<p>eyemamom, Can you give the dr. a head’s up, either through a phone call or email, before your appt on Fri so he/she can be prepared for the kind of issues your mother is having and the kind of suggestions/support/help you’re looking for?</p>
<p>Excellent idea Shellfull!</p>
<p>@eyemamom I forget if you mentioned, but does your mom have a diagnosis of something in particular? Why the pain and breathing problems. I ask because if she does, I would start with the attending Dr of that condition and explain that it is unacceptable for her to be alone and on her own. It is so, so hard to guide parents through the medical system, even when they are fully aware and compliant.</p>
<p>Someone who can “hardly breathe” and who is in “tremendous pain” should not be at home under the care of loving but untrained caretakers. She needs to be somewhere that can treat the breathing problems and the tremendous pain.</p>
<p>So my 85 year old mom had a stroke early last summer… she has mostly recovered, still has some aphasia and is somewhat confused sometimes. My parents have lived in the same house for 50 years in the same town of about 30,000 people in the Midwest. I live about 600 miles away . After the stroke she was not allowed to drive, and what my dad said was that she would have to pass some kind of test to be allowed to again. She has not passed the test – but apparently she IS driving again. 
My brother mentioned it on the phone today (he lives near my parents), and my mom also said something when I talked to her today. They both know she is not supposed to be driving, but apparently my dad is tired of schlepping her around town to what he calls her ‘biddy functions’ (bridge, exercise class, etc.). My dad is out of town so I can’t call him about this, but I am horrified that she will hurt herself, or worse, someone else. I think my dad does know and is permitting it.</p>
<p>My parents live in a suburban home (with lots of steps), but have no interest in looking into moving to a retirement community that has transportation, etc to stores and activities. I am just aghast at this, and don’t really know what (if anything) I should do about it… any suggestions?</p>
<p>Can your brother just take away the keys? I’m a bicyclist so I probably get more upset about this than motorists, but you can’t just allow your mother to be recklessly driving a lethal weapon around. You just can’t. Bikes don’t have airbags. Kids crossing at crosswalks don’t have airbags. Unsafe drivers kill innocent people. </p>
<p>If parents cannot drive safely, I wish that children would prevent them from driving. I know it’s not easy, and I know that your father can still drive legally. But people end up injured or dead because elderly drivers are allowed to continue to drive when they shouldn’t drive. From my point of view, your father is sending out his wife to kill me. I can’t be sympathetic to that.</p>
<p>My brother is one of those “zero help” siblings even though he lives nearby. He just assumes it will all work out somehow and nothing bad will happen. The only thing I can think to do is call my brother’s wife, who is a nurse. My brother was acting kind of “hush hush” about it, and it is possible that they haven’t told his wife this is going on. She knows my mom’s doctors, and maybe could have a word with them. I just left her a message to call me. I don’t really see how I can get my mom to stop from so far away if my brother and dad are enabling, and my mom doesn’t see a problem. I don’t want to be “that kid” who is far away and trying to dictate what should happen, but this is horrifying to me. :(</p>
<p>You’re in a pickle if your brother won’t help, intparent. Good idea to call your sister-in-law. I hope she takes the matter seriously, as you do.</p>
<p>Interesting that your brother was acting hush-hush about it. </p>
<p>Intparent, I think where a lot of adult children get hung up is that they feel they have to find a way to make the parent like the fact that they can’t drive. You and your sibs have to give up on that idea. She’s not going to like it. That’s your starting point.</p>
<p>eyeamom, take her to the hospital for breathing problems. With that, plus her age and history, there’s a good chance they’ll admit her. Then start talking to the case manager about her home situation. Tell them clearly that she cannot care for herself and that there’s no one at home to care for her. (If they don’t admit her, make this very clear to the ER doc. ) I think they’re not allowed to send someone home if they know that. She needs to be in skilled nursing.</p>
<p>The real problem intparent faces is her father. He can legally drive. Otherwise, intparent could just take away the keys. OTOH, if a person is perfectly safe when they handle a gun, but they’re in the habit of handing the gun to an unsupervised toddler, shouldn’t you take away the gun? </p>
<p>But then even if intparent somehow made it impossible for both her parents to drive (by physically taking away the keys or disabling the car) the parents would still have the problem of being unable to get around in suburbia without a car.</p>
<p>@intparent my suggestion is to call the local law enforcement agency. Rules probably vary by state; I know in NY where my aging parents and I reside the officer told us he wished more adult children would step in and somehow ‘take the keys away,’ but there was nothing he could do until the older person was ordered to stop driving. </p>
