<p>Hi, you may recall me earlier asking your opinion on Northwestern v Penn, today i received word that I'd also gotten into Penn (again, as an international transfer student coming from New Zealand). Thinking i had no shot at Penn I'd pretty much forgotten I'd even applied.</p>
<p>Based on the facts that i want to study mainly Political Science and Economics, and that I'm interested in a relatively traditional campus lifestyle, what do you guys think?</p>
<p>I'd go to Penn unless you really like Northwestern.</p>
<p>USN graduate ranking:</p>
<p>Economics:
NU: 8th
Penn: 9th</p>
<p>Poli Sci:
NU: 21st
Penn: 29th</p>
<p>So even though Penn may be a bit more well-known in general, Northwestern appears to be at least on par, if not better, academically in the two fields you are interested. I'd definitely pick based on other factors rather than solely on the small difference in reputation. But have "traditional campus lifestyle", but NU has nicer surroundings (feel safe, clean, and not run-down).</p>
<p>run down? That a comment on the city or on the actual campus itself?</p>
<p>The city...Coming from clean places like New Zealand, you may be bothered by it even more. ;) I am biased to NU but I don't think I am biased to say Philly is a rather poor and dirty city. If you can, come to visit both places and compare for yourself.</p>
<p>I'd have to disagree. Philadelphia has a large and vibrant core that compares favorably to Chicago. However, I think it is fair to say that NU's campus is cleaner and safer than Penn's. NU has a far more traditional college campus.</p>
<p>rollins, while thats definitely true about Philaedlphia, two things: First, Penn is in the heart of West Philadelphia, and that is definitely NOT the nice core you refer to. And second, Philadelphia's just not on the same scale as Chicago. It's more comparable in size to Boston.</p>
<p>Arbiter213 - For the most part I agree with you. Although I would add that Philadelphia while noticeably smaller than Chicago is by about the same measure larger than Boston. West Philly around Penn has improved somewhat over the years, but yes I would agree that it is not nearly as gentrified as Center City. On the other hand many Penn students live in Center City and commute the short distance over to Penn. This of course would not provide the traditional college experience that Luke36 seems to be interested in.</p>
<p>Of course don't get me wrong. One of my siblings went to Penn and my father is a from Philly and a Wharton grad- I like Penn quite a lot. My question to the OP:</p>
<p>Do you want to study a blend of those topics? Have you looked at the PPE program at Penn? It comes down to taste, obviously, since both schools are of roughly the same calibur. Do you like sports culture? If so, NU will likely be more fulfilling.</p>
<p>I'm not so much worried about being in a city or not. What i guess I'm more specifically concerned with is whether or not I'm liable to wind up isolated at Penn, or whether it will be relatively easy to get involved in the community and be socially engaged.</p>
<p>I live in Philadelphia and work at Penn and my D goes to Northwestern so I know both schools fairly well.</p>
<p>From a social perspective, Penn is likely to be a harder transition for a transfer student. Most Penn students move off campus after freshman year; on the weekends, they are less oriented towards university events and more oriented to doing things in Philly. Philadelphia is has a lot to offer 20-somethings but that's the city - not Penn - and by sophomore or junior year, most students have their friends/activities/routine established.</p>
<p>Also, since a high percentage of students are from the region from Washington, DC-Boston, a lot of students visit friends at other colleges or even run home for a weekend - especially if they are from New York. The availability of affordable mass transit makes it easy to go to other cities on the weekends.</p>
<p>Northwestern's proximity to Chicago makes Chicago a great resource. Chicago is a fantastic city and only 20 or so minutes away. But Northwestern is not in the city. And most students who live off-campus aren't commuting from Chicago. They live right in Evanston which is more of a suburban small-town. So, the focus is more on the university.</p>
<p>Also, Northwestern makes a little more of an effort for transfer students in terms of organized activities at the beginning of the year. The other thing you may find is a slightly friendlier atmosphere at Northwestern. What some call "Midwestern Pride." There are plenty of smart, edgy students but it's ok to be smart and be nice. Penn is a little more competitive and brittle.
(Sweeping generalizations but I know a lot of students.)</p>
<p>is this a question? Penn hands down. it doesnt matter if its ranked one spot lower for economics, assuming youre going into business, firms recruit much more heavily from Penn, and the east coast is where you wanna be. if youre going into law, its the same deal-- a 3.7 from Penn is worth a lot more than a 3.7 from Northwestern. </p>
<p>i got into NU under ED (im a rising junior so mind you, like most peopel with 2 years under their belt at NU im a little disillusioned), and i really cant imagine anyone at NU who isnt in MMSS or HPME or some other rigorous program that turned down a top ivy like Penn for Northwestern. the only ivies you should not pick over NU are cornell and brown, thats about it.</p>
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is this a question? Penn hands down. it doesnt matter if its ranked one spot lower for economics, assuming youre going into business, firms recruit much more heavily from Penn, and the east coast is where you wanna be.
