Parents/Kids - Who chooses the college?

Parents Forum
1

<p>I'm curious how much input parents have in their child's decision on what college to attend. </p>

<p>-Do you let them have free reign as long as finances are not a problem or if they can get a scholarship?
-Do you let them go wherever they want no matter what?
-Do you insist on a major or college that is more likely to land them a job?
-Do you insist on any requirements in a college that your child does not particularly agree with?</p>

<p>I realize our situation is different than most but I find myself really liking certain colleges, wanting to steer her towards them and I wonder if this is somewhat normal.</p>

2

<p>I think the feeling is normal, and I think different parents have different philosophies on "steering." </p>

<p>Here on cc, you will feel the pain of students whose parents are directing them, using various methods, to the school the parent wants -must be an Ivy, must be close to home, etc. - to the exclusion of the kids wants, needs and realistic qualifications. </p>

<p>You also feel the pain of kids whose parents DIDN'T give clear financial criteria until too late - so the acceptance to dream school is an empty victory as the money isn't there or won't be allocated.</p>

<p>Leaving aside the parents who are totally uninvolved (they're certainly not here on the Parent Forum :rolleyes:, although we hear from kids who would like our help because parents won't or can't help), that brings us to the vast majority.</p>

<p>I remember how much fun DH and I had flipping through the guides, triangulating with the suggestions from GC, S' stats etc. We were truly engaged - long before DS either was or would admit to being so - making lists, planning college tours, guesstimating "chances." We joked with DS about it. Our guidance was probably quite instrumental in his "long" list - schools with strength in his field of interest, about the size he said he'd like, with the atmosphere he wanted (such as you could tell without actually being there). </p>

<p>The list of where to actually visit was a "family discussion" - actually probably a very collegial process since we seem to have been on DS' page from the start.</p>

<p>From that point on, though, DS was in the driver's seat. We had heard the tales, from friends, of kids stepping one toe onto a campus and giving the "thumbs down", so we told him he had to give each school a fair chance. That said, we all agreed to flee one campus without ever leaving the car (should never have been on the list to begin with). On other campuses, if he just wasn't interested after, say, a tour or an info session, we departed - honoring his reasons even if they wouldn't have been ours.</p>

<p>As we moved from school to school and city to city, over one long East Coast driving tour, and one flying tour to the South and West, our only "input" was to inquire how the schools were falling out in his mind. We tried very hard not to "let on" which we were falling in love with etc. His "rank order" morphed as he saw more schools, but a couple rose to the top and stayed there.</p>

<p>In the end, the schools he actually applied to were NOT the list we would have made. But, in hindsight, it was the right list for him. We certainly liked his favorites - a lot - but we would have included several more reach schools than he did. He only put one on his list. A whole treatise could probably be written about why that was. But, he ended up, we think, at just the right place for him (can't confirm that with hard evidence yet, as it was Tulane and he was Katrina-derailed for the semester, but can't wait to get back in January).</p>

<p>I'm glad we did it the way we did. I think he "gut-instinct"ed the right place for him. Even if I didn't think he found the right place, I think it's very important for it to be HIS choice. Imagine the repercussions if the kid doesn't like the school and it was parent-forced or parent-directed. Wouldn't want to live that experience.</p>

<p>Sorry for the long post, but I think your question was very well put, kyedor, and timely as well, as so many kids and families fine-tune their lists.</p>

3

<p>I think these are all good questions and are family decisions. There is not one correct way of going through the process for everyone. For example, the major- some would say for the $ college costs, you better be able to land a job for a decent salary and you better graduate within 4 years. Others might say that this is the one time in your life where you get to study whatever you are interested in (abslolutely no thought of job later, or perhaps some degree of practical thinking enters the picture).</p>

4

<p>By and large, it's going to be his decision. The finances are obviously a critical factor, and he knows that if it comes down to two similar schools he's going to have to really convince me that the more expensive school is a better fit. DW has laid down a strict but fairly broad geographic parameter (I tried to tell him that if he found a truly great fit outside those boundaries I could get DW to cave in -- unfortunately DW found out about the conversation and I'm still in the doghouse. Literally. No, literally.). He also knows that I'm not writing tuition checks for a 4, 5 or 6 year alcoholic stupor. There's really only a few schools on the long list that I have qualms about. But once we start visiting schools he'll pretty much be in the lead, and I'll respect his instincts. </p>

