OOS for the UCs...?

College Search & Selection
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<p>As they don’t appear to publish the stats all we can use is common sense. My common sense says no one in their right mind who has much higher than the general Cal or UCLA student’s stats would pay $46K/yr for them when clearly that person can get into top private college with much better aid and/or that cost only a few thousand more per year.</p>

<p>Let’s see, an ivy with great aid over Cal with a 60% 4 year graduation rate and lines for everything. Anyone as smart as what you describe woul have a no brainer with that one.</p>

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<p>Just for info sake, there are 10 University of California schools.</p>

<p>Berkeley
Davis
Irvine
Los Angeles
Merced
Riverside
San Diego
San Francisco
Santa Barbara
Santa Cruz</p>

<p>Take out San Francisco because it’s only for graduate medical students. So now you have 9 choices. The unofficially named Top Tier schools are Berkeley, Los Angeles, and San Diego. They’re in the top tier because of the caliber of students they admit, their impact on the nation/world, the quality of their programs, and other criteria.</p>

<p>If you’re interested in academics, I recommend researching statistics about undergraduate students and their majors. Often it’s the case that the most popular major gets the most attention from the university. Meaning that a lot of resources are put where the students are.</p>

<p>Berkeley’s strengths are in computer engineering, political science, and English language/literature.</p>

<p>Los Angeles’ most popular majors are business, political science, and psychology.</p>

<p>San Diego’s most popular majors are biology, economics, and psychology.</p>

<p>For science I would definitely recommend San Diego. It’s bioengineering program is #2 in the nation behind Johns Hopkins. Out of the Top Tier UC’s it definitely has the strongest science approach and has the most students in science majors. Additionally, there are a lot of biotech and pharmaceuticals based in San Diego. After that I would recommend Irvine, Davis, and Santa Cruz.</p>

<p>Davis is historically an agricultural school, so a lot of its science is on biology, animals, and genetics. Santa Cruz is a wonderful school for ecology and wildlife, its mascot is after all a banana slug.</p>

<p>If you’re going into medicine, some of the UC’s, but not all have med schools and hospitals. They include San Francisco (no undergrad program). Los Angeles, San Diego, Irvine, Davis, and Merced. Often the school’s with med schools understand the importance of science, are innovators, and positively impact their community.</p>

<p>Based on the information you’ve provided about yourself and your desires, I’ll make the following personal recommendations (in order):</p>

<p>San Diego for its incredible strength in all sciences. The chancellor has a PhD in chemistry. It has the name recognition, and has a moderate holistic approach. It sends the most students abroad of any UC, bioengineering is top ranked, and its #3 in the nation for theater and dance. San Diego has a tendency to be really good at things that aren’t always related. If you’re into sports there are some down sides here. San Diego is the only school in NCAA Division II, has no football team, but boasts top ranked mens water polo, mens volleyball, and ultimate frisbee teams. Quiet area, away from downtown and urban life, close to the beaches.</p>

<p>Los Angeles for its holistic approach. Though its top programs might not be in science, its a wonderful school and any degree from here is worth noting. It has wonderful student life, great athletic teams, and a great social scene; students never seem to be bored here. It’s adjacent to Westwood where celebrities are often cited and close enough to the bustle of one of the nation’s largest cities/metropolitan areas.</p>

<p>Irvine is often ranked #4 of the UC’s and has good programs all around. Think of it as the little brother to the previously mentioned campuses. Its in Orange County, so think The Hills, OC, and some of the teams from America’s Best Dance Crew.</p>

<p>Davis for its commitment to science. It started out as the Berkeley extension of agricultural science, but became its own university. I say its the second best bet for science, but recommended it after Los Angeles and Irvine because of its selectivity and student life. It’s in farm land and relatively far from a major city. There are no major airports nearby, so traveling between NJ and Davis would be difficult.</p>

<p>I know it’s lengthy, but I hope this helped. I remember being in your shoes, trying to rank schools without knowing much. It’s hard trying to make decisions about schools and universities you know nothing about. Let me know if you need anything else. Three years in a UC school has given me some insight.</p>

