Olin vs. MIT

Colleges and Universities A-Z Massachusetts Institute of Technology
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^^ but that's silly. they HAVE to be important to you on some level, you can't just do engineering all the time and have no other interests. I spent last semester taking only engineering and physics courses, last semester was hell in a way that was indescribable. I'm a physics (maybe AE) major and my two favorite classes I've taken here were a physics course and a writing course.

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<p>I didn't say Olin doesn't have ANY courses outside engineering. It just that they have no majors outside engineering. I'm alright with no writing or music major. Plenty of courses to take in those areas though. And there's always cross registration with Babson and Wellesley (MIT has cross registration with Wellesley too, right?). </p>

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someperson, you seem to want to be convinced. Olin is very cool. If I go to multi-school conferences, I find that those kids on the same plane as MIT/Harvard. MIT just has a hugely larger depth of classes, resources, and tradition. You'll certainly find a niche, and you can get all sorts of personal attention. A lot of the course VI classes are large, but they are great classes, and it's cool that lots of people are taking it. I mean, MIT was one of the inventors of CS - would you go to a lecture by Feynman and complain about the class size? I'll say this, MIT professors for the big required classes are definitely doing it because they like teaching - and you can get to know them.</p>

<p>And after the required course VI classes, there's page after page of specialized classes and you can take whatever interests you.

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<p>Same is available at Olin. No huge course VI classes, more personal attention, brand-name faculty. (I heard somewhere that MIT has a memorial or something with Gill Pratt's name on it. He left MIT for Olin.) And even if the classes get smaller in the electives, I think personal attention is more important in the beginning when people are just learning how to swim.</p>

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why, I ask, are you trying to get people to convince you to go to MIT? Didn't you enjoy Olin CW?

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I enjoyed Olin CW very much. I think Olin is a great school, but then again MIT is good too. I don't want to make a decision about my education that I'll later regret. Which is why I'm here to see what MIT people say about MIT.</p>

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The reason to choose MIT is the people; if you come for CPW and fall in love with the students and the structure and the culture and the way of life the way 80% of students who come to CPW do, then you should come here. If you come here and it doesn't feel like home, then you should go elsewhere.

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I went to MIT back in the fall, and I didn't get a sense for the structure and culture. I don't know if this is because there is none or if it was because it wasn't CPW. I felt it at Olin CW though.</p>

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I think the most important reason to choose MIT is the fact that its graduate programs are spectacular.

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<p>I'll be a undergraduate, not a graduate next year. So I don't see why graduate programs would be important to undergraduate. Maybe in research programs and things like that, but at Olin, since there are no graduate kids and plenty of professors used to working with graduates in research, all these opportunities will be available for the 300 students there, not the 6000 graduates.</p>

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If you think you will want to get a master's degree in an engineering field, you are better off going to MIT for undergrad than to any other school -- a substantial number of spaces in MIT graduate programs are given to MIT undergrads, and several programs (such as the course 6 MEng) are master's degree programs only available to students who went to MIT as undergrads. MIT students get into MIT grad programs in extremely high numbers not only because they are strong students, but because they become close with faculty members via UROP; the faculty members then make sure they are admitted to the graduate program.

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<p>I will definitely want a graduate degree, but I don't see how going to Olin will jeopardize that. You say MIT kids get into MIT grad pretty easily. First of all, there are great graduate schools other than MIT out there, on par or even better. Secondly, I don't feel its right to get accepted to a school just because I've been there before, or because I knew some faculty who make decisions. If as you say, faculty members make sure that students are admitted, I've lost some respect for MIT.</p>

<p>Anyway, Olin students are accepted at MIT/Stanford/UCB/CMU and other such schools at an alarmingly high rate.</p>

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You can also begin research with a world-famous professor as early as you'd like.

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At Olin, they don't give you a choice. You have to do hands on projects in all your classes. (Speaking of which, I'm still waiting for an answer as to what hands-on projects happen in MIT classes.)</p>

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however, keep in mind that eecs at mit is like a factory and so once you get into your departmental classes, you'll mostly have large lectures (of 40 or more) up until senior year.

