Parents: I have a problem with college decisions and I need your unbiased opinions

Parents Forum
1

<p>Alright here is the deal. I am a white, somewhat unconventional male from a wealthy north atlanta suburb. I got off to a rocky start in high school and have picked it up since then. I am passionate about politics and aspire to be a tenured professor in political science or international affairs when I get older. In addittion, I also would love to travel a whole lot before then. </p>

<p>So, here is my problem.</p>

<p>I have to decide between the following schools:</p>

<p>UGA honors(hope scholarship - free tuition) prospective major(s) - international affairs, political science </p>

<p>Georgia Tech(hope scholarship - free tuition) prospective major - international affairs</p>

<p>Wisconsin - Madison - (accepted, no financial aid) prospective major - economics, political science</p>

<p>American University(maybe honors, dont know yet) - (15000 dollar renewable deans scholarship) prospective major - international affairs, political science</p>

<p>Umich Ann Arbor(assume ive been accepted, no financial aid) prospective major - political science and econ</p>

<p>NYU(assume ive been accepted, no financial aid) prospective major - international affairs and econ</p>

<p>My parents are pretty well off. My dad is in the top income bracket and has the money to pay. However, he is giving me a real hard time about college and doesnt find it "practical" to pay for an out of state school. My parents savings for me combined with my savings adds up to 75000 total and I have tons of AP credit. Now my parents admit to me that they can afford any of these schools, but they need convincing that it is worth it. </p>

<p>Here is the dillemma - the political science and international affairs programs at my in state schools are just not very good. I want to go to grad school and get a PHD and I want to go to a reputable school(ie. Stanford, Gtown, Yale). </p>

<p>without money involved, I personally really want to go to NYU, Madison, or Umich. </p>

<p>My question is who should I listen to and where should I go? I like all of the schools on my list out of state but I need to find some good, solid data to convince my parents that this is a logical decision. I find it so frustrating that with a combined income of over half a million a year that they are hesitant about paying for my school. If this was your son or daughter in my situation, what would you recommend? Which school would put me in the best position for my dreams(jobs after undergrad and reputation to grad schools). </p>

<p>Thanks.</p>

2

<p>ryan2288,</p>

<p>Michigan and NYU have better reputations than UGA--I don't think there's any doubt about that. Does that mean that you can't get into a good grad school with a UGA degree? No, of course not. But if you feel strongly about going out of state and your parents can afford it, keep at it until they give in... If your parents want "data," just about any of the many rankings out there will put Michigan and NYU far above UGA.</p>

<p>Good luck!</p>

3

<p>ryan2288, it's possible your parents simply want to be convinced this isn't some passing interest. Maybe they are holding out until you make up your mind about which school you want, and can then convince them of what's right for you. Do you need to visit in order to make up your mind? Can you get one or both your parents to take a trip with you to look at the schools you were accepted to? </p>

<p>If not, just keep at your research until you are clear about what you want and then proceed to defend it. Be extremely mature yet persistent. Give them more than just your word and desires. Hit them with facts, figures, articles, and ratings.</p>

<p>Schedule time to talk with them about it, or to sit down with them to review websites and other material you have gathered. Is your GC on your side, and have time to talk with you and your parents? Do you know anybody working in your field of interest who would sit down with you and your parents? </p>

<p>Even if they can afford it, it's still a lot of money. They probably didn't get to where they are by investing in whims. Make up your mind, then believe in yourself and sell them on it.</p>

4

<p>Take the free ride and invest the $75K for Grad school where it will be more important.</p>

5

<p>go into politics or boxing instead. academia is far too violent.</p>

6

<p>
[quote]
Even if they can afford it, it's still a lot of money. They probably didn't get to where they are by investing in whims. Make up your mind, then believe in yourself and sell them on it.