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<p>hmom5-thanks for all of the info. about % admit. rates…i wasn’t aware. i was also thinking about the possibility of “…UC’s desperately need the high tuitions OOS students bring,” so that’s validated now.
oaksmom-yes, we will definitely keep money in mind. & i’ve told him in the past that legacy wouldn’t could, but he refuses to accept this, lol.</p>

<p>are any aforementioned privates [USC, U of San Diego (Catholic), Loyola Marymount (also Catholic), and Pepperdine] strong in the sciences/social sciences? also i’m not catholic…or religious…would that matter environment-wise?</p>

<p>wow, thanks for all of the great info., triton! i’ll definitely keep everything u said in mind :)</p>

<p>regarding class size, does anyone know if any of the schools take more of a personal learning approach between professors & students?</p>

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<p>Oh no, you’re very wrong, hmom5, on this one.
My father is a friend to the Banataos. The Banataos children are now attending computer science at Berkeley spending more than 50k per year, despite being admitted (with scholarship) at some of the finest private schools whom you’d rather choose than Berkeley.
Another friends daughters who both graduated from De La Salle Zobel in Manila chose Berkeley over Yale (with aid), Duke (with aid) and Columbia, and are paying the full price at Cal.
If you’d read posts in the International Thread, you’d see that there are many, many students who are willing to pay 50k grand per year to attend Berkeley. I will attend Berkeley comsci for its current price tag of 45-50k grand per year than an Ivy League school, except Harvard and Princeton. And, I’m quite sure there are a lot of rich Americans out there who are just like me. </p>

<p>

But the thing is, many fresh high school graduates don’t have the same mentality like you have. If every kid in America think like you do, no one would probably go to Berkeley. But such is not the case. Kids want to enjoy college whilst studying. And Berkeley is such a lively place for college students.</p>

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<p>Maybe it’s an international thing because I don’t know any American’s who would choose Cal OOS over an ivy or peer school, especially with aid. The UC’s have low 4 year graduation rates, they are over crowded, on campus housing is a problem, their resources are over taxed in general and it can be very difficult to get classes. They are in financial crisis. Maybe that info doesn’t make it’s way across oceans?</p>

<p>Engineering is also much more popular with internationals than Americans, especially wealthy Americans who can afford that tuition. So I do see where Cal may be attractive among some international communities. Asian ones in particular because of engineering interest and the huge Asian communities at the schools and in CA.</p>

<p>My DS at MIT is considered weird in affluent American circles for his interest in engineering.</p>

<p>The UC’s are a good deal for $25K, but most posting on these threads and those I know IRL do not see the value at $46K.</p>

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<p>^ Well, check the revealed preferences survey, even though I think it was a highly criticized table. There you can see that Berkeley wasn’t zero against any Ivy including Harvard.</p>

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<p>Did the seperate out the Californians for whom Cal is half the price of an ivy? Many, many kids are there because of money.</p>

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<p>^ I agree, but many, many kids go to an Ivy over Berkeley because of money too. Ivy provides scholarships/aides to OOS and International students, but Berkeley does not.</p>

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<p>Which brings us back to the question: Who in their right mind would pay for Berkeley over an ivy with aid?</p>

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<p>^ I already answered that. Hundreds of students every year attend Berkeley as an OOS and International and some of them have been admitted to an Ivy League school/s. I already told you that such people exist. Now it’s up to you to believe it or not. I personally know of several people who’ve chosen Berkeley over an Ivy League school for reason of fit, environment preferences, prestige, specific course/program strength or orientation like both parents went there. hmom5, whether you agree with me or not, I, for one, would prefer Berkeley computer science than Columbia, UPenn, Dartmouth, Brown and Cornell’s. I would think twice if I get into Y. I would prefer H and P to Berkeley’s, however. But not everyone gets into HYP. Yes, people like me exist. You just don’t want to believe that we do. That’s the problem here. But we exist.</p>

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<p>Of course there is no data, but my guess is you could count on both hands the number of kid’s at Cal paying more than any ivy would have cost them.</p>

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<p>^ I suggest that you refrain from saying that conclusively until you can present data.
We do know that there are more than 2,000 OOS and International students at Berkeley right now. To say that only 10 students, or less than that, are there for reason of preference, prestige and program strength is unfair and unjustified. I really suggest that you present data next time.</p>