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<p>This is my biggest concern.</p>

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<p>My son is a junior EECS at MIT. He UROP'd in Tim Berner Lee's lab for a semester, then worked there all summer. It was an invaluable experience. He's also remained in contact with one of his professors from sophomore year and has gained a lot from that relationship. He's never complained about large classes, so I don't know if he doesn't have them or he doesn't mind them.</p>

<p>He did Concourse freshman year and really enjoyed that. </p>

<p>My youngest really liked Olin when we visited, but later decided not to apply because he wanted to focus on bio engineering and Olin doesn't offer it. I think the size would have been a great fit for him.</p>

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<p>Actually Olin does have BioE.</p>

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<p>I think they said BioE wasn't offered at first, maybe?</p>

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<p>Olin does have a concentration in Bio Eng, but it's part of the general engineering major, and didn't offer the classes he wanted.</p>

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<p>MIT vs. Olin? Googlefight is the obvious solution.</p>

<p>[URL="<a href="http://www.googlefight.com/index.php?lang=en_GB&word1=Olin&word2=%22Massachusetts+institute+of+technology%22%22%5DClicky%5B/URL"&gt;http://www.googlefight.com/index.php?lang=en_GB&word1=Olin&word2=%22Massachusetts+institute+of+technology%22"]Clicky[/URL&lt;/a&gt;]&lt;/p>

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Anyway, Olin students are accepted at MIT/Stanford/UCB/CMU and other such schools at an alarmingly high rate.

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<p>Are you talking about for grad school? I'm not sure where you got statistics on this, since to the best of my knowledge this is the first year that Olin has had a Senior class (maybe last year? but their first class was strongest).</p>

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<p><a href="http://careers.olin.edu/docs/profiles/Class%20of%202006%20Profile_Current.pdf%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://careers.olin.edu/docs/profiles/Class%20of%202006%20Profile_Current.pdf&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p>

<p>Of all students who went onto engineering grad school:</p>

<p>CMU 1
Cornell 1
MIT 3
Oxford 1
Penn State 1
Rice 1
Stanford 3
UCB 3
UCI 1
UMichigan 1</p>

<p>That's everybody, not just the top few. So a quarter of the class went onto engineering grad school (over 70% went to the highest of the elite). The other stats are impressive too. 4 NSF grants. Employment stats that look like MIT's. 4 kids started their own companies, straight out of school. And this is just the first year.</p>

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4 kids started their own companies, straight out of school. And this is just the first year.

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<p>I think I know 3 of those 4. Olin has a bunch of cool kids who really care about the school, especially the first year since a lot of them went in a year early - and back then they paid for everything. I don't want to discourage anybody from going to Olin over MIT, because I also want Olin to succeed. the two schools are just very very different. Olin's campus feels to me like a mix between MIT and summer camp.</p>

<p>Olin had great results for grad school, which is to be expected.. the employment stats don't look like MITs though - the top employers for MIT are McKinsey, Goldman Sachs, BCG, Bain, Lehman, Morgan Stanley, Google, Microsoft, etc...
The idea is for that to change over time, as the Olin pioneers go into industry and make names for themselves (although Olin students are also more self-selected towards smaller engineering firms).</p>

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I'll be a undergraduate, not a graduate next year. So I don't see why graduate programs would be important to undergraduate.

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Because of the reasons I mentioned -- the ability to do fabulous research, and the ability to take graduate-level courses. I should mention that I didn't really feel like there was a distinction made between graduate students and undergraduates at MIT; since undergrads take the same courses as grad students and do research in the same labs, what's the difference? I valued being treated like a grad student and not like a child during my years as an undergraduate.</p>

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I will definitely want a graduate degree, but I don't see how going to Olin will jeopardize that. You say MIT kids get into MIT grad pretty easily. First of all, there are great graduate schools other than MIT out there, on par or even better. Secondly, I don't feel its right to get accepted to a school just because I've been there before, or because I knew some faculty who make decisions. If as you say, faculty members make sure that students are admitted, I've lost some respect for MIT.</p>

<p>Anyway, Olin students are accepted at MIT/Stanford/UCB/CMU and other such schools at an alarmingly high rate.