<p>There are two schools in the country that I would probably be physically and mentally unable to write tuition checks for -- based solely on irrational sports rivalries from 25+ years ago. Can you believe it? Fortunately they're not on his list, or I would have to confront this completely childish phenomenon -- and that would take all the fun out of it. LOL.</p>

5

<p>There are two schools in the country that I would probably be physically and mentally unable to write tuition checks for -- based solely on irrational sports rivalries from 25+ years ago. Can you believe it? </p>

<p>haha! Yes I can. There are two schools that although unspoken, DS knows are on the blacklist LOL</p>

6

<p>Husband has said that Son can attend the local rival college, but Husband doesn't have to cheer for their football team.</p>

7

<p>We tried to let our son steer the decision. We (I should say "I") presented him with a variety of schools that he might not otherwise have considered. We visited what schools we could, and pretty much let him whittle the list down to a manageable size himself. I will admit that there were several unpleasant discussions where he felt I was aiming too low for him -- but I'm compulsive about insuring against poor outcomes. We also strongly resisted when he was set on applying ED to a particular school, to which he ended up being accepted RD. In the end, it really came down to 3 schools, all selective and wonderful. He visited one with my husband, and the whole family went to see the other two. In the end, he was really torn about the decision, so I would have to say that H and I made a case for the school which we felt was the best fit, although any of the three would have been great. The hard part was declining the offers of admission to schools which he truly liked, but that's what happens on May 1. At the time we told him that this was a family decision -- we hoped that it would be what he wanted, but there were other considerations. We've also told S2 the same thing -- they can pretty much choose where to apply, as long as the safeties are covered -- but the final decision affects all of us, and we will have input.</p>

8

<p>My situation was different from yours. S dreamed of MIT or Caltech. His math teacher suggested CMU. He applied last minute as a junior, so had no information about LACs or other schools that would fit the bill. Altho S received NMF letters, truly no time to explore (I didn't know of CC then). Staying local was not an option.</p>

<p>Your situation is complicated by the fact that your D leaving a residential treatment center. In some ways, she is more worldly than many others her age. She might find a small girls' college to be like a 'prison'. She may want to go far from home, but then could get into trouble again without guidance. You also don't want her at local CC, which is generally a 'best buy' start, because she would run into former friends. If she goes alone to a strange school, she could find it hard to find friends and gravitate to the drug crowd. Sharing drugs offers instant friendship. All in all, your situation different. Your D will need to be a part of the process. I don't see why she and you can't have veto power over a school. I don't know when D will be ready to visit colleges, but no reason you can't begin a list.</p>

9

<p>As a parent of a student who is now in college, I was much more involved in the college search research than our daughter was. I pored over the hundreds of college brochures that arrived in the mail during her sophomore, junior, and senior year while she pretty much ignored them. Essentially I was trying to find a school for her that I thought would be a good match and a good financial deal. She seemd to have a natural aptitude and interest in science and we encouraged her to pursue that interest.</p>

<p>We required that she apply to several colleges that guaranteed full rides to National Merit Finalists; encouraged her to apply to a few reach schools like MIT, Caltech, & University of Chicago; and other strong science schools with good merit aid like Case Western Reserve and Washington University.</p>

<p>She generally ignored our recommendations. She didn't want to apply to any hyper-competitive schools. She arranged on her own to visit a LAC that she really liked. We encouraged her to apply to other LAC's with a similar atmosphere so that we could compare the fianacial aid awards.</p>

<p>We strongly encouraged her to consider the free ride colleges but she ended up going her first choice LAC even though going required her to take out loans and use her summer and school year earnings to supplement what we could afford to pay.</p>

<p>During her freshman year she made lots of decisions that we didn't agree with including discontinuing the science major and concentrating her studies on a language that she had never studied before ( and which the school had no formal degree program in ). In addition she did not want to continue study in a lanuage that already studied for four years and one in which the school had a very strong program.</p>

<p>We tried to steer her towards a major that would be likely to land her job. She decided to change directions to follow her new found interests even though the job prospects seem to be fairly uncertain.</p>

