<p>I don’t know, but perhaps a “Southern” school would seem conservative in politics, non-diverse in racial proportions, and maybe old-fashioned in dress/manners from the perspective of an outsider. Maybe “Very Southern” is…more of that. Mind you, I’m not saying I think these things are necessarily Southern, but that is how I’ve seen the word used to describe colleges on CC. So for example, a “Southern” school might have more men likely to hold a door for a woman but fewer who expect earning equality when they’re both engineers in a few years. As for race, there has been a recent spate of lawsuits against southern (as in, geographically southern) sororities about their restrictions on Black women. There was a c. 2007 story on CC about Vanderbilt that a family asked how it would feel to be Jewish on campus, and the tour guide student said, “no one would have to know”. I suspect this kind of thing is what people are hinting at.</p>
<p>Disclaimer - I have never lived South unless you count the Los Angeles area. I am from the midwest and am currently a New Englander. However, my kids (and many of my students) are considering a bunch of colleges in the geographic US South.</p>
<p>@arisamp Bribery??? Really at this age it’s all on him. You might ask if there is anything he wants you to do to help, send him email reminders, buy him an organizer? Maybe ask him to plan out his study time and set a minimum amount of time for assignment? </p>
<p>I am ignorant of NHS as our HS does not do it (abolished it at our school decades ago). But I have to say that I don’t understand the point of limiting volunteer hours to no more than 4 hours per organization - that doesn’t encourage a very deep connection with any issue or organization. Seems to support “dabbling” rather than meaningful involvement or leadership…what can one really do in 4 hours other than just show up?</p>
<p>We do not NHS but are a Cumma laude school. Only maybe 1 or 2 juniors are admitted (criteria all A’s no -/+ through the first 6 semesters).<br>
Our National Merit numbers were down this year we usually average 10-20 out class of 90-100 students. We had less than 10 this year.</p>
<p>I think they limit the hours which can counted for NHS because they do want to encourage “dabbling.” They only require 12 volunteer hours a semester and the list of pre approved organizations has a lot of not well known places. I think that they want the kids to see the various needs of the community and not just organizations they may already be familiar with. Students are encouraged to volunteer additional hours at these organizations which can be counted toward the school requirements or just because they want to support that organization;-) </p>
<p>NHS is “different” at my DD’s HS, almost laughably so. Apparently, 40% of the high school class qualifies, which doesn’t sound at all like a national honor society, and there is no volunteer hours requirement. </p>
<p>I forgot to mention, so far for NHS this semester D has worked with a group to help collect and assemble school supplies and backpacks for students that live in low income housing, worked to weed out invasive, non-native plants from the gardens at a local wild flower center and was student guide at the meet the teacher night for the PTO. I assure you she did more than “just show up” </p>
<p>@3scoutsmom - I didn’t mean to offend. And kudos to anyone who volunteers at all. Your explanation makes sense that they want to introduce kids to a variety of organizations. And by “showing up” I didn’t really mean that they don’t work hard during the 4 hours, just that with only 4 hours they aren’t organizing anything themselves or getting very deeply involved with a particular organization not that what they do isn’t helpful or worthwhile.</p>
<p>Thank you @fretfulmother! Your description sounds reasonable but how in the world does one reach that conclusion about a school? Conversations with recent grads? Web sites with student reviews? It does not seem to be something you could find out from a typical day visit. </p>
<p>@Cheeringsection - I have no idea. Maybe on the visit, the family saw no Black students, or maybe the male tour guide wore khakis and a button-down and held doors and said “yes ma’am” a lot. Considering some of the wacky conclusions kids sometimes reach on these tours (“I didn’t like her shoes so I could never come here” “Goucher sounds too much like Gauchet’s” “The squirrels were too big”) nothing would surprise me. Some colleges are still getting in hot water over allowing the flying of Confederate flags, or the aforementioned lawsuits about Greek houses, but I actually think those aren’t the kinds of things people are referring to; it seems like a softer impression.</p>
<p>@seal16 - I don’t think door-holding is inherently a problem. I was just trying to paint a picture of what someone might describe as “Southern” in the scheme of college visits. My own perspective is that I’d like the person closest to the door to hold it, within reason. We have room to disagree and be pluralistic on CC. ;)</p>
<p>@cakeisgreat - Check the K&W guide out in the library first. It’s a bit like reading a phone book. There are some other books aimed at kids with disabilities heading to college to help them become self-advocates. That’s where a lot of the critical prep is. That, and mastering assistive technology. </p>
<p>I’ve been wondering about this “Southern” school stuff. As I launched the college search for my DD16 (pre-loading, before college was really even on her radar), I noticed that I, someone who wasn’t born and breed in the south, was shying away from the colleges in the south. It made me ask “why?” and try to check my biases. Apparently they’re there and pretty ingrained. I’m rather surprised. This is even despite having lived & worked in a southern state as well as in No.VA/DC (kinda southern, eh?) & having one of my parents with “folks” from a couple southern states. </p>
<p>What makes someone (or an institution) Southern? I definitely feel that some of my friends who were born and breed in the south could be recognized as “southern” — but what the heck does that mean?! The debutant, the Norma Rae, the Texas gal, the Tom Wolfe, the military man, the civil rights advocate. Kinda stereotypes, but bits and pieces are there in real people I know. How does “place” form, shape or influence one? Who’s a “southern writer”? Etc. — Well, maybe that’s something for some college course to address. </p>
