<p>I'm a rising sophomore, with junior standing at the Gallatin School of Individualized Study at NYU. Basically that means I get to design my own major and I have no required major path I have to complete.</p>
<p>So far, my concentration is a combo of Economics, International Relations, and Spanish. I have about a 3.5 so far, and I am loading up next semester with econ, politics and finance courses. However, I have never taken calculus, and doubt my ability to even place into it, given my past experience in precalc in HS. The issue is that I am very interested in finance, and am concerned that I will limit myself by not taking calc. Am I correct in my assumption? I heavily rely on my analytical skills, and my ability to read people/make deals/schmooze etc. </p>
<p>I have already interned on the hill for my congresswoman, interned at an NGO, and interned at a prominent hedge fund. Will I be able to break into high finance without those math skills, or am I screwing myself over? LET ME BE CLEAR, I do not wish to be an analyst mucking around in excel from 7-10 for the first two years out of school, that is not who I am and will never strive to be that. I am the type of person who can act on the numbers once they are crunched by those excel people.</p>
<p>1) It depends on what type of finance. For M&A, you won’t use calculus.</p>
<p>2) I hate to break it to you but you will be crunching numbers in excel past 10 if you become an IB analyst. The “people who can act on the numbers once they are crunched” all paid their dues and spent their early years working hard.</p>
<p>I don’t think you’re fit to call yourself an economics student till you’ve taken calculus. Take it, if not for banking at least for the sake of knowing something so vital to almost everything.</p>
<p>^ People on this board are a little cynical. Of course, if you are interested in becoming an investment banker, the NYU name will put you through the door. ( I see you have a 3.5, and if I were you, I would try to get into the honors program at NYU which is 3.65+)</p>
<p>My cousin is proof you don’t need to have any prior knowledge of business or economics for that matter to break into an investment bank. My cousin was a Pre-Med major at NYU with a 3.95 GPA with High honors, and 3+ internships while supporting his mother and supporting his brother’s tuition at NYU also. He got into Merill upon graduating from NYU, then Merill paid for his JD/MBA at Fordham, which is very prestigious in New York. Now he works for Merill, takes home half a million dollars a year, and has a multi-million dollar home in Forest Hills.</p>
<p>I have been on college confidential ever since I was a 7th grader, and a lot of information is incorrect, and a lot of the views certain people have are very skewed. You don’t need to be a Wharton, HYP, Ivy, top LAC graduate to become an investment banker. It is shocking isn’t it? Many people are definitely going to jump at me for writing this, and I have to say, because of the fact 10+ of my cousins went to NYU ( Dynasty) I have a sense of loyalty to NYU, and thus I am biased. But I am just as biased as anyone else on this board. Don’t hate the player, hate the game.</p>
<p>You need calculus though, and having a mathematical perspective in invaluable. Start self studying calculus over the summer, you still have 4 weeks until the fall session starts again.</p>
<p>“I am the type of person who can act on the numbers once they are crunched by those excel people.”</p>
<p>LOL. “Those excel people?” Hahahaha and what would you do with those numbers? Shove them up your ***? You won’t have a clue what to do with “those numbers.” Your whole mindset makes me think that you don’t have a clue what you’re getting into.</p>
<p>I laugh pretty hard at Treebounders regularly-- because he is an idiot. He thinks his inane responses are witty, which is why he’ll always be in the back office.</p>
<p>I cannot respond to your comment about Treebounders, but Duke he is right. It seems like the OP has no idea what bankers do, particularly at the analyst level… unless he’s talking about sales in S&T or something.</p>
<p>You’re going to be a 1st yr out of Duke w/ a start date in August? Just skimming your posts, a selected sampling of your finest work:
“Almost as pathetic as going to trade school for finance and then not getting a front office position.”
“So you’re saying my Ferragamo loafers won’t do?”
