@mtrosemom thanks for both Arizona reviews! DS won’t consider either school (has AZ issues apparently) but your reviews are very helpful.
@mcdmom I can’t speak to track per-se but can speak to athletic recruiting in general. In our experience unless the student athlete drives it…and I mean really REALLY drives it…unless they are a superstar then the options may be limited. Colleges want the student to own it, initiate it and drive it and most sports don’t offer money, or at least not big money. Have you looked at LAC’s? Our experience was that some of the private catholic/jesuit schools offered more money than others. In our case it was soccer. SD could have played at a couple of schools, “may” have gotten money from one or 2. At the end of the day she decided it was better to pick the school she loved and play for their club team. I am grateful for the recruiting process as that school would not have been on her radar otherwise but at the same point in time, playing club, still for the school against other schools but without the D1 pressure (and sitting on the bench for no money with an overstuffed roster) is a far better fit for her academic success but lets her still “move”.
Her HS soccer friends are a mix (and were a mix with stats), some are playing for colleges with substantial money, (private though) one with a full ride at a very mid level state directional school (and kind of hates the school but needed the full ride) and others went the same route she did. Bottom line is all are playing and are academically successful so far. Win win. Mid level state girl hopes to transfer and play club with the other two at our flagship if they can swing tuition.
The one friend recruited early, ivy, big $$…worked it and worked it and worked it, self driven, from the moment she entered HS. At a truly ridiculous, almost obnoxious level. Still, I give her mad props. She knew what she wanted (as did her brother, who also got a mostly full ride, soccer, to an ivy). Soccer in general is not big $$. The others who got money targeted schools that fit them academically and they added something to their program. All the ones who “could have” played but chose the school over the $ or spot on the team, made the right choice for them but have found a way to keep the sport.
Bottom line is, I really would look at some of the privates, your son could be very very attractive to them!
@eandesmom – while those athletes may have gotten full rides to their Ivies, it was not due to their sports. The Ivies, and more so HYP, offer very generous financial aid, but no $$ for athletic recruiting or merit aid. Some schools offer token ‘scholarships’ of a few thousand to help offset an internship expense, or something like that, but no pay to play at Ivies or NESCACs. (Actually, none in D III, I think…)
@CT1417 …a classmate mom cornered me the other day to talk colleges. She was super pumped because Princeton was (according to her) “recruiting her son.” He is a good kid and a good athlete and I while I knew they didn’t give merit $$ I had no idea about athletic $$. So she has it kind of wrong then? No $$ for athletes at Princeton?
@carachel2 – not among the Ivies, but they do have very generous FA. They absolutely do recruit for athletics, and athletes can end up with a full ride, but only if they have financial need.
By saying they are offering him scholarships, I am not sure what this would mean. I don’t think these scholarships would make much of a dent in the total COA.
Ivy League schools provide financial aid to students, including athletes, only on the basis of financial need as determined by each institution’s Financial Aid Office. There are no academic or athletic scholarships in the Ivy League. A coach may assist a prospective student-athlete to obtain an estimated financial aid award, however only the Financial Aid Office has the authority to determine financial aid awards and to notify students officially of their actual or estimated awards.
Here is a link from Yale, saying the same thing:
No school in the Ivy League offers aid based on athletic ability. Like all Ivy League institutions, Yale University offers financial aid based on need.
No merit aid or athletic scholarships at Ivies, only need-based financial aid. No athletic scholarships at D3 schools either. “Full ride” means merit aid at a school at least equal to tuition+fees+room and board. It’s an oft misused term.
I suspect in the case of the Ivy and “little Ivy” (who happen to be twins) they were able to leverage the happy coincidence of the older brother being a senior in college at the time and thus 3 in college allowing for “need” aid plus scholarships.
Not negating their academics which were certainly quite respectable but I know that the family was most certainly not need based from a fafsa standpoint and perhaps only mildly so from a Css profile standpoint (if at a full needs met school) beyond the fact of 3 in school. That said, there is absolutely no way they could manage full pay at the 3 schools combined, and I do know both kids were recruited and signed early with promised funds.
So yes, it may well be that they did not get “athletic” scholarships but somehow aid was magically offered when, with academics alone either twin had an average chance at best at their chosen schools and arguably the H kid, less so.
Their overall HS demographics, despite both kids being unhooked outside of soccer, and where they fit in those rankings as well as location, may well have added a hook.