<p>@arisamp – I feel your pain. Our older son had semesters in high school that included something like a ‘D’ on an exam or a ‘zero’ for a major assignment not turned in, followed by the highest grade in the class on the semester final. He got several B’s that could have been A’s if he’d simply done and turned in all his work. The pattern of procrastination followed paradoxically by obsessive attention to detail (when he’d finally take on a task) is also familiar.<br>
Each year we’d start off by telling him that we were not going to organize his work for him, that he had to learn to do it by himself. Invariably he would dig himself a big hole at the beginning of the semester, and then we’d help him dig his way out (but generally not completely out). We reviewed every night’s (and frequently weekend days’) homework plan in detail. We had a pre-printed daily checklist that he’d fill out with us every evening, and then carry out the next day. Stuff like ‘turn in your biology homework’, ‘study for the vocab quiz during morning break’. During the period around final exams we’d take out a big calendar and together we’d write up a schedule for every day, i.e., breaking up the day into two or three-hour time slots, listing exactly what he should do in each slot. </p>
<p>Finally, his senior year we told him that we were done. He had a very challenging course load, and first semester of his senior year he got essentially all B’s (his prior GPA was about a 3.5). His second semester we received a letter from the assistant principal that he was in a B to C range in two of his courses, and in another he was in a C to D range. She wrote that if he didn’t raise his grades he was at risk of having his college acceptance(s) rescinded. When we gave her the scoop (above) she told us that we were doing him a huge favor in pulling back, that she knows of plenty of kids in college who are still relying on their parents for help with either ‘executive skills’ or actually with their specific assignments (like parents editing papers). The asst principal’s letter REALLY got his attention, and his academic performance the last quarter was remarkable. But it was a lot of unnecessary aggravation and anxiety for all of us.</p>
<p>Having had both sons and daughters I’m convinced that by definition most boys are, to a greater or lesser extent, knuckleheads. They don’t ‘get it’ until later in life. What motivated this boy was the risk of losing his slot at a college that he felt very fortunate to have been admitted to. That has carried over to his freshman year. He understands that he has an opportunity that if squandered will be gone forever. The second week of school he made an appointment at the learning center, and every Friday afternoon he meets with a learning specialist who works with him on time management and study skills/strategies. Prior to this he’d always seen seeking this sort of help as stigmatizing, and as an admission that he’s damaged goods. But the drive to succeed (?or maybe not to fail) has finally kicked in. It doesn’t hurt that she’s wonderful – he says she’s sharp as a tack, cuts right to the chase, and has been immensely helpful. </p>
<p>We had friends and family who told us we were wrong in intervening so much in his school work during those first three years of high school. But unless you have a kid like this you don’t know the heartache of watching them compromise their future because they don’t have their act together (yet). So my advice would be to sit your son down and try to impress upon him that his choices after high school may be severely compromised by his lack of organization, and you’re simply not going to let that happen. And then work with him day to day so he gets it right. The taste of success will whet his appetite for more success. There will be plenty of time to pull back later, when he’s over the hump of this junior year. </p>
<p>(Sorry for the length of this. Typing, interspersed with watching the football game, made me lose sense of time/length).</p>
<p>@cakeisgreat: both of mine were invited to apply for NHS, but S insists he hasn’t got time for one more thing in his schedule. He also says all their events conflict with band. It isn’t a hill I want to die on, to be honest. D has turned in her application though. It will definitely be to her advantage to have it.</p>
<p>As far as “Southern”…hmm. I’m not sure I could articulate it, but IME “Southern” is kind of like art or pornography…you know it when you see it.
I would say “Southern” includes a different definition of social behaviour: more circuitous and colourful than direct; possibly more formal (though not always); on a certain level more inclined toward the group than the individual (not that individuals aren’t tolerated, but they’re seen in relationship to their spot in the greater whole). Definitely more of a value placed on tradition and ancestors (and a positively Celtic obsession with kinship), unless we’re talking about Boston. In a lot of ways Boston and Charleston each remind me of the other, albeit with a funny accent (which one has the accent depends on your POV). More spanish moss. Pecans and live oaks and flowers. Humidity. In a lot of places, it seems like, more churches than people.
My kids both hold doors (mostly), but admittedly S16 does make a particular point of it on date nights. His (very Yankee) dad is his role model on that one. And he’s not likely to blink an eye at strong women, because his sister, stepsisters and aunts would hang him out to dry if he did.
I’m not going to get into discussions of racial issues and stereotyping. I think it’s probably socially acceptable in some circles to write the South, or Southerners, off as a collection of dim-bulbed rednecks, but that’s no more true than any other broad brush statement. Every place has wonderful, and horridly ignorant, people.</p>
<p>PS: I’m particular to Flanery O’Connor, in reference to “who’s a Southern writer?”</p>
<p>@AsleepAtTheWheel - thank you so much for posting about your son’s executive functions/org troubles and eventual success. My middle schooler is exactly as you described and the only one of four who I really worry about succeeding. But your post gives me hope!</p>
Maybe on the visit, the family saw no Black students, or maybe the male tour guide wore khakis and a button-down and held doors and said “yes ma’am” a lot. Considering some of the wacky conclusions kids sometimes reach on these tours (“I didn’t like her shoes so I could never come here” “Goucher sounds too much like Gauchet’s” “The squirrels were too big”) nothing would surprise me. 
Some colleges are still getting in hot water over allowing the flying of Confederate flags, or the aforementioned lawsuits about Greek houses, but I actually think those aren’t the kinds of things people are referring to; it seems like a softer impression.</p>