<p>But it sounds like your mother was ordered to stop driving,so the police would have reason to, for example, follow her home one day and have a little chat. Maybe that would help your father and brother come to terms with the reality that she should definitely not be behind the wheel. </p>
<p>To briefly introduce myself and my situation … my dad passed away in 2010, after years of failing health, and more than one fender-bender. He finally agreed to stop driving when ordered to by a traditional older doc in a white coat. He wouldn’t accept it when told to stop by a younger doc and various nurses and health aides. Only about 4 days after he agreed to give up the keys, he developed pneumonia and died in hospital within 24 hours. I think the idea of being ‘home-bound’ and without his wheels made him lose all will to live. </p>
<p>So, May 2010, I was suddenly faced with settling his estate (it was a mess) and finding some kind of care for my mother, who at that point was in early to mid-stage dementia. I cobbled together a plan of neighbors and housekeepers. I do have one older sister; she lives at a distance and made it clear she had no intention of stepping up to help in any way. She shows up for funerals. </p>
<p>In April 2013 we finally moved my mother into the memory care unit of a local assisted living. Her physical health has actually improved since she’s been there (3 good meals a day and adequate hygiene will do that for you) while she mentally declines. Having her ‘safe’ gave me the free time and mental energy necessary to take my oldest D through the college admission process. And in our other ‘free’ time, husband and I cleared out and eventually sold my mother’s house to help pay for the assisted living. What a long, strange year it’s been!</p>
<p>I wish I had found CC and in particular this thread a year ago. I have found some helpful advice on the forums of the Alzheimers Association page. </p>
<p>Good luck to everyone in a supporting role. </p>
<p>Welcome, 12dandelion. Many of us will be going where you have been. Good advice to see if the local police might be able to help out with the unsafe driver.</p>
<p>Thank you, Cardinal Fang. I hope I can be of some help. I’m no longer clear on some of the details, especially concerning my dads hospitalizations, but in general he and Mom were determined to stay in their house, ‘managing’ on their own, until their dying day. They think that is what is easiest and I think they are also scared of any change. </p>
<p>The way we eventually got mom to memory care is the stuff of nightmares, but I will say her doc (a geriatric specialist) and the staff of the memory care unit were as helpful as they could be. I think someone said above that elders are still adults with legal rights - even when they are behaving like toddlers. </p>
<p>Welcome 12dandelion. It’s a tough road for sure. Glad you found us. And I know what you mean about being in the sandwich–I found out that my dad’s prognosis was hopeless one day, left with my daughter for accepted-student open house the next day, came back the third day, and my dad died the fourth day. Definitely breathtaking.</p>
<p>I am also in NY–my daughter and I live in Brooklyn and my dad and stepmother were on Long Island, an hour away. He died 3 weeks ago today and my stepmother’s son took her to live in a memory-care unit in Colorado where he lives a week later. The nest will be very empty in August when my daughter leaves for school.</p>
<p>The last time my dad drove, he got lost and it took him 2 hours to get home. I am so grateful that he didn’t have a serious accident during the time I was watching over them. I understand what you said about your dad losing the will to live when he couldn’t drive anymore. My stepmother’s aide said that she had clients who sat in the car and listened to the radio sometimes and then came back in the house and said they decided not to go shopping today. If only!</p>
<p>Like everyone, aging parents see things from their own perspective. They think it’s “easiest” to stay in their own home, and maybe it is easier for them, in the short term, but it’s not easier for their local children who have to rush over when they fall because they can’t navigate stairs any more. It’s not easier for their out-of-town children who have to scramble for plane flights because their mother is hospitalized because she wasn’t able to handle day-to-day living. And certainly not easier for the working mother who has to figure out how to take care of her child who was injured by a selfish elder who was unable to admit he was no longer safe driving, if it came to that awful pass.</p>
<p>Everybody’s entitled to some selfishness. Our parents took care of us when we were young, and we owe them some care now that they are old. But there comes a time when the selfishness has to end. That time has come when someone is selfishly driving, not caring that they are endangering others with their inabilities. And it has come when a mother thinks she wants 24-hour skilled nursing at home from children who are not qualified to deliver it.</p>
