<p>When I studied in Boston it turned out that staying off-campus without a meal plan was significantly better than living in student housing with a meal plan. I don't know how this would be when it comes to Penn--is it viable to think that I could find decent off-campus housing near the campus for a reasonable price? Also, what are the pros and cons of staying off-campus as a Penn student?</p>
<p>I'd love to hear from some current or former students. Any tips are welcome!</p>
<p>Penn has really been designed for off-campus living. The University barely has enough dorm space for half the student body, and almost all upperclassmen live off campus.</p>
<p>There is a wealth of available rental housing within a mile or so of the campus. It includes the buildings justamess92 mentions, which are privately developed luxury dorms that are only “off campus” on a technicality but are effectively on campus and more convenient than many official dorms. They however, are definitely toward the expensive end of off-campus housing. Heading out west and southwest from campus, there are lots of Victorian semi-detached houses that have been cut up into apartments or rented out to groups, plus older, cheaper apartment buildings, and east of campus, just across the Schuylkill River, there are many condominium buildings where units are rented by students.</p>
<p>Living off campus does not mean that the students’ lives do not center on the college and what is happening on campus. Campus is an easy walk or shuttle bus ride from where they live, and campus is where they spend most of their time. They just don’t have RAs, dorm rules, or mandatory meal plans, and they generally don’t share a bedroom with anyone (unless, of course, you know . . . ).</p>
<p>^ Yet another insightful and informative post by JHS. BUT (oh no, the dreaded “but” ;)), just to correct a couple of minor things:</p>
<ol>
<li> According to a recent chart in The Daily Pennsylvanian, 41% of Penn juniors and 27% of Penn seniors live on campus (as do 63% of Penn sophomores), so it’s not quite accurate to say that “almost all” upperclassmen live off campus (although a majority clearly do):</li>
</ol>
<p>And, when the new college house on Hill Square is completed in 2016, and the complete renovation of Hill Hall is completed after that, there will be room for an additional 350-400 Penn undergrads to live on campus, almost all of whom will be sophomores, juniors, and seniors.</p>
<ol>
<li>Hamilton Court (one of the two buildings mentioned by justamess92) isn’t really a “luxury dorm” (and is over 100 years old, incidentally :)) or on the expensive end of off-campus housing, and it’s actually cheaper than on-campus housing, especially when sharing a 4-5 bedroom apartment. It IS, however, quite popular with Penn undergrads, and has been for many decades.</li>
</ol>
<p>I fear that I could miss out on the experience by living off-campus, but at the same time I do not want to be on some kind of meal plan. Is this possible at Penn? Is there any kind of arrangement where I can live in a college house without subscribing to a meal plan? My main concern is saving money. In Boston staying off-campus and avoiding a meal plan was actually all positive aside from the fact that I was slightly distanced from the house life. My apartment was not only nicer than the house dorms but also cheaper, which made many of my friends jealous.</p>
<p>Just get the smallest plan you can. People told us to get the one with the most dining dollars rather than meal swipes and that turned out to be good advice. At the end of the semester you can use the dollars to buy packaged food or drinks to use next semester so it doesn’t go to waste.</p>
<p>There will be times you want to go to the dining hall because you will want to be with your friends who will all be on meal plans.</p>
<p>ETA:
</p>
<p>It looks like they have added the BFF plan. That might be a good option for you.</p>
<p>Why doesn’t OP opt for living in one of Penn’s high rises and self catering? I lived on campus at Penn in the '70s without a meal plan after my freshman year.</p>
<p>Yea this year I’m living in the dorms and don’t have a meal plan so it’s definitely possible.</p>
<p>I do see where parentofpeople is coming from though. At the least it’s convenient especially on the days you come home tired and don’t want to cook or have nothing in the fridge. If you don’t mind doing takeout once awhile, it shouldn’t be a problem because there are a ton of places to do takeout on campus</p>
<p>Undergrads who are not freshmen are NOT required to purchase a meal plan, even if they live in campus housing, and many who live in campus housing are not on a meal plan. And following up on rhg3rd’s post, dorms such as the three high-rise college houses (Rodin, Harrison, and Harnwell) have a kitchen in each apartment, allowing residents to easily prepare their own meals.</p>
<p>I would be delighted to live in one of the houses if I could have a kitchen in the room I can use. Is it possible to make a housing application to only rooms with kitchens? In my case, having a kitchen is a deal breaker–if I could not get a room with a kitchen I would simply have to find an apartment. Does someone know anything about this?</p>
<p>Harnwell seems nice, is it hard to get a room with a kitchen there? I might add that I will have to apply for housing quite late, I suppose, something which might make things more difficult. </p>
<p>Also, what are the local grocery stores like? Are there any cheaper ones around, like Trader Joe’s or cheaper?</p>
<p>stillforyou, it might be a good idea at this point to wait and see if you get in, and if you do, what kind of FA package you might get. If you are struggling financially as much as you are making it seem, you might be surprised to see a package that covers you meal plan and then you won’t have to worry. </p>
<p>No sense trying to decide about this now, because there is nothing you can do at this point anyway. You just don’t have enough information to make any plans yet.</p>
<p>I’m not sure if they finalized the proposed changes, but I think Harnwell is going to stop accepting freshman from next year and Harrison is eventually going to phase out the Fresh Ex program.</p>
<p>As for grocery stores, there’s: </p>
<ul>
<li>The Fresh Grocer on 40th and Walnut. It’s closest to campus, but pretty dingy and overpriced all things considered. </li>
<li>Shop n Bag on 43rd and Walnut. Cheaper, not that far from campus but I’d stay away from the meat</li>
<li>Trader Joe’s on 21st and Market. Loved this place when I was a student, and it’s a quick ride on the trolley.</li>
<li>Aldi on 46th and Market. I actually never went, but my roommates would go when money was tight sophomore year. I’d only make that trek during the day, but this is by far your cheapest option.</li>
</ul>
<p>There are a lot of ethnic grocery stores around too. Freshman/Soph year we’d sometimes make the trip out to 69th street station to go to H-Mart, a giant Korean supermarket.</p>
<p>I am not coming in as a freshman and I am almost certain that I will attend. I really appreciate the grocery store tips–it means a lot. In general, does anyone have an idea of how expensive it is to live in Philly when compared to Boston? I would suspect that they are quite similar in terms of prices, but I do not really know.</p>