<p>It seems like 100% online MBA's are becoming more and more popular for obvious reasons... has/is anybody pursuing/pursued an online MBA? If so, was it hard, did employers look down on it?</p>
<p>To me, it seems like online schooling is becoming the way to go and employers are going to eventually be forced to hire online graduates at the same rate they hire brick and mortar graduates. Just some thoughts.</p>
<p>Since the main purpose, officially or not, of a top MBA is networking, the online MBAs don't sound like a good idea. Not much bonding or contacts would happen online. If you want to establish some sort of academic credibility about the subject/field you are interested in, well, perhaps. But you may be better off saving your money, studying on your own, and getting different licenses (eg CFA, CFP, CPA, CMA, 63, 7, etc.) </p>
<p>However, what do you mean by employers? I seriously doubt uber-selective fields like I-Banking, Consulting, PE, VC, etc, will settle for online degrees.</p>
<p>personally, i think online degrees are a joke. I dunno how employers feel about it but i think any mba from a top 100 program > university phoenix degree.</p>
<p>However, some of the more prestigious schools offer online degrees...( e.g. Penn State--MBA, etc.) not just UOP--which I agree, is a joke--not just because it's online but it's also proprietary--and I can't really trust a proprietary school's intentions. </p>
<p>I think 100% online degrees are a little sketchy, but if a school mixes the online technology with meeting in classes to create more flexibility for busy students (come on, any MBA student worth their weight should be very busy), I think it's ok.</p>
<p>The big diesel, shaq daddy has one, so OBVIOUSLY its a legit. He is a graduate from the prestigious University of Phoenix online!</p>
<p>"but if a school mixes the online technology with meeting in classes to create more flexibility for busy students (come on, any MBA student worth their weight should be very busy)"</p>
<p>Yes, what you mention there is called an "Executive-MBA." It is designed for successful people that have achieved senior positions w/o the help of a traditional MBA. Wharton has probably the best one, with classes being offered at Penn and at their Satellite campus in Palo Alto. But these people tend to be extremely sucessful and accomplished in one way or another. The profiles of the people I've read about usually include top schools, masters and Phds and executive positions at leading companies. They usually meet over the weekend and do the rest online.</p>
<p>Nevertheless, I think it's unlikely that employers will change their ways--why change what works?</p>
<p>Why would a 23/24 year old who was just kicked out of Goldman Sachs after two or three years as an analyst want to stay in his room in front of a computer? B-school is supposed to be fun.</p>
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Since the main purpose, officially or not, of a top MBA is networking, the online MBAs don't sound like a good idea. Not much bonding or contacts would happen online.
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<p>Well, the truth is, while networking probably ought to be the main purpose of a top MBA, for some people, it is not so. I know people at top MBA programs such as MITSloan and HBS who, quite frankly, hardly participated in any networking at all. Some of these people had spouses and children and therefore simply didn't have the time to do much networking. But then there were those other people who, honestly, just didn't WANT to network. For them, school was school, and they eschewed the EC's and social events. </p>
<p>Personally, I question the judgment of some of these people because I think they threw away the most valuable part of the MBA experience. I also somewhat question the judgment of the adcom for admitting people who were clearly antisocial. But having said that, I think it's clear that these people would have been better served through an online MBA. Honestly, if you're just not going to network, then, for you, what's the difference between an online MBA and a traditional MBA? Quite frankly, I think everybody would have been better off if Sloan or HBS had served these students via an online MBA program. After all, their experience was basically a 'de-facto' online MBA.</p>
<p>It's not just about networking, though. Group projects and activities that require teamwork are a mainstay of current MBA programs, and employers want to see that MBA candidates have been successful working in teams. I'm not sure how many of these kinds of experiences an online MBA candidate would have.</p>
<p>By RONALD J. ALSOP
Staff Reporter of The Wall Street Journal </p>
<p>From The Wall Street Journal Online</p>
<p>Part-time, online and executive M.B.A. programs may be growing in popularity, but the traditional full-time degree still rules with corporate recruiters.</p>
<p>In the short run, students who take an alternative approach to a full-time, two-year program are reducing their opportunity costs by continuing to draw a paycheck. But they aren't necessarily getting the degree that will most impress corporate recruiters and jump-start their careers.</p>
<p>Given the choice, for example, Lori Massad generally will pick a full-time graduate over a part-timer when she recruits for the management-consulting firm Marakon Associates. She has an especially keen perspective on different types of M.B.A. programs, having taught both part-time and full-time students as an adjunct professor at New York University's Stern School of Business.</p>
<p>"What I really like about full-time students is that their experience mirrors the consulting experience," says Ms. Massad, chief talent officer and partner at Marakon. "They have been brainstorming and solving problems in teams with people who have different skills and different styles, and they have developed a high level of focus and intensity."</p>