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Why would that make you lose respect for a school? MIT faculty members make sure MIT undergrads are accepted because they know those students and want those students to be in their labs. And they're not making the wrong decisions!</p>

<p>My fiance, for example, didn't do as well on the GRE as the rest of the applicants to MIT's aero/astro grad program, and his GPA was low. He still got in, because the professor with whom he's been working since freshman year knew what a valuable student he was, regardless of his GPA or what he got on the GRE. He didn't get in because he knew the professor -- he got in because the professor knew that he was the best possible addition to his lab. There's a subtle difference there. But skills like my fiance's aren't well-reflected in an application, and he likely wouldn't have gotten in if he came from another school.</p>

<p>I just feel that it's appropriate to inform prospective students that their chances of getting into MIT's grad school programs are higher if they attend MIT as undergraduates. Often people claim that they'll go somewhere else for undergrad, then come to MIT for grad school -- it's not that easy. It is made significantly easier if you come to MIT as an undergrad. (And in engineering, yes, MIT's grad programs are generally the best out there. That's not to say that going to other programs is silly -- in most fields, there are at least two or three grad programs that are of approximately equal quality.)</p>

<p>About a quarter of Olin's grads went grad school last year. About a quarter of MIT's grads went to MIT for grad school.</p>

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<p>"Olin's campus feels to me like a mix between MIT and summer camp."</p>

<p>!
This is exactly what I said to my parents when they asked me about CW. I had a great time, I really did, but when I had to describe it that was what popped into mind first. Good? Bad? I don't know</p>

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<p>someperson-</p>

<p>Are you hard to please or have you made up your mind already? If your gut instinct is to go to Olin (as it appears to me, since you are defending it resolutely on every ground), then absolutely you should go to Olin! We're telling you the reasons we wouldn't go to Olin, and we're saying these things because of our positive experiences at MIT. If you don't see those being realistic for you, why waste our time and yours?</p>

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<p>ew carmel that is what i said</p>

<p>if i did have to choose one, i would probably have to wait until revisiting MIT. i loved olin's feel a lot more than MIT's, but at the same time, i don't think i got the right impression during my MIT overnight. </p>

<p>the two schools really just approach learning in totally different ways. i think that ultimately, wherever you go, you will probably end up happy and get what you want to out of the experience... whether or not you are part of the 4000 or 300 undergrads there. i know everyone says this, but really i would just go with what "feels" right (and agreeing with pebbles, it seems like your instinct is telling you olin)</p>

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<p>I go to Wellesley and we can cross register at both schools so I'm in the unique postion to know what each place is like, at least superficially.</p>

<p>Olin students are totally sold on their school. It's a small close-knit environment where people are excited about what they are doing. Because there are all of 70 odd Olin alums in the world and Olin is new, Olin students are stuck having to sell their school and themselves to almost everyone they meet. It's not a terribly hard sell when you have the excuse of being 6 years old and as selective as an ivy league university (and getting to say you turned down Harvard to go to Olin). Olin students (which include your share of engineering nerds that you would find at MIT, RPI, WPI or any such school) seem to be better speakers and presents than what I've seen at MIT (but my sample is limited).
In any event, Olin students are great at both selling the idea Olin and talking about what they are doing. In the world of science and engineering, this skill is almost as valuable as the work itself.
The summer camp analogy for Olin isn't too far off: you are in a contained environment where people know who you are and you have less choices about where to eat and live. That does not, however preclude the fact that you are an adult at any college you chose to attend. You know Gill? (mentioned on the page linked from thread 1) I've had a class with him. It's the "Gill and Brian show" and students and profs are on a universal first name basis. I know that Olin students work hard and are stressed, but there is not a "fire house" culture that I know of. They're having some fun.
With 300 people, Olin does not have a a depth and bredth of majors or choices or programs. You get some student unity because of that, but it also means that Olin might not have your other interests. I turned down a full tuition merit scholarship to a school that is neither Olin nor MIT because they did not offer French (and they didn't guarantee housing and I hated the food and loved Wellesley). Olin does have strong cross registration programs with Wellesley, Babson and Brandeis. Expect to spend a bunch of times at other schools. Over 70 Olin students are cross registered at Wellesley this semester. Yes I said 70. Granted Wellesley xreg is exteremely convenient. Olin has molded its schedule to be compatible with ours and there is a shuttle that goes to Wellesley every half hour (Olin is about 10 mins away). Wellesley has pretty much everything but engineering, so the combo works rather well (MIT students, don't fret, you can xreg here at Wellesley too!).</p>

<p>I know that earlier everyone wanted to start the club for their interest that would become the thing that all Olin students do forever and ever. People came up with a lot of great ideas, but it became a survivial of the fittest thing. However it seems the unicycling club is catching on.... Meetings are after midnight. Social dancing is a thing too. I know they do more at Olin, but those are the thing I end up hearing about at Wellesley. If you want to start something at that doesn't exist at any school, Olin's probably the place to do it. Olin students really believe that they are part of history, of a model school that will change engineering and the world.</p>