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<p>Why is the East Coast necessarily where you wanna be? People are different, blazin hazin. Not everyone has the same goals out of life. You seriously don't think there are excellent job opportunities all across the country?</p>
<p>because east coast ivies cant be matched. the history, name-value, and opportunities post-college for someone concentrating in something as standard as "econ and polisci" (which is what im doing), any of the ivies except possibly cornell or brown would be better than NU. if the OP is seriously trying to decide between NU and Penn as an econ major, i dont think there's much of a question. just because we go to NU doesnt mean we have to be ridiculously biased towards it... our school is great and has a lot of unique points that make the lifestyle even better than most other top-tier schools, but there ARE more prestigious universities out there that are more difficult to get into, like Penn.</p>
<p>if the OP wanted to do marketing or journalism, then obvi NU would be a better choice. but in this case, its no contest.</p>
<p>p.s. in regards to your other post, i may be "itching" to go to the east coast post-college (what pre-business student DOESNT wanna be on Wall Street?), but i wouldnt say im "miserable" at NU. i was born and raised in chicago suburbs, i love where ive grown up and have a lot of chicago pride, im just not blind enough to think NU is the greatest school in the world just because im going there.</p>
<p>And yet you're blind enough to think the Ivies are just because their name...</p>
<p>Availability</a> heuristic - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia</p>
<p>while id rather not get into an online argument with you, here's a link more appropriate for any NU student who thinks our school is better in terms of prestige, exit opportunities, and academic standing than some of the top ivies:</p>
<p>Denial</a> - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia</p>
<p>judging by some of the past threads youve started, it looks like youre having a really difficult time coming to terms with the fact that there ARE schools out there that are better than NU. the good news: theres only like 8-9 of them in the whole country. i dont know about you but im very happy going to a top 10 school (or according to US news, top 15), and am secure enough with where I am to be comfortable with the fact that SOME schools in the united states, particularly those colonial American institutions with 250-350 years of success, are more highly-regarded than NU. Ben Franklin founded UPenn. call me shallow, or just call me someone who admires our finding founders, but that's some damn good pedigree.</p>
<p>understandably, some colleges are a better fit for certain individuals than others. when choosing which school to apply to for ED, i applied to NU over Columbia because i like the campus culture at NU more. but two years into college as an aspiring ibanker, i realize that getting into a top ibank from NU is so much more difficult than going to Columbia or even NYU Stern. if you are a career-driven individual as hopefully most of us are (getting into a university is not the end of the line, you know. it only gets more and more competitive from there), think about where you want to be after 4 years of undergrad and choose your university based on that.</p>
<p>i thought i was better than engaging in frivolous online debate like this, but apparently there is just a terrible lack of work to keep me occupied in this silly office right now (6 interns in this chicago office: 1 harvard, 1 cornell, 3 northwestern, 1 depaul... yes, we can all get along). also, kindly avoid calling me out with smart-ass Wikipedia links, i have a right to state my opinions just as you have a right to state yours.</p>
<p>Your link to Wikipedia was a smart ass link, mine had a point. And before I type this out, I'll say something briefly. College may not be the end point, but education can be an end in itself. So you and I disagree philosophically to begin with.</p>
<p>I've never denied there are numerous schools superior to NU in many ways. In fact, I'm curious what threads you're referring to my having started, since the only ones I can think of I started merely because I thought the articles I linked to would be of interest to those on this board (for precisely this reason). Things are not so cut and dry as X school is better, period. Thus, it's always a question.</p>
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p.s. in regards to your other post, i may be "itching" to go to the east coast post-college (what pre-business student DOESNT wanna be on Wall Street?), but i wouldnt say im "miserable" at NU. i was born and raised in chicago suburbs, i love where ive grown up and have a lot of chicago pride, im just not blind enough to think NU is the greatest school in the world just because im going there.
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<p>NU doesn't have to be the greatest school in the world. What is it with all the linear thinking? Why do schools have to be viewed as 1,2,3,4,5, etc?
Why can't there be X number of really good schools, all which have unique strengths and aspects, to them? I just don't think very well of people who can't evaluate on multiple dimensions and have to reduce everything to a numbered, ordinal list.</p>
<p>Why does Penn have to be "better" than Northwestern? Why can't it just be different? Ditto for any other pair of top 20 schools.</p>
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[quote]
when choosing which school to apply to for ED, i applied to NU over Columbia because i like the campus culture at NU more. but two years into college as an aspiring ibanker, i realize that getting into a top ibank from NU is so much more difficult than going to Columbia or even NYU Stern. if you are a career-driven individual as hopefully most of us are (getting into a university is not the end of the line, you know. it only gets more and more competitive from there)
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<p>That's the problem right there. You're an i-banker wannabe -- the only reason people are interested in i-banking is because they want to make a lot of money, so college to you is merely a ticket to a high-paying job, not anything about expanding horizons or learning about new intellectual areas or learning from those around you. It's all about networking and prestige to you. Have you considered that others look for a rich intellectual experience as well?</p>
<p>"It's all about networking and prestige to you. Have you considered that others look for a rich intellectual experience as well?"</p>
<p>Pizzagirl, I don't think people look for that here on CC :P</p>