OSU v. Vanderbilt

Colleges and Universities A-Z Vanderbilt University
1

Hi everybody,

I am stuck with the decision between OSU and Vanderbilt. To give some background, I applied to VU for Neuroscience and to OSU for Biochemistry. Vanderbilt has been my top choice since freshman year, so naturally my acceptance was/is exciting and rewarding. I’ve been planning on pursuing an MD after undergraduate study.

The main issue comes down to cost. Under normal circumstances I understand that OSU would be the place to go. The main caveat is that I am as set on surgery as one can be. (I know that the typical response is that plans change often, but I’ve had the opportunity to observe in the OR and clinic over 500 hours… I’ve observed hundreds of procedures and I’ve spent my school breaks at this hospital, so I have experienced the 12-14 hour workday that surgeons have to endure.) My main goal is to infuse a surgical career with research, mainly by applying for MSTP.

Am I crazy for choosing Vandy? The undergrad debt could be anywhere from 100k-140k as opposed to 20k-30k at OSU. If I were to be accepted to an MSTP program then undergrad debt wouldn’t be nearly as pressing, and I’ve been assured by VU students and staff that Vandy has had great success in getting kids into MSTP. (Please no discussion about the lost time of MSTP, I’ve already thought about the extra school and the salary situation.)

My parents have basically left the choice up to me. I know that the debt at Vandy is cringe-worthy, but I also know that with smart investments and by living below my means I CAN handle the debt. The consensus of the doctors I work with has been to pursue Vanderbilt as well, mainly because of my intent on earning a PhD as well. And yes, I know about the compounding interest… I’ve spent hours and hours crunching numbers and thinking of the interest that will accrue.

All of that might be enough for some of you to give a reply, but I’m just going to list some other stuff down here and elaborate on my exact feelings. Thanks in advance!

I would be able to get recommendation letters from my doctors right now in advance for medical school. These doctors actually have connections with both the OSU MSTP program and the Vanderbilt program.

How do I know surgery is right for me? I can feel it in my heart. I know that sounds really cheesy and not convincing, but the doctors I’ve been observing describe it the EXACT same way. They say: “Knowing you’re meant for surgery is like knowing that you’ve met your future wife. You can just feel it. It consumes your thoughts and actions.” This is exactly how I feel… I have spent the past 5 months dreaming about the OR and operating. I felt a rush the very first day I observed in the OR. No light-headedness, instead I felt a serious drive inside me.

If it matters at all, I’ve been working with neurosurgeons and head/neck cancer surgeons. I’ve been set on neurosurgery but also have considered cardio/thoracics. I’ve been learning the actual surgical procedures step by step… (Ask me how to perform a minimally invasive resection of a suprasellar mass through the nose :wink: ).

Note about OSU. I’m actually from Columbus, and have taken several classes at OSU via dual enrollment. It is a great institution but personally I did not like the feel of the classrooms and the attitudes of the students… I was taking advanced Honors classes as well. Plus, I also think that college should be a time of self growth/independence, and, knowing myself, I would be back at my house every other weekend instead of on campus. Just a consideration… Maybe too close to home.

One final note (sorry if this is long, I’m on my phone posting and I want you guys to have all the details), I am planning on working in Nashville (should I end up there) all four years, so that will contribute to tuition (probably around 13000-20000, an appreciable amount).

Thanks for bearing with me. I’m sorry if I wrote too much. Also sorry for the generic school choice post.

Cardinal

2

Hi Cardinal:

As a potential neurosurgeon, ENT or cardiothoracic surgeon, your college debt will not be significant compared to your eventual earnings. I recommend Vandy for undergrad. Come back to OSU for med school if you want to contain costs.
(I am OSUCOM graduate.)

VUboyngirl

3

WHOA…Whoa There! Slow down. Respectfully stated, you have no idea what you are talking about at this stage, I don’t care how many hours you have spent in the OR. Just see if Medical School remains your choice during/after college first. Then just get into Medical School, and see how your rotations go. Wait until you see how you handle the incredibly complex daily existence of surgeons and doctors in general…believe me actual OR work is the LEAST of it. Slow down with flight of ideas, one step at a time! I am an MD, and I have seen people evolve in 180 degrees opposite directions once they get a taste of real life in Medicine.