[/quote]
</p>

<p>This has a real ring of truth. Narrow your choices down to 2 or 3 schools, including your parent's choice, then draw up a pros/cons sheet. Show them the differences (in your opinion) and listen to their opinions.</p>

7

<p>Maybe the compromise would be American U? It has a good rep in your field and opportunities for great internships. Becoming a tenured professor will depend a whole lot more on what you do in grad school--any of the undergrad schools on your list could be the basis for admission to an excellent grad school--work hard, do relevant internships, establish personal relationships with your profs by impressing them with your diligence and insight and you will be on the right track. The above advice about dealing with your parents is sound, too.</p>

8

<p>Ultimately, your undergrad will be a footnote. Do well at UGA or GaTech, and you will have the opportunities to get into the "name" schools when it counts.</p>

9

<p>Ryan2288 - Assuming political science and international relations continue to be of prime interest to you, American University could indeed be a very good fit with the Congressional and federal government internships so close by (along with the endless research resources of the Library of Congress). However, with that said, I also second the recommendation of your putting together a "pros/cons" list of your 2 or three prime choices (including the in-state choice of University of Georgia or Georgia Tech). Next, continue to do your own research. Depending on your further research, you may find that UGA Honors might turn out to be an excellent fit while saving you and your parents tons of money. For instance, contact the UGA Honors College to see if any recent graduates have gone on to Phd work in political science/international relations at excellent graduate schools (I'm willing to bet they have). Also, go on the UGA website and look up the graduate school backgrounds of political science faculty. I suspect that more than a few sport Phd's from the top graduate schools. Also, see what the UGA Honors College offers in study abroad programs and Washington semester programs. Again, you may come away impressed about what may be possible. You would save $75,000 for a top-notch graduate school and still have an excellent undergraduate academic experience. </p>

<p>Above all, don't go to your parents with a "you can afford it" approach which will sink your chances of getting them to spring for an out-of-state college. Use a fact based "pro/con" sales approach. Then listen to their feedback about pros/cons based on your list as a starting point and hopefully start negotiating from there. Your parents will be impressed with your maturity (as I am when my kids approach big dollar requests like this with some facts first)
and your fact based research.</p>

<p>My son is a sophomore at an honors college of in-state Texas university (Texas Tech in isolated far west Texas). He has some strong political science leanings as well (though he is now a Business major). Acting on those political leanings, he has had some excellent opportunities thus far. For instance, he is currently working in a part time internship of a U.S. Senator's West Texas office. He is applying for a 2006 summer internship with a U.S. Congressman to hopefully be followed in the January-May semester next year with a scholarship based Congressional Intern program in Washington. This semester he is taking an Honors course (which he is really enjoying) in African Affairs from a former ambassador to a west Africa nation (real world experience for sure being passed on to the students). These examples are only to illustrate what can be done in political science type stuff at a state university that on its surface a person might say "no way" given its location. And I bet UGA Honors has plenty to offer in this realm as well.</p>

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<p>American U. has a very strong IR program but all of us were exceedingly underwhelmed with it when we visited: administration attitude, facilities, academic "feel"...felt more like a good junior college. It was one of the few schools we visited that all three of us absolutely loathed.</p>

<p>I'll be the contrarian here: I'm a strong disciple of "going away" to college, getting out of the familiar and comfort zone. NYU is located in a city of the world; Athens, Georgia will never be confused with Athens, Greece. U/Michigan is very strong in political science, particularly Survey Research, and draws a national student body, which I regard as a plus. A lot of your college education takes place outside the classroom and if money is doable I'd certainly pick either NYU or U/Michigan over UGA, particularly if you have ambitions that go beyond returning to your home town/county/state after college. GTech strikes me as a very good engineering school...I'm a bit dubious about it for IR/PoliSci but I don't have any first hand knowledge.</p>

11

<p>take the money and run.</p>

12

<p>Grad school will be free if you are really good enought to get into a good PhD program so don't worry about that part. The UG years are generally something you will look back on fondly for your entire life. That's a good enough reason to go where YOU want if it can be afforded. I'd put UM, UW and NYU in pretty much the same group and pick according to which you like best for all the other reasons--location, social, sports, etc.</p>