@mdcmom my sophomore daughter is taking Forensics next year rather than AP Bio because she’s very good in Chem, wasn’t a fan of honors bio freshman year, and the kids who’ve taken the class already emphasize that there’s a heavy chem element in Forensics. Here’s the course description for our school (which may or may not help you):
“The Forensic Science curriculum is designed to build upon science concepts and to apply science
to the investigation of crime scenes. Students will learn the scientific protocols for
analyzing a crime scene, how to use chemical and physical separation methods to isolate and
identify materials, how to analyze biological evidence and the criminal use of tools, including
impressions from firearms, tool marks, arson, and explosive evidence. Pre-requisites: Biology/Honors Biology and Physical Science/Physics and Chemistry/Honors Chemistry*”
@CT1417 good info! It will be interesting to see how this all plays out. I can’t even remotely think they would qualify for financial aid. I would estimate their income at least as >$200K. She sure was happy about the "scholarship’ he was going to get to play baseball at Princeton.
Currently there is a kid from Ds school who has gotten into Yale (ED it looks like); Columbia and just now Stanford. Is it bad to admit that I check his twitter account every now and then? I don’t think they are well off but I don’t think they are low socioeconomic either. Now that CC has 'schooled" me about how all this works, I am dying to know how it will all play out. Of course, I doubt he is going to post financial info so I’ll never know how much loans, etc. they take out if needed. Regardless, SUPER impressive kid that everyone just loves. So proud of him…just hope he can afford it.
@MotherOfDragons - Does your D participate in Science Olympiad? They have Forensics and Chemistry Lab events. My son is competing in both this year and won regional medals in both and have state tournament next month.
Without knowing the details of each child’s offer, which I do not, I certainly cannot say. Bottom line is they each had a hook that worked and packages were offered to each that also worked. A happy coincidence of three in school at once? Possibly. Certainly either school could offer merit and not tie it to the sport and their stats could stand up scrutiny I am sure. Either way, each got something.
@srk2017 it’s not a big thing at their school, and they never really got into it because TSA takes up so much of their time. TSA is sort of the 800 lb nerd gorilla at their school.
For kicks I ran the EFC at the little ivy, using our numbers which are similar. I suspect our salaries are higher but but the bigger picture is fairly comparable. With 3 kids in college, at the little ivy, NPC shows a 33K grant. H came in similar a bit less, 11K “scholarship” if only 2 kids in school and 27K for 3. I didn’t test the little ivy with only 2 kids in lol as their NPC was more of a pita to fill out.
So, in that scenario one school, (assuming zero additional scholarships) would actually come in a tad less than our flagship, and one about 10k more. I do not think the oldest has graduated yet (not positive on that) but should this year if he hasn’t already, so they have this benefit for 1-2 years of the twins college years, possibly longer.
Interestingly enough, the older brother is also an athlete but in his case it’s cross country and I’m almost positive he received some monies. Whether it was merit or athletic I’ve no idea. Bugging me that I can’t recall where! All 3 kids though were definitely recruited, the daughter much more so with a verbal commitment from the school in her junior year.
It’s a brutal business though, we watched another girl who had a similar verbal commitment junior year, watch the coaching staff change at her OOS D1 school of choice, offer rescinded and then a mad scramble to find a spot to play. It was so hard to watch.
Question though…for those who are more familiar with this kind of thing.
In the scenario above, once older kid is out of school, I assume that those grant/scholarship numbers are adjusted, correct?
@eandesmom, DS is on the most rigorous math track available…Algebra in 8th grade, Geo in 9th, Trig in 10th, PreCalc now, and Calculus in 12th. We don’t have AP Calc available. Regents is the standard NYS track, with a statewide Regents exam that must be passed in order to graduate. In math and science our “honors” track is starting 9th grade science/math in 8th grade to allow an extra science/math class in twelfth grade (AP Bio or Calculus). For each social studies and english topic there is one regents class or one advanced class; DS is mostly been in the regents version.
On the athletic front, everything he does revolves around track. It’s making it awkward because he has no idea what major he wants; he just wants to run. So he’s VERY motivated on that front. This is hard for me to relate to! He’s top in our section in his speciality for all schools, not just small ones, but in the middle of the pack at state championships. This probably doesn’t translate into big awards, sigh, but we’re hoping that if he could get a few thousand dollars it might make more colleges financially feasible.
On the Ivy front…it’s true, no athletic scholarships. DS’15 was a good football player in HS (NYS player of the year in our class) but was way too tired of hitting people to want to play in college. He got letters from Ivy coaches, and it was a hard decision because we weren’t sure if he’d get into the school of his choice (Cornell Engineering) without that hook. But it was clear that any money he got would be FA, not athletic money. He finally decided not to pursue the football and got in anyway . He got most of his expenses covered but it’s pure FA. Sometimes around here I hear people talking about a child that got a full ride to Cornell but you’ve got to laugh because all they’re saying is that they’re as low income as we are (pastor family).
So he’s VERY motivated on that front. This is hard for me to relate to! He’s top in our section in his speciality for all schools, not just small ones, but in the middle of the pack at state championships. This probably doesn’t translate into big awards, sigh, but we’re hoping that if he could get a few thousand dollars it might make more colleges financially feasible.