<p>MIT is huge. While it exists for the grad students, there is a romance (sadistic and twisted as it is) of being an MIT undergrad: the hacks, piano drop, people making robotic dorm rooms, calling buildings by numbesr, nerd paradise, being hosed but mangaging to somehow do it all. You're in a loud bustling city, but you are completely connected to Boston's public transportation. Boston is just over the bridge and as long as you don't want for forests and dark skies, you won't want for too much. While Olin students feel like they are making history, MIT students feel that they are part of Something Big.
Like Olin, there are classes at MIT that ALL THE FRESHMAN have to take, but doing it at MIT puts you in a group of a couple hundred (with smaller recitations). Take it or leave it. It ranks you up with everyone in a bizarre depressing sort of way and you will be a small fish in a big pond. At Olin, you might not be the smartest in your class because, like MIT, everyone is smart, but you will not be ignored at Olin. Or lost.
I never applied to MIT. The fact that the school had the reputation for making people miserable didn't appeal to me, despite all of the "look at the amazing stuff we do here" hype. Even though I do a ton of work at Wellesley and probably put an equal amount of my time into academics as I would have had I gone to MIT.
MIT has its fair share of negative stereotypes: a nerd school, miserable students, bad social skills. They wouldn't exist if they didn't apply to some people. Now that I take a class there, I would say it was a mistake to fear the school. Wellesley had a student suicide during its open campus while I was choosing the school and I almost didn't matriculate. I had heard how some students hate the school because of a lack of social life or stress, and that being from Wellesley would be a socially awkward thing in Boston, because people assume you are desperate or a slut or a lesbian. I went to Wellesley with an attitude that my happiness was to come first and I was to be myself. Because I knew these additudes were possible, I never actually felt overwhelmed by any of those things as a Wellesley student because they weren't a suprise.
Like I said before, MIT is big. Because it is so big it can be so specialized. MIT has an ice rink, a museum two barber shops, its own medical facility(I've heard good things about MIT medical), a sailing pavillion, SCUBA PE classes, theater groups with amazing resources, so many options of where to live. The only thing you couldn't find is a fashion club. ;-) At MIT you have choices because you have enough oddball people field the obscure activites and things seem to happen there. At the same time I imagine that you may be stuck with "200 channels and nothing on TV" syndrome. Or stuck wondering where people have time to get anything done.<br>
You will be able to find intimacy in specialization. Living groups and courses have identities and there are departments where everyone knows your name.
The professor at Wellesley with whom I have the best out-of-class/we-chat-about-the most-random-things relationship is an MIT alum and lifer (BS, MS,PhD). He reminsces about the activities and traditions and the way things are done there like it's something amazing. It sure makes me feel like MIT is a great place (even though I don't go there except for this one class I'm taking this semester). But you can get the same impression about Wellesley. We have traditions, like Lake Day, Hoop Rolling, Senior decorating, spring week, and stepsinging. I've gone on great research opportunties and done things that I would not be able to do at any other institution. This professor is not as entranced with Wellesley as most people are, but he has told me how some MIT depts (courses) can be hostile towards undergraduates (it really depends on the situation) and has noted that MIT students/graduates who think they are pretty smart because they are at MIT are not always open to learning how to do things by baby-steps or will take on jobs that are far too big for them and screw up royally. The outside world puts the Institute on a pedestal; I've found people from MIT to be smart, oh yes, but pretty mortal (but I am used to intense people). Rejecting so many smart people just makes the lucky ones seem smarter than they actually are. (applies to Olin too) This same prof has an insane amount of pride in the school and respect for anyone who graduates from it. It's an alum thing that applies to every school. Traditions and nostalgia are what you make of them.
You can bet Olin will have it too. Someday.<br>
I was with a bunch of MIT students far far away from Cambridge in January. They were actually worried that they would have to explain their school, and mentioned using "Good Will Hunting" as a barometer (be grateful it's not "Mona Lisa Smile").</p>

<p>This was really long and rambly (and I'm getting tired and making no sense and I apologize), but the point is that if you recognize what you are getting into for what it is, then it will not be an issue. Both places will be stressful, prestigous, and fun. Don't pick a school because of what others will think: Olin will give you the skills to overcome any setbacks its obscurity could bring. MIT has a lot of resources available.</p>

<p>Oh and reply to clarify if I make no sense. I will try to do so when more awake</p>

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<p>I'm a current Olin freshman, and I had to make the decision between Olin and MIT last year.</p>