<p>Despite the full-time advantage, however, some part-timers still can make the cut at Marakon. Their redeeming attributes, Ms. Massad says, would be experience as a consultant or general manager working with teams, plus a broad network of business connections. "We like students who have a strong network of referrals and can help build the business," she says.</p>
<p>What's Missing</p>
<p>M.B.A. Lite-that's what many corporate recruiters call the various alternatives to a full-time program. In The Wall Street Journal/Harris Interactive survey, recruiters viewed all three of the major alternative approaches, particularly online programs, as inferior to full-time degrees. About 30% of recruiters said they don't believe executive programs build students' skills nearly as well as full-time programs, while slightly more-34%-found part-time programs much less effective.</p>
<p>The verdict on online degrees is much more negative: About 80% of recruiters said these programs aren't as effective in developing skills as a full-time M.B.A. In fact, nearly 40% of recruiters rated them as "not at all effective." Doina Timpau, a survey respondent and competitive-intelligence manager for Shell Hydrogen BV in the Netherlands, says what's missing from online programs is the valuable student interaction. She often learned the most as an M.B.A. from fellow students who brought abstract business problems to life for her.</p>
<p>"It wasn't just the fact that people would talk about things they had gone through, challenges they had faced and the ways in which they had or hadn't dealt with them," she says. "It was also gesticulation, facial expression, all those elements of nonverbal communication that often count more than words themselves. You also develop relationships for life; a sort of esprit de corps emerges that will stay with you to the day when you pick up the phone to call an M.B.A. buddy for help or to offer another your advice."</p>
<p>Richer Experience</p>
<p>Most recruiters agree with Ms. Timpau that the full-time M.B.A. is a much richer experience-as much about clubs, guest speakers, close interaction with classmates and professors, and networking with alumni as it is about the curriculum. "Full-time students have made earning the M.B.A. their job and are immersed 12 to 16 hours a day," says John Lanning, a survey respondent and sales and marketing recruiting and training manager at 3M Co. "Such full immersion provides significant growth and development."</p>
<p>What recruiters think about alternative M.B.A. programs is increasingly important to graduates. More executive and part-time M.B.A. students are hoping to use their degrees as a ticket not only to a better job but also to a different company. And they want the same level of career-placement services as full-time students traditionally have received.</p>
<p>Schools are responding to their demands by hiring staffers focused exclusively on placement for part-time students-to provide job leads and advice on networking, writing r</p>
<p>(continued)</p>
<p>Part-Time Dissatisfaction</p>
<p>Part-time programs come next in the pecking order, with many recruiters cynical about how much students attending school after a long day of work gain from the experience. </p>
<p>"The focus isn't there-there's too much going on in a student's life to drink in what is being taught," one survey respondent commented. "Many go part-time just to get the three letters-M.B.A.-behind their name." Some recruiters even said they would be more inclined to hire a top performer at an undergraduate business school than a part-time M.B.A. graduate.</p>
<p>Such recruiter opinions are producing some unhappy part-timers. When the Graduate Management Admission Council surveyed M.B.A. alumni recently, it found that only 17% of part-time graduates were extremely satisfied that their degree had increased their career options.</p>
<p>Part-timers sometimes feel like second-class citizens when it comes to recruiting. At NYU's Stern School, a Career Center for Working Professionals provides part-timers with career counseling, a database of job postings, networking events, mock-interview programs, and seminars on such topics as job loss and career switching. But Stern decided to bar part-timers from seeking interviews with campus recruiters who are in the market primarily for full-time students. That change riled some part-timers, who feel cheated. They contend that they had enrolled at Stern believing they could sign up for interviews with all on-campus recruiters.</p>
<p>Gary Fraser, associate dean for M.B.A. student affairs at Stern, has heard the students' complaints and understands their perspective. But he says the policy was changed because "hundreds of part-time students went through the interviewing process with poor placement results." He stresses that the change certainly "was not meant to punish the part-time students." NYU found, Mr. Fraser says, that part-timers weren't a good match for many recruiters who were looking for younger, less experienced full-time students.</p>
<p>To be sure, not all recruiters devalue part-time M.B.A. graduates. David Sanderson, the head of global recruiting at management-consulting firm Bain & Co., finds that part-timers bring more work experience, which often proves valuable. "There certainly are trade-offs," he says. "Frankly, we look at individuals and their accomplishments and capabilities, without distinguishing part-time from full-time from executive."</p>
<p>Panning the Internet</p>
<p>In the Journal survey, recruiters reserved their most savage comments for increasingly popular online M.B.A. degrees. "Come on," one respondent said. "Anyone in the world can do an online M.B.A. It's a commodity." Another said he had been asked to teach courses in online programs for which he felt unqualified, leading him to conclude that they are "scams."</p>
<p>While students certainly gain useful knowledge, there is much debate over the value of learning in front of a computer screen. Recruiters question the admissions standards at some programs that don't require students to take the Graduate Management Admission Test. They also complain that there's too little personal contact to develop critical communication and teamwork skills.</p>
