<p>Oberlin is the best fit "culturally" (very politically liberal) but the idea of graduating from an Ivy seems attractive to my D, although neither Cornell nor Oberlin was her dream school. Brown was her dream school. It didn't work out. But keep in mind, she'd never heard of Brown, Oberlin or Cornell before senior year. I practically picked the schools she applied to because she was indecisive and went through high school paying no attention to colleges. We visited a ton of schools.</p>
<p>I prefer she stick with Oberlin, where she has received a four-year scholarship, though not a full ride, but Cornell has offered a guaranteed transfer option into sophomore class, with the condition that she stick with the major she applied to. At Obie she could pick anything she wants, which is a good thing because she doesn't know what she wants to major in. No chance for a scholarship at Cornell next year, just grants and loans. Oberlin scholarship is enough that it will be equivalent to getting one year free and paying for only three. Graduate school in a yet to be determined major is likely destination after college. </p>
<p>Help me persuade her to forget the guaranteed transfer option and keep her brain focused on Oberlin where she will enroll in the fall. I've never raised a more indecisive kid!</p>
<p>There is nothing for you to do right now. She is going to Oberlin, and I would have her accept Cornell GT. Take required courses to satisfy Cornell’s requirements, come Spring she could decide if she wants to stay or go to Cornell. My friend’s son with a GT has opted to stay at his current school instead of Cornell because he is doing so well there. </p>
<p>Many people have pointed out to you that Oberlin is very different than Cornell. Your daughter may agree with you that Oberlin is a good fit for her now, as she matures she may have a different view than you. At the moment she has the best of both world - try it out at Oberlin, if it doesn’t fit she has a guaranteed transfer to Cornell.</p>
<p>The one problem with keeping GT is that it has to be exercised so early on that it could interfere with wholeheartedly trying to bond with the school of original matriculation. Its best use is when the applicant knows in the first place that they passionately want that program at Cornell, and the other school is not a highly attractive destination in its own right.</p>
<p>Still, it’s a free option, which can be used if she finds she absolutely hates her college, and after reflection this program at Cornell would be perfect for her. I’d want to keep a free option, providing I could consider it in that context and keep it from clouding my primary mission. But if such interference is a real possibility, then maybe not.</p>
<p>It is not at all unusual to consider changing schools down the road, once, via college experience, one has a better idea of what they want, both personally and academically.
But the point GT must be exercised is, in many cases, too early to allow this reconsideration process to appropriately take place.</p>
<p>If, at some point sophomore year, she decided Oberlin really wasn’t the best place for her to finish out her college years, going forward, she would then be in a good position to make a considered transfer choice. But quite likely that choice at that point would not be this particular major at Cornell either. A lot will have changed by then.</p>
<p>Hopefully she will love Oberlin, both initially and thoughout, and then this will all be moot.</p>
<p>I think Oldfort is right-- unless Cornell requires some sort of commitment right now for the GT (do they?) there’s no need to act now. That said, it WOULD be nice to finally put the whole search and decision process behind you, and see her happily settled in. If Brown was her dream school, then am guessing you’re probably right about Oberlin being the better match. If she’s choosing Cornell mainly because it’s an Ivy, am not sure that’s a very good reason… If she did end up not liking Oberlin (which sounds doubtful), she’d probably consider a transfer anyway, so for now the GT remains just an attractive option. In any case, congrats on the scholarship!</p>
<p>I had an indecisive kid who became decisive because when it came to the big things – whether to select our zoned public school or the IB magnet program elsewhere; whether to stay in the IB program or transfer; what colleges to apply to; which college to select – I forced him to make the decisions himself.</p>
<p>I made sure that he had all of the info. For instance, I insisted that he shadow students at both high schools; I took him to visit colleges; I let him know our financial limitations when it came to college, but I didn’t make the decisions for him. In each case, he waited until the last second to make his decision, but it was his decision.</p>
