<p>And I have to say…I think living at our home (at no cost) trumps living in a dorm room. We have 2 acres of land, a lake, plenty of room for privacy, and a car the student can use.</p>
<p>I would absolutely subsidize housing for a student having an internship.</p>
<p>I see this as a great opportunity for DD to learn money management. To start, yes, I would happily subsidize in this situation. As others have said, if you offer to provide housing in other scenarios, helping here as well is kind. Will the sublet for the summer be paid monthly like any other rent? Are utilities included? Or do you have to pay something up front? If the former, why not give her a monthly “payment” equal to the rent and let her manage her finances? If the latter, there will be fees due up front for living expenses that she will not have received reimbursement for from the internship. Why not help? Its a wonderful gift a parent can give a child, especially a responsible one who wont fritter it away at expensive clubs and shopping sprees.</p>
<p>DS #1 had 2 internships, but both were in the city where he attended school. We offered to continue to help with housing costs, but IIRC he was in a year lease and arranged to get subleasees, so the landlord gave him a big break on his rent. As thumper said, fair does not necessarily mean equal.</p>
<p>DS#2 had internships in our home town. For one summer he lived home. For the second he lived on the local tech campus (in a frat) with a friend, as he was also taking classes while interning. We paid for the housing and the classes. As others have said, they are our kids, its part of their education, with the goal of helping them launch successfully. Younger s’s internships did not pay as well as older s’s but regardless, we’d have offered to pay the same for housing for each. Neither kept “score”. It was just part of providing for their education, and the costs differed.</p>
<p>We are fortunate that both have successfully launched and are off the payroll. That said, when they come to visit, we still like to give them what we call the “obligatory $20” when they leave. Its a tradition. They’ll probably be old and grey and we’ll still try to do it.</p>
<p>In a totally different scenario, a friend of mine is retired and sadly a new widow. Her finances are challenging at the moment. She still has one in college, but the other is in his late 20’s, done, launched and making a nice salary. When he came to visit and they went out to eat, she asked him to split the bill. He was surprised at first, as in the past the parents always paid. But he understood that the situation has changed, and he paid the bill in full. Nice kid.</p>
<p>As I said earlier in this thread, and as others have said as well, fair does no always mean equal</p>
<p>What we have tried to do is to give our children equal opportunities, helping them get where they want to go. Our help has taken different forms at different times, depending upon what we could afford/do at a certain time, and also on what a child needed at that time.</p>
<p>For example, we never gave our children cars in high school, even though their friends all had (very nice) cars. We told our boys that their college graduation gift would be a generous amount of money toward a new car, so that they would have reliable transportation as they began their adult working lives.</p>
<p>Fast forward to S1’s junior year in college. S1 was offered an opportunity to teach Hebrew and Sunday school at a local congregation, but needed a car to get there. The job guaranteed him 8 hours/week at $25/hour (in 2005), and in addition he would get paid extra for Bar Mitzvah tutoring ($40/hour) or teaching trope. ($50/hour).</p>
<p>S1 was a middle eastern studies major, and wanted to make/save money to spend time in travel/immersion to work on his conversational Hebrew and Arabic.</p>
<p>We bought him his car a couple of years early. He is still driving the car.</p>
<p>Along came S2 and S3. S2 had always talked about what cars he was interested in getting, and had always saved towards the day when he would supplement what we would give him so he could get the car he wanted.</p>
<p>S2 decided to go to grad school in DC, and also realized that his career would be in DC. (he is a policy wonk). He will never need a car, or at least not any time soon. We offered him his “car money” toward his grad school tuition and expenses. He was very grateful…the funds let him focus on his studies, and on taking the internships that resulted in him getting the job he has now. The internships were paid internships, but he didn’t need to worry about working additional low paying jobs to afford school. Between the car money and his savings, and a little bit of extra subsidy from the bank of mom and dad, he got through grad school with no loans.</p>