“Wow. You’ve obviously never worked for a BB before (back office doesn’t count.)”</p>
<p>You talk about adding value but do none of it yourself. If you know something more than all the “back office” interns then show it off - I’d be glad to take tips. So why don’t you “enlighten” the peons?</p>
<p>The OP is uninformed, clearly. Most of the work you do the first couple years out will be simple number crunching and putting together presentations-- the dealmaking is up to the officers (VP+.) Even as an associate, your main responsibilities are creating models, in essence, the excel person crunching numbers.</p>
<p>Treebounders loves to mock those who have no experience and are interested in the field. I prefer to answer questions (many have PM’ed me with advice) and humble the arrogance of kids like Treebounders and others who think they know everything (yet post factually incorrect information) about investment banking.</p>
<p>Edit: Treebounders, you have yet to post a question so I’m not sure what advice I could give you other than to continue to correct your posts with false information and condescending attitudes towards kids interested in the field. I find nothing wrong with correcting arrogant know-it-alls such as you. If you have any questions, feel free to PM me and I’ll answer them.</p>
<p>nuclearp–nyu name wont add an ounce of prestige since its the gallatin division. The op is obviously somewhat connected since he had all those internships, but unfortunately for him, connections will only open the door. That door will kick you in the behind with the number crunching attitude.</p>
<p>Many kids do not understand calculus and calculus based economics, so they tend to gradate in government, history, Afro American studies, Philosophy, literature etc with a minor in non math based economics. They keep their GPA very high through easier course load. Through family connections and their money, they get lucrative summer internships. They rely on investment bank advisory or works in the private equity (no capital market sides) where they use excel based evaluations. This still allows them to maintain very comfortable life style. </p>
<p>Due to lack of calculus based course work, they will never understand options etc. They rarely venture into Capital market side and they rarely go in prop trading. With connections and their money, they do not need to compete with quants.</p>
<p>If family puts 10 million in investment with the firm and firm make say 10% on this money, that means $1,000,000 in profit. After taking 2 and 20 firm still makes (2% of 10 million is = 200,000 and 20% of the $1 million profit is = 200,000) They have no problem paying this intern $100,000 as the firm still makes $300,000 on profit. This is a game in favour of firm and why they will not hire this person over one who brings little value to the company.</p>
<p>For parents, they have to invest money some place, so why not invest in a company which gives their kid a break. It is a win win situation for parent, kid, and the investment firm. Life is never fair, remember that.</p>
<p>^ Like I said, very cynical. I don’t know how a lot of people on this board got this way, but I have many cousins who have worked in investment banking, and this is exactly how they don’t describe it. Sure, one of my cousins works 60+ hours a week, but he says it isn’t as high strung as people make it out to be, and to break into investment banking isn’t the hard part, it is doing well once you’re in. Investment banking is naturally just a stepping stone in the business world, especially since the average person only lasts 2 years. This board kind of makes me feel like there isn’t any other option besides investment banking, which isn’t true lol.</p>
<p>Wow guys, I thank some of you for your replies, other’s, such as treebounders can go take a hike, you’re not adding anything to the conversation…</p>
<p>To clarify, I am able to to take an assortment of Econ classes/Stern classes, and other courses associated with finance without calculus, look them up in the course catalog…they exist, and you might have to pursuade professors to let you into them even if you’re 25 on the waitlist…</p>
<p>Anyway, Investment Banking is not the field I wish to jump into… I made that clear by indicating my interest in finance overall, not just IB. College In USA is correct in many ways, but I wouldn’t classify myself as anyone whose parents have any extra cash to throw around… so don’t make those assumptions so quickly. I’ve worked very hard to get the internships I’ve been fortunate enough to get, and they took a lot of dedication. The same skill sets can be applied to almost any field, and I am certain that I will be able to find a position within the vast world of Finance. I am an International Relations, Govt and Econ major, with Econ being my smallest concentration. I have spoken to hedge fund managers who have clearly told me that math is not important, and they see no reason for me to take calculus. I was attempting to get other opinions and I think I’ve succeeded. </p>
<p>I am attempting to raise my GPA to a 3.7 or so, which would make me an honors student I believe, which in my experience will be looked upon highly regardless of the fact that I can’t find derivatives or whatever you learn in calc. Advisory side is what I’m looking at, and nobody really answered that question for me. Everybody on these boards quickly jump to the conclusion that everyone wants to be an analyst at a BB, which is most certainly not my personal case. </p>
<p>If you are not going to add anything fruitful to the thread, go **** some other ppl off.</p>
<p>“I have spoken to hedge fund managers who have clearly told me that math is not important, and they see no reason for me to take calculus… I am attempting to raise my GPA to a 3.7 or so, which would make me an honors student I believe, which in my experience will be looked upon highly regardless of the fact that I can’t find derivatives or whatever you learn in calc.”</p>
<p>That’s a rather anti-intellectual attitude you’ve got there.</p>
<p>I disagree, I like to spend my time studying concepts and ideas that are far more tangible for me. I’d venture to say that my course choices are highly intellectual given their interdisciplinary seminar nature. Just because I don’t like math does not mean I’m an anti-intellectual.</p>
<p>I’m not saying that you’re anti-intellectual because you don’t like math. I’m saying that you’re anti-intellectual because you choose to ignore a field of study that is so fundamental to almost every modern subject - especially the subject that you will have printed on your degree - just because it has no direct, practical, tangible applications to the job you hope to have. Of course, I disagree that it won’t have any applications, since you will definitely be a much more efficient learner at your job with some calculus. Also, if you are as much of a self-learner as you proclaim to be, you will undoubtedly bump into concepts that will require calculus for you to understand and many other concepts that will be very much enlightened by calculus. You seem to think that tangible concepts do not require and did not come from calculus. You have no idea how wrong you are in this respect.</p>
<p>Your connection with that particular hedge fund manager may provide you some sort of way out of your dilemma, but your attitude towards that advantage is truly ridiculous. </p>
<p>You should take calculus just like all the rest of us. Advisory side? Huh? What?</p>
<p>That’s the side people get to AFTER they have waited their turn in line. You wont find many advisory members of hedge funds who haven’t already paid their dues in some form or the other.</p>