<p>When it came to college, he couldn’t make up his mind, and he ended up missing all of the deadlines for colleges that interested him. He knew our house rule was that once out of high school, if you’re not in college fulltime, you’re living on your own supporting yourself or you are living at home paying rent. So, by Feb. of his senior year, he had an application in to Americorps, and a job promised to him. He did this all on his own. He wanted to live in his own place. I showed him the classifieds. He decided to live at home and pay rent while being in Americorps.</p>
<p>During his Americorps year, he applied to 2 colleges – the in-town public and a LAC he’d fallen in love with. He paid his application fees, arranged for transcript, etc. to be sent by himself. He is now a very happy soph at the LAC, where he’s getting good grades and making his own decisions – good decisions about courses, ECs, rommates, etc.</p>
<p>So my advice is to let your D make up her own mind. Certainly help her see the plusses and minuses of each situation, but realize that this is the one time in her life in which making mistakes won’t be a disaster, but an opportunity to learn how to make better decisions next time. Everyone learns through experience. Give your D that chance.</p>
<p>Northstarmom, great point. There is a natural parental instinct to try to keep your kid from falling on his/ her butt. Perhaps in the long run this can best be accomplished by letting them fall on their butt, when the consequences are less dire than subsequently.</p>
<p>This sounds to me like a kid who will be way more happy in the smaller community of Oberlin but I agree with Northstarmom that it is time to give her the decision (and she will probably be indecisive about wanting it!). She needs to hear you trust in her decision and that there is no catastrophic outcome here (eg: being unhappy or disappointed is NOT a catastrophe…really. This is a good time for kids to get some perspective on that). The nice thing about this as a learning situation is that she can actually hold both options in some sense for awhile. My bet is that after a month at Oberlin she will let go of the Ivy-glazed longing because of the reality of campus life that is real will take priority. And if it doesn’t and she goes to Cornell later, that will either fulfill her dream or teach her about choices. In any case, good luck. As someone who has tortured myself with indecision much of my life (fate of a Libra) I encourage her and you to start working on the process now. My father wouldn’t help me decide about my first car and it was a wonderful lesson. (And guess what: I made a good choice and still miss that car…a used VW Squareback)</p>
<p>FWIW, my D visited Oberlin and Cornell and most of the other Ivies, and would choose Oberlin over Cornell (or Brown). I honestly do not see why people are so hung up on the “Ivy league”.</p>
<p>People should not be hung up on “ivy League” per se. Unless they play sports (badly. for the most part) in it.</p>
<p>However, they can legitimately have some interest in things such as : extent of on campus recruiting, reputation in the job market, alumni network, success in attaining graduate and professional studies.</p>
<p>And its possible there may be some correlation. Though possibly not.</p>
<p>There are other distinctions that can also be made, regarding nature and number of : courses, fellow students, available activities. But these do not depend on “ivy league” per se, more the generic “bigger school vs. smaller school” tradeoffs.</p>
<p>I think you daughter should go to Oberlin but sometime during the year, go visit a friend at Cornell (who is in a similar major if possible) and sleep over in the dorm and do a little compare/contrast. </p>
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<p>I would be astounded if a student who, right now, thought Oberlin sounded good, decided to use that guaranteed transfer to Cornell, but maybe… Especially if she were to find out that she really does not like Oberlin. (But that would surprise me.)</p>
<p>Based on reports from students from our H.S. who have gone to one or the other, the atmospheres at these two college are so different!</p>
<p>MidwestMom - I don’t disagree with you. They are two different schools. I think if you like one, you probably wouldn’t like the other. OP’s family (not sure if it’s the D or OP) seem to be stuck on Cornell or Oberlin. I only offered that advice just in case if they should change their mind. It is a free option.</p>
<p>The other thing is: you might like one much more now, but come the upperclass years, you might like the other one more. Of course, by that time this GT will be useless.</p>
