident to those who know what the X's and phrase straight edge means. I'm certainly not invisible. You make it seem like the people who don't drink are shy and aren't leadership material. But I believe the opposite is true. The kids who have the sense to not screw themselves up and to not conform to other's drinking habits are the ones with a strong head on their shoulders.</p>
<p>I guess I'm really old...at the fraternity parties I used to go to in college, a black X on your hand meant that your ID had been checked and you were cleared to drink.
I'm guessing from your comments that there must be some different meaning now!</p>
<p>Let me propose something novel: If a student likes being at Vandy, that student will be happy. Those who presume to see inside another student --- difficult, by the way, considering that some students are apparently invisible --- might do well to understand that their presumptions are just that.</p>
<p>No school is perfect for all students. Visit. If you like it, consider attending. If you don't like it, don't attend. It's that simple. </p>
<p>As for academics, that is also a personal thing. Some like the AXLE requirements, others do not. Some are happy with the array of courses available, others would prefer different choices. If you like what Vandy offers, great. If not, there are schools that offer other options. If you want easy A's, there are schools that are more lenient in grading.</p>
<p>"I guess I'm really old...at the fraternity parties I used to go to in college, a black X on your hand meant that your ID had been checked and you were cleared to drink.
I'm guessing from your comments that there must be some different meaning now!"</p>
<p>Now, in regarding going to clubs, it means that you are 18 [therefore allowed to enter the club] but are not yet 21 (so no drinking).</p>
<p>As for kelsmom, I absolutely agree with what you just said. That's why Vandy is my top choice school: 1) I basically love every subject so taking various core requirements is something I'm looking forward to. 2) The education you get there is absolutely wonderful (ok, so your GPA may suffer... but you might learn more than if you were a 4.0 at a less academically-savvy school. From this, you would do better on your MCATs/PCATS/GRE/etc. than the other 4.0 non-Vandy student) 3) The obvious reasons</p>
<p>For the students considering Vandy, I would encourage you to really look at the academic offerings. AXLE requirements cannot be fulfilled with AP courses, no matter how high you score. You will have to take at least one writing course, no matter how high your AP scores or even if you took 6 English courses at another college. Look at the courses required and offered within your major. Look at courses in other majors (since many students change their majors from what they originally thought they wanted). Vandy is heavier on writing than some schools, so realize that writing well is necessary. There ARE TA's and grad graders in some courses at Vandy, so you need to know that coming in. </p>
<p>When we went to college, my husband & I knew what we wanted to do. We attended a school that was very focused on technical courses; AXLE would have been torture for us. As for grades ... many of our courses were graded on a true curve, and many students, most of whom were A students in high school, flunked at least one class. I can fully understand avoiding a school like Vandy if it's not for you. But make sure you decide it's not for you for the right reasons ... not because some students who have different interests than you have are telling you that you won't like it.</p>