<p>Trying to steer your student is absolutely normal. But even if YOU like a certain college or major, that may not be the path that he or she wants to take.</p>

10

<p>My grandfather forced my mom to go several hours away from home for college (when all of her friends stayed local), so all through my childhood she swore up and down that I would be allowed to go wherever I wanted.</p>

<p>Well, when April of my senior year came around, it turned out that "anywhere you want" really meant "anywhere you want as long as it's close to home". She had hated being away so much that she assumed I wouldn't want to be away either. She tried very actively to discourage me from attending MIT, since it's about a 12-14 hour car ride from home... it was pretty hard on me, as we're very close, and I didn't want to hurt her, but I did want to go to MIT, darn it!</p>

<p>So... the moral of the story is this: if you've given your child the freedom to choose his/her school, please make sure you're prepared to accept any choice your child may make! :)</p>

11

<p>"I don't see why she and you can't have veto power over a school."</p>

<p>Good idea Book, that would certainly eliminate a lot of strife. Also, I'm in a position of doing all the research and I'm able to just not present the obviously bad choices to her. Although I am including a few larger Universities in NC that she is interested in. If she does the work to get in then I won't veto it. Medusa, the path that your daughter took seems to be pretty common. It's a wonderful thing that she figured out what she was interested in. My D also has math/science natural aptitude but is choosing not to do anything with it. Gahhhhh! :) Okay, I got that out:::</p>

12

<p>What colleges offering "free rides" were you considering for your NMF daughter?</p>

13

<p>The University of Kansas ( no longer offers free rides to out of state NMF's ), the University of Arizona , Arizona State, Truman State University, the University of Florida, the University of Tulsa, the Unversity of Oklahoma, and New College of Florida. Some of the above were not completely free rides but close. I have heard that the Unversity of Alabama offers a free ride PLUS a substantial stipend.</p>

14

<p>In retrospect, we are not sure that the private college was worth the additional cost. She could have graduated from the University of Arizona debt free. The University of Arizona offers a substantial number of courses and a formal major in the language that she decided to concentrate in versus limited course offerings and no major at her LAC. Also she could have attended the same junior year abroad program at substantially less cost because the tuition charged is what students would pay to attend their home campus.</p>

15

<p>We helped my son alot with his list of schools and application process, mainly because other then a couple of schools he did not have a strong feeling for where he wanted to go. But in the end, he made the choice where he wanted to go. And he had a couple of places he could have went for next to nothing. It costs a little more, but he had to be, and should be, happy and he is. You only get to do this once.</p>

16

<p>"but he had to be, and should be, happy and he is. You only get to do this once."</p>

<p>So true, and I will keep this in mind during our college discussion this weekend.</p>

17

<p>
[quote]
-Do you let them have free reign as long as finances are not a problem or if they can get a scholarship? -Do you let them go wherever they want no matter what?

[/quote]
Absolutely. Our finances are limited, so the free rein may very well turn out to be meaningless -- I've told my daughter that I will pay whatever it costs to attend an in-state U. with whatever financial aid they give us, but I can't promise more - so in a sense the financial aid package from the state u. is going to end up setting the bottom line on finances.
[quote]
-Do you insist on a major or college that is more likely to land them a job?

[/quote]
Absolutely not! My own current career position has absolutely nothing to do with what I was educated with, and I love my work. My son took time off from college after only 2 years and ended up with a job that he loved - it was challenging and while the pay was modest, it offered great benefits (health insurance, paid vacations, 401K, etc.) So while a certain college major might land a graduate a better paying job, it certainly isn't a prerequisite to employment. For most employment, the issue is whether or not the student has a degree, not what the degree was in, at least at the undergraduate level. A person will do well if they are doing work they enjoy or are interested in; they will not do well otherwise, no matter how strong their credentials. They simply will never have the energy or motivation to compete with more enthusiastic and zealous co-workers.
[quote]
Do you insist on any requirements in a college that your child does not particularly agree with?

[/quote]
No, though I can imagine certain situations where it would be reasonable for parents to interpose some requirements. It really didn't arise in my situation since neither of my kids applied to any college that I would have had a problem with.
[quote]
I realize our situation is different than most but I find myself really liking certain colleges, wanting to steer her towards them...