<p>I’m half hysterical, half beyond mad. My sister who is there visiting decided with my mom that she should move into this small apartment building. By herself. My sis thinks because it’s so small she’ll manage better. And mom promises to hire help. Even though past history has had her firing everyone, refusing to accept help and to accuse everyone of stealing college sweatshirts, junk jewelry, and some old stuffed animals. She is having a mildly better day today. When she moves to this tiny apartment my niece won’t go with her and there will be no one to do dishes, laundry, put away groceries, get the groceries, make sure she’s eating the little bit she does. I’m fit to be tied. I was just thinking of taking pictures of all her stairs, her bed that is so piled with laundry, laundry baskets, books, crap that there is hardly room for her. And take that to the doctor with my list of questions such as - why is she not on an anti-depressant. Here is her living situation, and what she tells us - do you think moving to an apartment alone makes sense given her prognosis? My mom thinks very highly of this doctor so I was hoping something would click with someone. But I can’t make my mom do anything. I’m going to visit and give her my come to Jesus conversation, and then I’m stepping out. And maybe stepping into my own psychologists office to deal with the frustration and guilt.</p>
<p>@eyemamom, the psychologist’s office is what saved me.</p>
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It won’t address the pain and trouble breathing, unless she’s somehow hurting herself by constantly moving all the stuff around her 3-story house. But as CF said, we’re not doctors here to know exactly WHY she’s having bad pain and breathing difficulties. That could be one focus of the upcoming dr’s visit, perhaps. If dr. feels it’s environmental, and she’s just doing too much climbing and breathing dust, that’s different than his finding something definable on her lung, etc. Glad you’re soon going to dr. Taking it a day at a time, who knows but the dr. might see something that has him admitting her to hospital right away during your visit. She won’t be signing any apartment leases in that situation.</p>
<p>I mean, it’d be <em>some</em> improvement just to get her away from all those moving parts (too many dishes, clothes, etc) and steps. She will have to part with 80 percent of her stuff to fit into a little apartment, correct? If her neice moves away – and I’m not sure how much the neice was able to help in the first place here, or can anymore – Mom’ll have no choice but to depend completely on hired help. Helpers are more effective around a simpler, small apartment than a big house, so maybe that’ll go better than before. Change sometimes happens in stages. </p>
<p>Could you cut it down the middle and congratulate your sister for getting Mom to agree to move someplace, but say the decision isn’t done until after the doctor’s appt? Then when you visit later this week, do all you can to get the doctor to be definitive. Also, preview AL options without Mom and take her to just one or two. Also, look also for a place with “independent cottages” on the same campus of an assisted living campus – CCRC-- continuum of care. If that’s in your community, it’d beat just moving her into an apartment building, I think. </p>
<p>Getting her to agree to move was a big positive step. I’m thinking you might be able to act like this is all great and you’ll just come in and “adjust” the destination a bit. Then you and your sister would be working more together, which strengthens your hand relative to Mom. If you present 2-3 choices to the doctor: a small isolated apartment vs. AL (or an independent cottage on an AL campus) and ask him to make a medical recommendation among those 3, maybe he could help convince your Mom that yes, medically she could improve her overall health with a move, but not to her own little apartment somewhere. </p>
<p>Some years back, at this juncture, my Mom crunched numbers to discover it cost less to live in a studio apt on a CCRC campus (that provided some meals, laundry, and weekly housekeeping but not personal care…) than to put herself into a bitty apartment building with shift help @ $$ per hour. Just doing the math, she convinced herself. Because, it’s true, you can’t make them do anything.</p>
<p>I know this is all very complicated and daunting. You have my complete sympathy.</p>
<p>Wow, eyemamom. Sorry. I often think the frustration isn’t about their needs and our need to be involved (I think it does come naturally for most of us.) But, it’s the roadblocks they put up that are so scream-worthy. </p>
<p>As said recently, make sure the doc checks all her meds- really checks them, not just reviews his own prior decisions. My mom was on one for a rash that knocked her out of service- couldn’t breath well, no energy, and led to severe arthritic pain- good med, good decision at the time, but it is meant for short term use and that was her reaction, after much too long on it.</p>
<p>Sometimes, these declines are part of the final letting go. I just want to say that even if they find a reason for her recent issues, this can recur. Do insist on some help knowing what to look for and what to do, if x or y happens next. Agree that you make sure he hears that you need guidance. </p>
<p>Thoughts and prayers for all. </p>
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<p>Accusing everyone of stealing her things when she actually misplaced them is a common sign of moderate dementia. It’s actually logical, if you think about it. If she doesn’t remember moving the things or throwing them out, then the logical conclusion is that someone else took them. </p>
<p>But if someone has moderate cognitive difficulties AND pain AND serious difficulty breathing… well, I think we can all agree that person is not a good candidate to be living alone. </p>
<p>Wow, eyeamom. I’m sorry you have to go through this ordeal.</p>