<p>"The value of interacting in dynamic, difficult team situations with a peer set of highly motivated, intelligent, aspiring, successful individuals is lost in the online setting," says Brad Nichol, a survey respondent and consultant in New Jersey. To him, at least half the value of his M.B.A. came from the high-quality international network he built. "My network at London Business School was constructed on a continual basis in the classroom, in professor's offices, in the pub, on the sports field and on group trips," he says. "I don't believe this is possible to achieve to the same degree online."</p>
<p>Solitary learning at a computer is indeed at odds with the trend in M.B.A. education toward more, not less, contact with other students, professors and business executives. What's more, business schools are incorporating more practical content into the curriculum, such as consulting projects for companies that require time and personal interaction.</p>
<p>"As a full-time M.B.A. student, my analysis and strategy skills were tested many times in business-case competitions," says survey respondent Todd Wodzinski, a market development manager for Dow Chemical Co.'s automotive business. "I felt like I had gained a true gut feel for what worked and didn't work in the business world. I also gained valuable experience leading teams full of different personalities from different cultures."</p>
<p>He finds that colleagues and acquaintances who went the online route often have more trouble delivering "real-world results" when they can't depend on a textbook for the answer. "While they have mechanically gone through the motions of earning the M.B.A.," he says, "they lack the personal transformation that happens when immersed in a full-time, on-campus program. Online degree earners tend to stay in the mind-set of their previous job."</p>
<p>The head of an investment-management firm in Carmel, Calif., who responded to the survey doesn't believe online M.B.A. programs attract the right kind of students for his needs. "The investment field attracts naturally competitive individuals," he says, "and generally speaking, highly competitive individuals find a way to go to the top schools to prove themselves and avoid the online options."</p>
<p>A Successful Blend?</p>
<p>While recruiters consider fully online programs an incomplete education, they may find the increasingly popular practice of blending online and classroom instruction more appealing. Duke University's Fuqua School of Business is one of the most ardent proponents of blended learning. "Interacting in a face-to-face fashion is critical" for part of the program, says John Gallagher, associate dean for executive programs. "That immersion with the entire group allows the distance portion to function well."</p>
<p>Duke is sensitive about being linked with online M.B.A. programs with lower academic standards, and even tends to avoid using the word "online." Instead, it describes its programs as "Internet mediated" or "Internet enabled."</p>
<p>Duke's euphemistic approach to online learning is understandable. While Duke is certainly a respected institution, some marketers of online degrees clearly amount to little more than diploma mills. Spam emails promise people they'll earn more money if they "get a business degree FAST." There was even a bogus operation that awarded an M.B.A. to a cat.</p>
<p>Nevertheless, Mark Rice, dean of the Olin Graduate School of Business at Babson College, believes many schools and recruiters are unaware of the benefits of e-learning. For example, an online discussion wouldn't seem to measure up to a lively classroom debate. But Dr. Rice argues that discussions on the Internet can actually be more fruitful, "because loudmouths can't dominate the way they do in a classroom, where thoughtful people don't get a word in edgewise." Babson offers a "fast-track M.B.A.," which combines Internet and classroom teaching and allows students to finish the degree in 26 months, which is 10 months sooner than in the traditional part-time evening program.</p>
<p>"Online M.B.A.s may not have the same market power and cachet right now as other types of degrees," says Dr. Rice. "But I predict that 10 years from now, there will be top managers at companies who did an online program and who will be able to say it worked for them."</p>
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It's not just about networking, though. Group projects and activities that require teamwork are a mainstay of current MBA programs, and employers want to see that MBA candidates have been successful working in teams. I'm not sure how many of these kinds of experiences an online MBA candidate would have.
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<p>Well, quite frankly, the honest truth is, some full-time MBA students at the top schools don't have good teamwork skills either. I think this is especially prevalent at HBS, where students are taught to be highly self-reliant and to demand leadership roles (as opposed to follower roles) to the point that one of the perennial complaints by recruiters about HBS grads is that they 'don't play well with others'. </p>
<p>So, what I am saying is, if you know you're not going to use the MBA experience to build your network (either because you can't, or you just don't want to), and you also know that you don't work well as a team-player (which is true of some grads of the top MBA students, especially at HBS), and you don't intend to change your personality, then, honestly, you probably would be better off with a properly structured online MBA.</p>
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The title M.B.A. has to be taken with a grain of salt today
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<p>OUCH!! I guess the best three letters a business person can have behind their name don't start with an M, but rather a C (CPA, CFA, CMA, CFM, CFP, CIA, and CITP)</p>
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Honestly, if you're just not going to network, then, for you, what's the difference between an online MBA and a traditional MBA?
