Parents of engineering freshman....

Parents Forum
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<p>I don’t know how he would find an internship if not in school. As much as I appreciate all the advice (or advices…I read that here, and somehow like it), a semester off just doesn’t feel right. Why wouldn’t he just pick a less specific (for lack of a better word) major? The reason I would like him to have more time is that he was just hitting his academic stride toward the end of high school. Granted it is HIS academic stride, which is VERY differnt from most CC kids, but it was a jor upward trend none the less, and cutting it off as he is starting to excel ( again, by our own standards; I get that this would not be considered excelling in other places…yes, I am getting a little defensive…sorry…), just doesnt feel right. </p>

<p>He has a decent track record of many things; sports, student council, editing for yearbook; that kind of thing. No, it’s not engineering, but he knows how to make things happen outside the classroom. </p>

<p>I want him to have more time to find his ACADEMIC niche. I am hoping the school can help us sort this out, using the in put I have gotten here. It’s really why we agreed to him attending there.</p>

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So far from California :(. Did Shrinkson participate in the ACCESS program last summer? Or is that something new?</p>

<p>Agree about not taking time off. It can be pretty difficult to get internships with only a semester behind you, at least around here (western new york). </p>

<p>Doesn’t the semester start next week? (eek!)</p>

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<p>Yes, he started ACCESS in the month prior to beginning school in August. It is ongoing, with one or two class together each semester. I dont think it is the Algorithms one. And yes, he leaves this weekend, and school starts Monday. He is supposed to be doing the calculus thing from the Berkley link as we speak, and tomorrow I will email the school with my concerns.</p>

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<p>Sounds as if you are making good progress in defining which route feels best for your family, shrinkrap. I am betting that in the end this will all sort out. Maybe an internship or some such similar experience can be found for the summer.</p>

<p>Lots of us have kids (dare I say it is often sons) who hit their stride a little later. Mine is one who does not fit the “CC mold” either but, like yours, is on an upward trend and probably right on track for his own particular timeline. Of course, any trend when it comes to kids is rarely in a neat, straight line, and that’s why parents tend to look a little frazzled LOL. </p>

<p>We all follow a different journey, and I’ve read that grades received in school have little predictive value regarding workplace success later. My late-blooming DH is doing just fine in the ‘real world’, for example, despite not having the academic accolades of his wife. He has taught me much about patience and sons (er, ignore my kicking and screaming along the way to wisdom).</p>

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<p>My big midwestern flagship alumni magazine had an article years ago about a very successful engineering graduate who had donated big bucks to the engineering school. As they took him around the modernized campus bragging about the very impressive stats of their current students, he commented that they would never accept him today - his HS record was not so good, and he didn’t become a good student until college.</p>

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<p>I’m in the camp of reducing his credits to 12 and see how he does. Engineering is a tough road and how and when you get there doesn’t matter as long as when you finally get your degree it is what you wanted and “half-way” enjoyed your college experience. What’s the use of going to college if all you do is study. There’s got to be some down time and enjoyment as well. If Shrinkrap has the resources and is willing to allow Shrinkson to do the 5 year program and maybe a summer or two, that’s the option I would pick. If at 12 credits, he is still struggling, I would think his heart is really not into it and you cut your loses at the 1st year and start fresh. Either way, you’re looking at a 5 year program.</p>

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<p>Yea, many of the generous USC donors similarly say they would not be able to gain admission these days with the heighbtened competition for admissions–it is not uncommon for a student to take a bit of time to find his/her way. Our kids are certainly a testiment to that. S & D both got better grades in college (he studying EE, she studying cinema) than they did in HS–I believe they also were able to attend more of their classes there as well.</p>

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<p>Thinking of emailing this…any thoughts?</p>

<p>"Greetings and Happy New Year!</p>

<p>Hope my message finds you well!</p>

<p>I understand if you cannot respond because of confidentiality, but I want you to know son knows I am emailing you with a CC to his guidance counselor, … , and I am cc’ing son as well.</p>

<p>I am emailing because I am concerned about sons spring 2012 classes, particularly in view of his fall 2011 grades. He is scheduled for 18 credits, including physics _________________, with a calculus 1 pre or co requisite, even though he has only taken pre- calc, and passed with a B minus. </p>

<p>Yesterday he took a screening test from Berkeley.</p>

<p><a href=“http://math.berkeley.edu/courses/choosing/placement-exam[/url]”>http://math.berkeley.edu/courses/choosing/placement-exam&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;

<p>Will results help? He is also registered to take Biology for engineers, algorithms, and a core class, ( in which I am sure he will do fine).</p>

<p>He remains strongly committed to an engineering major, and I am so proud of him, but I am sure we would all like him to be successful. I wonder if he would not be more successful if he took less, rather than more classes than he took last semester, and if he put off taking physics.</p>

<p>He is concerned that he will feel further behind ( he is supposed to take Calc II in summer school), and that he will not finish in four years, but I am more concerned that he do what is right for him, and has the greatest chances of success. I don’t have graduation rates in engineering at (your school), but know it is not unusual for engineering students to take five years to finish. He is also disappointed that his GPA will mean he can not do a semester in Germany.</p>