[/quote]
"Steering" is fine, that's not the same as requiring. I mean, to me that is advocacy. I suggested a number of colleges to my daughter that were safeties or matches and which I thought fit well with her interests - she was very amenable to my advice and she thought that these were her top choices based on what she read about them, until she visited the campuses -- they have all been dropped from her list now. My d. certainly did give those schools a fair shake, interviewing at all of them as well as visiting classes and doing an overnight at one. But basically, she realized with the visits that she would not be happy with those choices, and completely revised her college list. Obviously, the last thing any one of us want is to have our kids calling home in October telling us they are absolutely miserable --- and I figure that if it does happen, I certainly don't want to be the person to blame for having pushed my d. to attend a school she was uncertain about. </p>

<p>This is a time for launching our kids on their own, their first step toward adulthood and independent lives. We parents certainly do have every right to set limits on how much money we will spend - but other than that I think its a mistake to stand in a student's way, except to the extent that specific factors such as health concerns might also dictate certain limits.</p>

18

<p>
[quote]
Do you let them have free reign as long as finances are not a problem or if they can get a scholarship?

[/quote]
</p>

<p>Free rein is a relative term. Did my D have enough free rein that she could apply ED not knowing what type of package we would have to pay for? No. Some conversations happened off the bat, I knew what I could afford to pay, I ran my numbers through a few financial aid calculators to get some sort of idean where we stood financially. I read through those financial aid policies, picked them apart, read through the common data sets, U.S. news on line edition (which imho, is going to be the best $15 you will ever spend even if you never look at the rankings). We did look at schools that would met 100% of your financial need and gave a decent amount of grant aid. we did look at the average amount of debt that a studnet graduates with.</p>

<p>
[quote]
Do you let them go wherever they want no matter what?

[/quote]
While I really did not want her to fly across the country, I held my piece. Luckily for me, she said that she wants to go away but not too far away. I did consider that in the event of an emergency how quickly could I get to her. (I even said that if she said home, I could pay for a car with the money saved in dorm fees. That went over like a lead balloon).</p>

<p>
[quote]
Do you let them go wherever they want no matter what?

[/quote]
Daughter is attending her first choice school (It was not my first choice at the beginning and I was almost in tears when I had to drop the card in the mail to *my first choice for her *letting them know that she would not be attending. However, I see how happy she is to be there and have watched her blossom in a great community of students, so it has all worked out and I am a fan).</p>

<p>
[quote]
Do you insist on a major or college that is more likely to land them a job?

[/quote]

Absolutely not. I lived through that . I am a proud holder of a BBA in marketing that I never used one day. She has so many interests, and I am happy to tell her to pursue them. She is a religion major/ nueropsych minor and loves her classes. I do get the questions of how can you allow her to major in that? What kind of job is she going to be able to get? Is she going to become a minister? My response when you think about the fact that she will have 50 years to work (time between undergrad and retirement age) so she will probably do a few things in that span of time.</p>

<p>I have always instilled in her the importance of being able to make choices and you are always in a better situation if you can make choices vs someone making choices for you. In the end, I walked my talk and respected the choice that she made.</p>

19

<p>
[quote]
By and large, it's going to be his decision. The finances are obviously a critical factor, and he knows that if it comes down to two similar schools he's going to have to really convince me that the more expensive school is a better fit.

[/quote]
We're not in the middle of this process yet but this pretty much dscribes what we plan on doing. We have started opportunistc conversations to try to ensure our kids approach to picking a list is well thought out ... and will offer help to our kids organize their thoughts on schools ... but they will drive the process and decide. </p>

<p>(What is an opportunistic conversation? We live in Boston and go to a lot of events at colleges ... at BU I sneak in a few comments on the pros and cons of being on a city campus, at BC slightly different view, at Wellesly yet another view)</p>

20

<p>ahh, the age old question of when your teenager is in a receptive mood for an opportunistic conversation. I'm pretty good at telling when he doesn't want to discuss things -- my problem is telling the difference between when he's ready to talk, and when things will just go in one ear and out the other. We're fortunate to have a hot tub, which S loves to get in at the end of the day before he goes to bed. He's generally in a talkative mood at that time. </p>

<p>Several of the college guidebooks have a list of questions that students and parents should ask themselves. I've found these to be good ice-breakers to guide a conversation.</p>