<p>My decision was incredibly difficult, especially considering all the other schools that came into play too (Columbia's C. Prescott Davis Scholar program was really tempting). I had people telling me to go to MIT, to go to Columbia, to go to Brown, to go to Carnegie Mellon- basically, they told me to go to every school except Olin. </p>

<p>There was a little while when I also just really wanted people to convince me to go to MIT or Columbia. What stopped me, though, was that I simply couldn't imagine giving up Olin forever without getting incredibly depressed. I cried quite a few times over this supposedly wonderful decision laid out for me. I personally feel like I would've really enjoyed a lot of aspects of MIT's culture. What I realized, though, was that there were also many things that I felt fit me more at Olin. It's really easy to find research opportunities, it's really easy to get to know your professors closely, and it's really easy to find absolutely amazing people. These things were important to me.</p>

<p>The thing is, having people debate out your decision on some random college forum is sort of a cop out. All the people that chose MIT here chose it for a reason, while all of the people who chose Olin chose it for a reason. You should not choose a school unless the reasons that you choose it are for you. Regardless of whether you choose MIT or Olin, if you choose it because you feel like you "should" go there, there's a good chance you might regret your decision. I might love the professors, but you might hate that you can't be anonymous at Olin. Visit both again, if you aren't sure, and see how things really work. CPW is great, though I did feel like I didn't quite see how MIT truly ran then. I would still recommend it, though, because it gives a sense of the culture.</p>

<p>Anyway, that's my two cents. Make your own decision. </p>

<p>Also, Olin currently has BioE as a concentration for a general engineering diploma. It's popular enough that the requirements are pretty established and, I think, easy to take. I've heard that they're probably going to make it a full major soon- supposedly there are more BioE's in my year than mechies, but we haven't declared yet.</p>

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It's really easy to find research opportunities

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I've got to say, this is a huge misconception about MIT - I find it hard to believe that it's easier to find research opportunities at Olin than at MIT.</p>

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it's really easy to find absolutely amazing people.

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As I see it, it's just as easy to find amazing people at MIT, there's just more of them.</p>

<p>It's probably true that it's easier to get to know professors at Olin than MIT, because our professors are just busier people - but anybody wants to can have a lot of contact of any of their professors. I may have a different experience than most though, because I skipped 2/3 of the GIRs.</p>

<p>I wanted to step in because I think these things about finding research and getting to know professors are terrible misconceptions about MIT that don't seem to have any basis. But I agree with spiral (read his long post); you're not going to get a good answer - make up your own mind. MIT has more resources, and more history, you'll be connected to more people and more channels, it's in the city... Olin is kind of the opposite, and whether or not that's a good thing depends on who you are.</p>

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<p>Until very recently I did not know anything about Olin. The more I learn about it , the more I like it. I wish I could attend it.</p>

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<p>I'm a girl, for the record :)</p>

<p>I understand that there are amazing people at MIT too; I didn't mean to imply otherwise. As for the research, all I can say is what I've experienced at Olin. I came into Olin with pretty much no robotics experience, but I was approved to work in Gill Pratt's robotics lab this semester. All it took was talking to him briefly and writing up a proposal. My team has bi-weekly design reviews, and hasn't had any issues due to the fact that we aren't as experienced. Instead, we've been learning from the more experienced upperclassmen that work in the lab with us. I have many other friends that are freshmen who had similar experiences.</p>

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<p>someperson, are you emily?</p>

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<p>Let me clarify.</p>

<p>My post is not meant to trivialize Olin. Instead, I meant to bring to attention what is clearly a bias on the part of the original poster.</p>

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Same is available at Olin. No huge course VI classes, more personal attention, brand-name faculty. (I heard somewhere that MIT has a memorial or something with Gill Pratt's name on it. He left MIT for Olin.) And even if the classes get smaller in the electives, I think personal attention is more important in the beginning when people are just learning how to swim..

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<p>Now please... anyone can see that he is clearly already convinced he wants to go to Olin...</p>

<p>I also find it a bit rediculous to come to the MIT discussion board with such a viewpoint and try to debate everyone who brings up positive points about MIT.</p>

<p>Yes, I have heard some good things about Olin, and there are probably some positives about it that may make it a better fit for some people.</p>

<p>However, being the biased MIT student I am, I cannot help but plug the school that I attend and love. There are some pretty gosh-darned qualified people on the waitlist who are praying for the chance at a spot.</p>

<p>My point... if you are already decided, please let MIT know, and give those other students a chance.</p>

<p>Thanks.</p>