<p>I am encouraging him to drop physics now, and to stay on top of things, with his guidance counselors, through tutors, and office hours, and not hesitate to drop something else by the last drop date if it seems appropriate. </p>

<p>Finally, if engineering seems the right path after this semester, can you help him develop a five year plan? "</p>

<p>That’s my draft so far…</p>

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<p>Shrinkrap, My gut reaction-don’t send the email. Once a kid is in college, he really should be the one to initiate any contact about concerns and possibilities(unless there is an emergency going on). Do what you can to encourage your son to seek out guidance from an advisor,professor, or mentor at his college. Maybe your son could draft an email and copy you? Good luck! I know you’re concerned. I was very concerned about S2 in high school but he has turned things around in college. As others have noted , sometimes some sons just need a little extra time .</p>

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<p>It’s a nice letter, but it’s not clear who you would email it to or respected response. (You already said reply not possible due to confidentiality.) </p>

<p>Perhaps your son could send an email, saying parent concerns attached…and paste in your word?</p>

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<p>I think it is a REALLY bad idea for YOU to send this to ANYONE at his college- first, he IS in college now, not HS and he IS expected to seek guidance on his own. I think you would be seriously undermining him by sending this email. If you cant convince him on your own to reduce his Spring classes, for all the reasons you are concerned about, then I think you need to give him some firm tough love "If the GPA goes down below … then … are the consequences that he should expect from you. Then he understands if his grades go south further you will not be willing to …</p>

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<p>Ok, thanks.</p>

<p>I agree with the idea that I should take a giant step back, which we did a few years ago, and I have been quite comfortable with that…until I started this thread!!! And many seem to think I should be discussing this with him, but I’d defer to people at the school.</p>

<p>I was sending to the director the mentoring program.</p>

<p>"ACCESS program (A Community Committed to Excellence in Scientific Scholarship) is designed for first-year students in the *** College of Science and Engineering. …Participation in the ACCESS program will prepare students for academic excellence through collaborative engagement in scientific scholarship.</p>

<p>…etc…</p>

<p>I don’t think son would have a problem sending something similar. The only complication is, he is not worried, since he has not heard from all of you!</p>

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<p>"he is not worried, since he has not heard from all of you! "</p>

<p>then why dont you forward him the link to this thread?
there has been a LOT of good advise given by those with lots of experience with engineering. he may actually appreciate some suggestions.</p>

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<p>I’ve thought of that. A little nervous that I’d shared so much about him, so I went with a summary instead.</p>

<p>Sigh…I think I’m done…I thought this was supposed to get EASIER?</p>

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<p>“And many seem to think I should be discussing this with him, but I’d defer to people at the school.”</p>

<p>Shrinkrap- why don’t you want to discuss this with him?</p>

<p>And there is middle ground - you don’t have to control the path or write the email, but you also don’t have to “take a giant step back”</p>

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<p>Well, that was a bit of an overstatement. We have discussed it, but not with the level of detail on this thread. </p>

<p>I don’t feel I have the background to give my opinion on the meaning of his grades with regard to his readiness for calculus or the physics class. I kind of thought he was doing okay…better than expected…</p>

<p>I am wanting to be his mom, and not his advisor. I just want to support him and say good job.</p>

<p>I don’t want to be on his back forever. We already DID that, and for longer than I liked. It was WAY better when we stopped.</p>

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<p>I’d strongly suggest that your son complete at least the first semester of calculus and preferably the second semester before beginning calc-based physics, even if calculus is the co-requisite, rather than a pre-requisite. Calc-based physics for engineers tends to be tough. In my opinion, anyway, it’s quite difficult to learn both calculus and calc-based physics at the same time. When it comes time to take electricity and magnetism, your son would be much better off if he has completed vector calculus first (it’s covered in multi-variable calculus). This is particularly true since it sounds as though your son has a good but not excellent performance in pre-calc.</p>

<p>So, in essence, I would suggest shifting the physics back by one year, to next spring. This will allow your son to complete single-variable differential and integral calculus before he takes the physics course (presumably mechanics), and to have multi-variable calculus before E&M.</p>

<p>Engineering has such a tightly prescribed curriculum most places that no one would look down on a student who took 5 years to complete the degree.</p>

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<p>At many universities, your son could simply drop the physics course soon, without an adviser’s signature. Since he has 18 credits, I think he could drop both physics lecture and lab without falling below the required number of credits to be a full-time student.</p>

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<p>…then I would be crystal clear when the last day he can drop classes is! :eek:</p>

<p>Agree with QM about delaying the calculus based physics class until he gets more math under his belt.</p>

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<p>“When it comes time to take electricity and magnetism, your son would be much better off if he has completed vector calculus first”…“single-variable differential and integral calculus before he takes the physics course (presumably mechanics), and to have multi-variable calculus before E&M.”</p>

<p>^ All that sounds like Latin to me (okay, I DID take Latin). How are we supposed to know the sequence of classes it would take if he doesn’t go as planned?</p>