4

Considering the high divorce rate, that argument would seem to suggest not to rush into anything!

5

Cardinal, as a parent I understand your desire to attend Vandy undergrad for your overall personal growth, but we are confused. As Vandy meets all need aid with no loans, I assume this means that your parents cannot pay what Vandy considers their estimated cost of attendance number? Total sympathies there and no criticism of your parents intended --speaking as a parent who put a lot of full price at Duke for one child in 20005 on our second mortgage (stupid plan when recession hit) but son did LOVE and benefit from his four Duke years. I have been a parent who encouraged sons to apply to schools that we could not actually afford re our estimated cost of attendance. I have been a parent who informed second son that he could not attend schools that gave him little aid when it was obvious from the start that there would be little aid. There are plenty of families in this boat milling around Vandy (and other private schools) on accepted students days with fantastic financial merit offers to state flagship honors programs that the families really should accept. What each family opts to do is personal and quirky and there is no reason for you to defend your parents on this page.

It can be very disappointing to find your cost of attendance figure is too daunting, and it is usually the upper middle class that gets burned in this game. People feel they are punished for “being good” re their assets and savings sometimes. All understandable.

Rather than convince your readers of your sworn vocation as a surgeon, you need to be thinking of private loans and their impact on your future. Please use your very articulate self to sit down with parents and to pen an appeal letter to financial aid. Make sure you have turned over every stone and every sibling who will need education in an overlap time.

Whatever the reason is that you feel you must assume the bulk of your tuition costs personally, we sympathize with your feelings. If it is true that your parents for whatever personal reasons can’t take this on, I recommend you go to OSU and concentrate on landing a very high MCAT score. There is no doubt in my mind that you can do it. After all you already went through the eye of a needle for admittance to Vandy undergrad.

We are now parenting two middle 20 somethings who have been working, supporting themselves and are now in grad school. It is very Un-Glamorous once you really face the costs of med school or any grad school education. Both sons are not attending top 15 grad schools in their fields but instead followed the money and Duke son is working a difficult job while going to grad school at night. Vandyson turned down his modest offer at Vandy Law and took a big tuition gift from another law school.

Your 20s are a difficult passage financially. Many many bills and parents not necessarily around to take some off your shoulders.

I think your other choice if you really don’t want to go to OSU at age 18 would be to take a year off and to focus on applications for big merit aid at schools that are not as swamped with perfect test scores.

If I were you…I would keep that momentum up, ace OSU, kill that MCAT and walk into a very fine med school which is a time to borrow that actually makes sense. I watched the Vandy Med school white coat ceremony for first year med students a couple years ago. Students were chosen for a wide range of undergrad colleges based on their talent.

Lastly, you must understand and explain to your parents that many top med schools will again ask for parental assets to determine need aid. This is called Need Access. Check your dream med schools. Many ask for parent income and stick you with an amount based on family assets till you are 28 years of age or so.

Start with your appeal. If the answer has already been delivered firmly…I would not borrow more than a Stafford Loan a year for Vandy undergrad. Just one parent’s view.

6

Just an aside, if you are planning to be a surgeon, it wouldn’t be an ideal fit for an MSTP, where the length of training will take a toll on you. The length of training it takes to be a surgeon is a long time, and added that to your PhDs, you wouldn’t be able to do your job till you are very old, even by MD/PhD standard. And if you’re a surgeon, your PhD won’t be really helpful since you will be consumed by your life as a surgeon (think of the 80/20 model for MD/PhD, see other threads, which won’t be realistic for a surgeon). Most MSTP folks ended up doing IMs or pathology.
ALthough not impossible, you could pull it off, although I don’t see the point of it, as most MSTPs will gear/train you towards a basic science/translational researcher first, and you have to decide if the surgery specialty will fit it, vice versa.

You have great options at OSU, which makes most senses financially. Being in OSU won’t hinder you from top MSTPs or MD programs. I’ve faced similar choices as a HS student, and doing well in state school helped me get many MSTP offers at many top places.

And of course, college is a great time to explore other options, which are quite vast. You never know what you will fall in love with later, even if you are so sure now.