Oh this is bad...

Colleges and Universities A-Z Williams College
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<p>To Code H and Radannie:</p>

<p>As someone who passionately loves Philosophy and Poetry (I’m a Philosophy major who spends most of her free time reading poetry!), I have to say that Williams is not the best atmosphere for either. Sophomore year, my friend and I tried starting a poetry reading group which didn’t work out well at all. I’ve also been involved in two failed attempts to start clubs for philosophical discussion. The Philosophy faculty is pretty amazing but you won’t find all too many students who engage in philosophical discussion outside the classroom. And Philosophy, in my opinion, is most fun when you can have conversations with people about the stuff you’re reading. It’s the best way to truly engage in the material and to gain a better understanding of it. Sure, your classes will provide you a forum to do this, but most other colleges have thriving Philosophy clubs and I cannot stress how important that can be.</p>

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<p>ladylazurus: I’ve read your posts over the past week and feel sadness for you that your college experience was not what you thought it would be. Looking back at your posts, I see that you entered Williams with a very different outlook, and it is too bad that your time there did not meet your intellectual/social needs.</p>

<p>I am a mother with a freshman at Williams. He has had a fantastic year. Similar to other families’ experiences - he will not post on CC, nor will he post on WSO, for two reasons: one, he chooses to spend his time doing other things, and two, he feels that the students who post on WSO in particular are focusing on the negative, and use WSO as an outlet for their discontent. I have talked to him several times over the past two weeks, specifically about the topics you and another student have raised on CC. He truly can’t understand why you have not found like-minded peers to discuss philosophy topics with outside of the classroom environment. He is now taking his second philosophy course and says he has spent a great deal of time talking with other students about reading topics outside of class. Granted, he is, in general, a laid back kind of guy, but he chose Williams because he was in search of a college with an intellectually stimulating environment. He was an anomaly in his high school where the vast majority of his peers were not interested in thinking deeply about anything academic.</p>

<p>Parents post on CC to share their child’s experiences in an effort to help other families going through the admissions process. I was greatly helped by mythmom and other parents who provided another perspective on the Williams experience. I certainly would not come to CC saying such positive things about Williams if my child was not thriving there. I convey here what I learn from him in our conversations.</p>

<p>I worry about what we in our family call the “Swarthmore Effect”. When we visited Swarthmore, we had a tour guide that did not have the same interests or public speaking approach as our family and several others in our group. We were first taken to see the mental health facilities, then the library where we were told that students could check out entire collections of TV series to watch in their dorms…and so on until we were nearing the end, when the tour guide gleefully stated she was so happy that she never had to take another math class at Swarthmore and learn “about those equation things”. Several families had already left the tour by that point. I kid you not!</p>

<p>As a parent, I loved Swarthmore and thought it could be a good fit for our son. I could look beyond that one negative experience to see the larger picture of what Swarthmore had to offer because as we age, we learn to do that! After that single, hour long experience, however, our son (and daughter) would not even consider Swarthmore, and they have referred to that tour many times since that day. </p>

<p>My point is that negative posts on boards like this represent one person’s experience. Prospective students should talk to as many people as possible about the schools they are considering. Our son is thinking about majoring in Philosophy after his wonderful courses this year. You can bet that I told him to talk to as many Philosphy majors as he can…he may even find you ladylazurus! Your feelings are valid and appropriate for you. We cannot, however, take one person’s experience and generalize it to entire population without a lot more research.</p>

<p>My son’s experience at Wiliams so far, has been entirely diffrent from that of ladylazurus and the other poster, and for that, I am eternally grateful.</p>

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<p>My S adores poetry. I doubt he’d want to be in a poetry reading group. I am a poet, and I don’t enjoy poetry reading groups. I am a private sort – hence poet (and yes – published) but not fond of poetry readings.</p>

<p>Many of my dear friends are, so I am not disagreeing with or putting down LL at all. I wish she could (or he) have landed at Sarah Lawrence or at Smith where I’m sure they read Sylvia Plath all the time.</p>

<p>Williams ethos is a bit different, I think, though perhaps I’m being arrogant in suggesting this. But it seems to me that Williams stresses an integration of thought and action. It doesn’t favor pursuits that are merely cerebral.</p>

<p>I support this. I am thrilled that my son is learning to put his ideas into action instead of sitting around and talking about them. But we all favor different things.</p>

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<p>akamom- this is going to be brief because I need to get to my Philosophy thesis (!!). but at the end of freshman year, I was nowhere nearly as disillusioned with Williams as I am now. It’s taken me four years to arrive at the conclusions I"ve arrived at.</p>

<p>I realize that my expectations may have been too high, or that I’m always going to be part of a minority that has trouble being happy anywhere - trust me, all that’s crossed my mind. It’s just that I’m not the only person who feels this way. Granted I’ve come across maybe a couple of dozen people in my time here who’ve felt the same way. But I still think that anyone with certain interests should be aware of what s/he’s getting into, and that’s all I’m trying to do here. I am not making generalizations; I’m just warning prospective students, and I’m sharing my own experiences. I’m not saying: “don’t come to Williams”; I’m saying: “think twice.”</p>

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<p>PS: akamom, I would strongly recommend a Philosophy major for anyone who’s a current student here. I’ve said this before but it bears repeating: the Phil professors are absolutely <em>wonderful</em>.</p>

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<p>it’s also important to keep in mind the time constraints many students face at williams given the rigorous academic environment which is very prevalent and pervasive at williams. others schools may have a philosophy club where class discussions may be extended outside the classroom or a group of students gather to simply talk about philosophy, but williams is not lacking in this experience. it simply isn’t manifested in a club. rather, those interested in philosophy are busy reading for their class where they will have a great conversation with engaging professors or writing their tutorial papers. point is: a club is not needed to consume your free time with philosophy, because those interested are consumed in philosophy to the extent that they have no time to go to the club. that is, we don’t really need a club since we are already spending our time on it so much. having said that, in the small time we have, i often have found myself engaging in casual, philosophical discussions and class itself is a great venue for these topics.
the experience is not lacking at williams, it’s just manifested differently.</p>

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<p>[EDIT: I decided to delete this post - I don’t think it belongs on CC; it ended up being more about discussing Williams with another student than about helping prospective students/parents of prospective students figure out if Williams is for them]</p>