<p>S3 graduated last spring, and also is working in DC. No need for a car for him either. But he doesn’t want his car money yet. Grad school doesn’t seem to be in his future. Time will tell what we will do for him. He feels that we gave him “more” than we gave his brothers while he was in college because we subsidized his summers in DC. Every summer, and all semesters other than his first, he had substantive internships. Almost all of them paid, just not very well… And DC is a very expensive place to live. Rent is high, the Metro is expensive, even food and toiletries cost more than elsewhere.</p>
<p>His brothers have never felt shortchanged that we did for him what we did not need to do for them–and he doesn’t feel shortchanged at not being given a big check upon graduation. He will let us know if and when he needs a substantial amount of money for something important. And, if he ends up relocating with his job (a definite possibility) maybe then he will need a car.</p>
<p>LIke jym, we are just glad all 3 are off the family payroll. A little bit of subsidizing has resulted in a very good payoff, at least in our opinion. Of course, we don’t know what each child would be doing had we not helped out. And we were lucky enough to be in a position to be able to subsidize.</p>
<p>Thank you all. I am not interested in equalizing outcome
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<p>I’m all in favor of equalizing things between siblings whenever possible (I grew up in a family that was scrupulous about this), but when we faced this kind of situation, this issue didn’t seem to matter – to them or to me.</p>
<p>In general, whether or not summer opportunities are paying, how much they pay, and where they are located depend on the career field that the student is interested in. And that’s something that varies from kid to kid. I think kids understand this and don’t get bent out of shape if mom and dad are subsidizing the non-tech kid with the low-paying internship but not the tech kid with the high-paying internship (or the kid who is not earning money because he’s on campus working on his honors project, while the sibling who is not doing honors has a paying job).</p>
<p>oldfort #160–You are right that there would not <em>have</em> to be a difference in the quality of the room/board. However, unless I am mis-recalling, Student H was going to have an apartment for the summer. (Possibly I made that up.) That’s generally different from living in a dorm.</p>
<p>Pizzagirl, suppose you had a third child, Student N (N for “nonexistent”), who was majoring in art history. Student N argues that spending time in London (perhaps to conduct independent research for a senior thesis) is crucial for college/career plans, and wants to live in Kensington. (I’ve always liked Kensington.) Would you cover that, under the general policy of providing for room and board?</p>
<p>If you are paying the room and board costs, whatever they are, is there any incentive for the actual Student H to select less expensive accommodation?</p>
<p>Most interns in NYC stay at dorms. The dorms are very safe because they only rent out to people with internship, not just anyone off the street. The cost is also a lot cheaper than renting an apartment.</p>
<p>QM…you ARE making up the apartment. The type of specific housing for the internship kid has not been mentioned here.</p>
<p>Stop making things up. It does nothing to move this conversation forward. PG does NOT have a third child. Period.</p>
<p>The use of the word “rent” was what confused me. Normally, dorm costs would be described as “housing,” though I suppose some could use “rent” for that.</p>
<p>As I mentioned earlier, I find it useful to consider hypotheticals when I am trying to decide an issue of principle–which is what Pizzagirl is trying to do, I think. Maybe it’s the frustrated philosopher in me. Whether it moves the conversation forward or not depends on the philosophical/purely pragmatic orientation of the participants. I take it that you are purely pragmatic, thumper1. That’s fine. I am not going to say that pragmatists just shut the conversation down.</p>
<p>Also, if the housing costs are not high, what’s the issue, really?</p>
<p>I think the issue may be how to treat all siblings fairly?</p>
<p>I didn’t read this whole thread, but it seems that the student is fairly responsible, appreciative, and not a wild spender. </p>
<p>In that case, I would subsidize housing to the extent that I feel my student is safe and comfortable. I am not going to spend extra $$$ on a deluxe high rise, but I am also not going to make them live in a dump. And I would do it to the extent that I could comfortably afford it. </p>
<p>I am not someone who believes in making the kid suffer and get down to his last penny just for the experience of it.</p>
<p>I think the issue may be how to treat all siblings fairly?</p>
<p>That’s part of it. As I recall he doesn’t need the money and would be saving it for the future. So, do you pay for food and housing anyway because he is still in college and you’re doing it for your other kid and that was always the plan.</p>
<p>It’s interesting.</p>