<p>I’ve heard of schools deferring admittance for a semester (UC Berkeley does that) or a year (Harvard does that), but the idea of having a kid transfer from a top quality school to Cornell, just to go to Cornell, seems like a bit of an odd idea on Cornell’s part, and not very collegial to the other college, which will have invested in that student. That’s not your daughter’s worry, though. What might be is that it could be very socially and academically disruptive to start college twice; most students make their good friends as first years, in dorms, and it is much harder after that at most schools. (The UC’s are a little different because they accept such a large number of transfers, but my own experience transferring was that I found it very hard to meet people, and there was a lot of adjusting to do, even in schools in the same state and of the same size, and where I already knew some people). One frequent poster on CC had a kid who chose one school over another, then transferred, then transferred back…unfortunately (or fortunately in some ways), it is possible to like many different schools and types of schools, but you generally just choose and stick with one. It would seem best to go to a school with the full intention of staying unless it simply turns out to have been a bad choice. Which is not to say that it would be a bad thing to keep options open IF your daughter has a reason for preferring Cornell apart from the “ivy” name. Many Oberlin students have declined Ivies for Oberlin - because they preferred a LAC or wanted a double degree - and lived to tell the tale with no regrets.</p>
<p>I agree it’s kind of a bizarre thing they do. My guess is it’s an outgrowth of the relationship the “contract colleges” there have with community colleges in NY state. If a kid bolts out of a community college early, nobody really cares. And of course no other institution is harmed if the student actually completes the two years at community college and then moves onwards. I only read about it in the last several years, I don’t think they’ve been doing this forever.</p>
<p>On the other hand, this kind of just formalizes what other colleges do more informally. After D notified them that she had chosen Oberlin, another college wrote her a note to the effect of," best of luck, however, just in case, we will keep your application material on file for years, please call us if you want to make a change down the road".</p>
<p>My impression is that Cornell offers students the GT option as sort of an extended waitlist. They don’t really care where you do your first year as long as you complete certain requirements and meet a certain GPA. </p>
<p>And some kids think they want the GT and then decide to stay put.</p>
<p>It is part of Cornell’s State College component and has been around for years. My nephew, who’s close to 40, used this option very happily. He went to SUNY Albany for one year, reapplied to Cornell (or whatever they call it) and announced to my sister that she needed to send a deposit for the following year. She had forgotten all about it! It was one of the best thing he’s done.</p>
<p>We have a good number of kids in my community who are in this situation right now, some are taking the opportunity, some are not. It’s really a personal decision. Good luck!</p>
<p>Someone from my D1’s grade was offered GT to Cornell. She was very certain she wanted to go to Cornell, even though she was accepted to some other good schools. She decided to go to Rutgers for one year (saved a lot of money), followed Cornell’s requirements, and transferred this year as a sophomore. </p>
<p>Cornell’s GT requirements are pretty strict and GPA that’s needed is not low. For this girl there was a danger of not meeting GT requirements, and end up at Rutgers instead of other “better” schools she’s turned down. For that reason, our friend’s son chose CMU even though he thought he wanted to go to Cornell as a GT. He ended up liking CMU and is staying there.</p>
<p>This is a different kind of GT. Some people are sent the GT when they apply as high school seniors, rather than the usual deny/accept/waitlist. They can take the first year anywhere, not necessarily at one of Cornell’s affiliated colleges.</p>
<p>To answer ISPF72’s question, yes, the guaranteed transfer option has to be exercised after 1.5 semesters at another school. They don’t care where you go. It could be the most ratty, unchallenging two-year or four year college in America so long as it is accredited by some accreditation organization. </p>
<p>I don’t know why my D was given this option. Frankly, I was a bit surprised that she did not get accepted by Cornell outright. And I had no idea that such a thing as GTO even existed. the option does appear to be better than making the freshman waiting list. Cornell will take a tiny percentage of people off the wait list. And waitlisters that I contacted did not get the GTO. I suggested to my D that if she absolutely wanted Cornell, don’t go to hard school like Oberlin to try to get the minimum 3.0 in your first semester, go to our local community college and easily rack up a 4.0 and take the transfer. But she wants to go to Oberlin. Hopefully that means she absolutely hates the place. How do you walk away from a scholarship? We’re not rich people.</p>