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One of the main reasons most top MBA programs want their new students to have work experience before they start their MBA is so they can SHARE their work experiences and learn from the experiences of their classmates. Case studies and the group discussion around the cases is at the core of most top MBA programs. It seems to me an on-line MBA program would miss a core part of the MBA experience.</p>
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One of the main reasons most top MBA programs want their new students to have work experience before they start their MBA is so they can SHARE their work experiences and learn from the experiences of their classmates. Case studies and the group discussion around the cases is at the core of most top MBA programs.
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<p>Not to sound like a broken record, but again, what you are talking about is the ideal. It doesn't always happen in practice. Like I said, there are some students at the top B-schools who simply aren't interested in sharing their work experience or learning from the experiences of others. Personally, if it was up to me, I would simply not admit these people, but nobody ever asked me. </p>
<p>Hence, if these top B-schools are going to be admitting these people who are simply not interested in the social benefits of a full-time program, then you might as well create an online MBA program for them. Honestly, what's the difference?</p>
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Case studies and the group discussion around the cases is at the core of most top MBA programs.
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<p>Hate to burst any prestige bubbles, but I believe this is at the core of all MBA programs. </p>
<p>On a separate note, is the networking/collaborating in b-school for each person's selfish reasons in trying to gain the upper hand in salary, politics, etc? If the core focus of b-school is "networking to get ahead", why pay $50,000 to do it? There are other routes that seem more logical, and produce similar results. Join a professional organization and go to their monthly meetings, and become one of their leaders. It's much cheaper and would essentially produce similar results, because, again, "The title M.B.A. has to be taken with a grain of salt today." </p>
<p>It seems like the only reason to do an MBA would be if you did your undergrad in something very low on the demand totem pole... Accounting undergrads doing an MBA in today's market seems like a waste of money...they'd be better off obtaining specialized certifications like CPA, CMA, etc. and then networking with other professionals and colleagues in their industry/professional org. Same with Finance undergrads.</p>
<p>Just some thoughts.</p>
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Hate to burst any prestige bubbles, but I believe this is at the core of all MBA programs
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you're quite right ... it should have been something more like ... at the core of most on-site class based MBA programs.</p>
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It seems like the only reason to do an MBA would be if you did your undergrad in something very low on the demand totem pole...
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<p>I think the biggest reason by far is for those people who want a career change. For example, what if you want to get into consulting or Ibanking? You can't just walk up to one of these firms and demand a job. Generally, they only hire people fresh out of school (either undergrad or B-school). </p>
<p>Sure, you might say that the person should have gotten in right out of undergrad, but what if you didn't make it then (as most undergrads who try to get into consulting or banking are denied)? What are you going to do now? If you still want in, then one of the few paths you can take is via an MBA program. Picking up a bunch of business certs and networking with a bunch of people in your industry isn't really going to help you transition to Ibanking. </p>
<p>I agree that if you just want to stay in your field and keep doing what you're doing, then you don't really need an MBA. But I think most people pursuing elite MBA's are doing so because they want to do something different. Or, at least, have the chance to do something different. </p>
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Accounting undergrads doing an MBA in today's market seems like a waste of money...they'd be better off obtaining specialized certifications like CPA, CMA, etc. and then networking with other professionals and colleagues in their industry/professional org. Same with Finance undergrads.
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<p>I think studies have shown that a strong majority of people who obtained MBA's from top programs do not regret their choice. You have to remember that salaries tend to pick up tremendously a few years after obtaining the MBA. Starting salaries are therefore highly misleading indicators with which to judge the value of the MBA. </p>
<p>I do agree that it's probably not worth it to pay for a full-time MBA at a no-name school.</p>
<p>What about someone who wants to learn more management and leadership skills, but do not want to change fields?</p>
<p>I'm doing my MBA at UOP in Boston. it's about 80% online and 20% campus. Im doing it for networking purposes, salary increase, marketability, and to widen my career options. The reason I'm not going for something specific like a CPA is because I don't want to get stuck in a career. I chose UOP because of the price, the flexible schedule, and because they are leading the online charge. Schools like Harvard U are studying UOP's format because of it's success and popularity. I gaurantee you that UOP is no walk in the park but it is exactly what I was looking for.</p>