<p>Ah, the elusive concept of “fairness” to sibs. I think this can make the parents and kids crazy if they work at it too hard. For H and I, we wanted to make a good college education possible, funding that to the best of our ability. Our finances did fluctuate significantly over the years our kids were in college, since that ran from 2006-2013. Some years, we and the kids even got financial help from a beloved relative, which was much appreciated.</p>
<p>Our kids did NOT get the same amount out of our pockets. One got significant merit aid that paid 50% of his tuition for all 4 year years, plus several paid jobs and internships and other scholarships and grants over the years. The other child we were full pay, but she did get two part-time jobs in her field. </p>
<p>We felt no obligation to make sure we spent the same amount on each kid or put the equivalent in their account and still feel no such obligation. We always wanted to be sure that each had enough money to have food and safe lodging for all their years of college and summer, whether they lived with us or an internship. If either kiddo wanted/needed more funding, we instructed them to submit a budget and short proposal to us. </p>
<p>Both kids have had access to their savings (money given to us in the name of each child for birthdays, holidays, special events from loved ones) from the day they turned 18. The savings were NOT equal, as somehow S got a LOT larger gifts, probably because he was the first grandSON on both sides of the family. At some point, we may even things out when the kids are looking to buy their own place or need it for anything else.</p>
<p>As I have mentioned previously, my folks funded each of us through college and then helped pay off loans that any of us incurred for grad/pro school. The amounts were VERY different among us, but all of us were grateful for the funding we received and never felt that one got more or better than others. Dwelling on all of this can make one’s eyes cross and doesn’t seem overly healthy to me.</p>
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<p>The issue isn’t so much how high the housing costs are – it happens to be NYC, but make it Kansas City for all I care. The issues, to me, are two-fold:</p>
<ul>
<li>Is this a good opportunity to begin to take the training wheels off for a kid who has had the good fortune of being paid for up to the point – in preparation for the “real launch” (gulp)?</li>
<li>Secondarily, if I’m to move from a position of “we pay for it all” to another position, how do I coherently articulate that so it’s consistent across all scenarios that H and L may face?</li>
</ul>
<p>Note that the second one isn’t “equalize them all.” For example, in a recent summer, one kid worked a summer job while the other attended summer school. The kid who worked the job got to keep the money, the one who attended summer school we paid for – that’s fine, I wasn’t trying to equalize either $ that they wound up with or $ that I spent on each. </p>
<p>Seriously, thank you to all.</p>
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<p>The issue isn’t so much how high the housing costs are – it happens to be NYC, but make it Kansas City for all I care. The issues, to me, are two-fold:</p>
<ul>
<li>Is this a good opportunity to begin to take the training wheels off for a kid who has had the good fortune of being paid for up to the point – in preparation for the “real launch” (gulp)?</li>
<li>Secondarily, if I’m to move from a position of “we pay for it all” to another position, how do I coherently articulate that so it’s consistent across all scenarios that H and L may face?</li>
</ul>
<p>Note that the second one isn’t “equalize them all.” For example, in a recent summer, one kid worked a summer job while the other attended summer school. The kid who worked the job got to keep the money, the one who attended summer school we paid for – that’s fine, I wasn’t trying to equalize either $ that they wound up with or $ that I spent on each. </p>
<p>Seriously, thank you to all.</p>
<p>If you are moving from “we pay for it all” to some other position, maybe it would help to think about the specific rationale behind “we pay for it all”? If it becomes “we pay for it all because X” or “we pay for it all while Y” or if it has some other qualifier attached to it, perhaps that would let you develop a more detailed, yet consistent position?</p>
<p>I am thankful for this thread as we are struggling with this as well. DH and I have told DD that we will assist her if necessary while doing an internship, as we consider it part of her learning experience. I would prefer she choose this last internship based on the merits of the position vs the salary, and trust that she will be frugal. She has been a good money manager so far, and We expect that she will be this summer as well. You have to know your kid, and letting them know that you are investing in them sends it’s own message.</p>
<p>Yes, that’s it, QM. </p>
<p>I don’t mind and in fact rather like hypotheticals. So I’ve sent Kid N out to do all the holiday shopping :-)</p>
<p>Can kid N bring us back some coffee while he/she is out?</p>
<p>Congrats to QM for creating an excellent and quite useful CC meme - Kid N, who costs us not a penny and always cheerfully does our bidding!</p>