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<p>assuming no $$ at American, Madison is a better deal than UMich OOS. GT is NOT a humanities school -- they specialize in tech. LOL</p>

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<p>Hey TheDad, excuse me ... I happen to LOVE Athens GA. I travel there often and each trip is a nice opportunity to get away from the "real" world! (Just kidding there, sort of. I really do like the place.)</p>

<p>Ryan - In two years on CC I've seen variations of this discussion many times, and I'm inclined to suggest that the "reasonable" answer is "Well it depends." Sure, private and OOS public universities are expensive UNLESS there is a compelling reason to attend there. So I guess I'm with Nan and Cnp55 -- demonstrate to your parents that you're commited to a particular career path and show them compelling evidence why UMich or ?Georgetown? or NYU is the right place for you.</p>

<p>Good luck to you.</p>

15

<p>Ga Tech has a fairly new IR program, backed by Sam Nunn. That said, I have a jr D, and we are looking at DC and NE for IR schools (mainly DC). This will be the second (and last) child that won't be using the Hope (oh, well) - and we are definitely not wealthy. She is extremely passionate about IR and foreign affairs. We will be in your position next year, but I don't think either of the Georgia schools will be in the running.</p>

<p>You definitely need to do your homework and show your parents why you think NYU, UMich or UWisc would be better for you/your future.<br>
good luck</p>

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<p>NewHope, I didn't say that anyone might not like Athens, GA...but you actually make my point about it being some place to get away from the real world, as opposed to NYC a city of the world, which for someone interested in IR I would imagine be quite stimulating.</p>

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<p>Michigan has a new program that puts students right into DC. It could be a big plus factor for a student like you.</p>

<p><a href="http://www.umich.edu/news/index.html?Releases/2005/Mar05/r030705c%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://www.umich.edu/news/index.html?Releases/2005/Mar05/r030705c&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p>

<p>But there are good arguments for the other schools you are considering, too. If you do end up at UGA (or anywhere else, really) I'd look into doing a semester or a term in DC, either at American U or at a program sponsored by your own or another institution. If you end up at UGA, you also might try to sell your parents on using the money "saved" to fund some summer travel or a year abroad.</p>

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<p>My dad just isnt convinced that the money will be going to a worthwhile cause. He wants to be sure that I will earn back what I spend on college. In essence, there is no possible way that I can prove to him that it will happen. I have recieved 15K a year from American and I really like the other 3 out of state schools. Ive visited both departments at UGA and Tech, and I really was not impressed at either. Tech is recruiting me, but I know thats because their program is new and fairly weak. I know that undergraduate school may not make that big of a difference, but I think that the valuable connections I can make with talented faculty at NYU, Wisc, Umich, and American, along with the numerous opportunities that these schools can offer(in terms of programs, internships, etc) is enough to at least understand my concerns. My sister is at UGA right now and she knows first hand how bad the political science program is. </p>

<p>Ive done a lot of things, ive brought to them the rankings; the list of the programs that are MUCH better than Tech and UGA; and showed them how these out of state schools actually hire really good faculty all of the time. I just somehow have to prove to them that I will get a good job. My parents are, I hate to say it, squares. They really are linear thinkers to an extreme and it is always frustrating because they believe that money is always the most important thing.</p>

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<p>Of course, you can't prove it to them, but you can build a convincing case.</p>

<p>Have you pulled up statistics yet showing average earnings of graduates from these different institutions? I beleive that information is available. </p>

<p>A linear thinker can be easier to deal with than you think, if find his or her line and go with it. If you fight it, you won't get anywhere. They want statistics about earnings? Go get them.</p>

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<p>I don't think Poli Sci majors are known for their initial earnings. Most go on to some form of grad school. Also few schools keep $$$ stats on their liberal arts grads. That's more typical in business and engineering.</p>