@Momof3B - pardon me while I pick my jaw up off the floor. What is the matter with people? Thank you for standing up for your son; I’m glad that he’s taking things in stride; you’ve raised him well!
Wow. @Momof3B Unbelievable. Thank goodness your son has you as an advocate and not buying into that kind of thinking.
@Momof3B Good for you for telling her off! You know their whole business model must be based on making people feel like crap so they can be persuaded to pay that much $$$ for tutoring.
@Momof3B You’re a better person than me. Unfortunately, I don’t have much of a modulator or governor for my mouth. I would started drilling down on their life’s accomplishments. And probably would have begun picking on their failings. And then had a cow in the front reception area. 
A lot of famous successful people have been told they’re less than the best early in life.
@Momof3B OMG!
- Justifiable homicide, although not worth the jail time. Your restraint was admirable.
- I don’t know your S but already like him. Need more like him in business.
- You are the best mom!
Oh wise ones, help! How do you focus a college search when your kid has no real idea what he wants to study?
The situation - S21, very smart. SAT 1490 first try (no prep, has decided to do a bit of prep because he is sure mid 1500s attainable). Top GPA in school. Has won several math competitions. Student leader. Outstanding debater. Loves politics, involved in a campaign.
For a few years, people pegged him as Future Engineer (and he agreed) because of math and science skills, and he did love building things. Now he says no to engineering. No to business, mostly because S19 is in that. He says “Law” vaguely, but has no idea what he wants to study for undergrad to get there or why he would even be interested. Maybe Poli Sci, but my husband cringes at that degree, because we know too many Poli Sci baristas.
So how to create a college list? My concern with LACs is, what if he goes back to the engineering idea? What if he decides to do finance? S19’s journey showed us the choice of schools for that mattered a bit.
He has taken several career tests - they are inconclusive, showing that he has an interest/aptitude for a wide variety of things.
Send him to Big State U that has everything so he can find his path? He is a very adaptable kid who needs little hand-holding, so big would be okay.
@Momof3B – you should write a google review on your experience. Would feel good and help others avoid their scammy ways! So sorry this happened.
@SammoJ – I think any type of college is okay for a truly undecided kid, but generally agree bigger might be helpful.
My H and I are both poli sci majors and we’re doing just fine, lol! My H is an attorney and I got a master’s in public policy and work in education policy.
My friend’s bright “STEM-focused while in high school” kid got a big scholarship at UNC (our flagship) where he suddenly changed gears and is now a Poli Sci / Russian double major looking at a career in international affairs. (I think he’s going to work for the CIA but can’t tell us, lol).
Your S will find his path in college! Just focus on other types of fit – financial, social, geographic, etc.
@SammoJ He’ll probably be happy anywhere. Have you taken him to big. medium and small schools - did any feel “better” than any other?
If you want to do some research, maybe look for either (a) a school that encourages a wide variety of courses to be taken Freshman year so he doesn’t have to pull the trigger on a major to early or the opposite (b) schools that have a small core so if he changes his mind, he has space for the new major’s courses without getting behind a semester. Both would probably be good for an undecided kid.
@SammoJ I have zero experience with big schools as H and I both went to smaller/mid-sized ones as did my only sister, and my kids are looking in that direction as well. It certainly sounds as if that larger school path might be a good fit, but I wouldn’t necessarily write off the smaller/mid-sized schools just yet. Many SLACs allow you to wait a fair amount of time before declaring your major. And some still have Engineering as an option, should you choose it (My own undergrad school followed a liberal arts curriculum but had a few graduate programs including Engineering…you could simply major in Engineering as an undergrad without getting an Engineering degree - I got a Bachelor of Arts with a major in Engineering - or you could choose to take some additional Engineering courses to do the BS in a 5th year if you so chose, so it offered that flexibility of dabbling a bit but leaving open the Engineering possibility).
In terms of political science, my husband majored in it and now has a doctorate in Public Health Policy and works for the CDC. When he first graduated from undergrad his jobs weren’t particularly aligned with the political science major - he had an interest in health and was working hourly shifts at a residential care hospital for kids and working a second, part-time job as a high school swim coach. But he was happy and busy and working towards future goals and growing up. It was perfect.
My first job out of undergrad was pseudo aligned with my major…but in so many cases that first job is not. Recently my husband met someone (middle aged) through work who was doing something interesting and who impressed him…he looked him up and found that he’d majored in geography undergrad. He was not working for Google Maps, though. ? His job was unrelated to that undergrad major except that he had learned so many other things while in that major - critical thinking, collaboration, public speaking, and so on which had served him well as he’d followed his own unique path.
My philosophy is study what interests you at the time, take the classes with the best professors, do what engages you because it will propel you to do your best work, to care, to be involved, to shine - you’d don’t have to know the endgame in the beginning.
That’s a long walk to agree with @AlmostThere2018 … focus on the many other types of fit, look at both big and small and appreciate what each has to offer, and see what resonates.
In terms of particular schools, here’s one suggestion - my nephew is currently doing a graduate degree (5th year free) at Lehigh after completing his undergrad there last year - he chose a business-aligned major, had amazing internships, and has had his job for next year lined up for a long time…Lehigh obviously has Engineering/STEM options (my father did undergrad there in the 60s and was a physicist for his career) and also things like Psychology (which my sister majored in when she was there), Political Science, etc.
It sounds as if your son will have lots of great options.
3 more college visits this weekend: Muhlenberg, Moravian, and Dickinson. Muhlenberg is now the favorite for S21 but admittedly he’s not done much research yet on individual physics departments, but at least he finally now seems motivated and interested in the process.
Some thoughts on each:
-Muhlenberg - 2 students leading the tour and only myself and my son on the tour so a great tour despite very cold conditions and snow. He’s had concerns about religiously affiliated colleges previously but before touring the campus church the guides asked if we were comfortable going inside. It seemed like a weird question to me, but I think it helped put him at ease that there are no religious viewpoints pressured on anyone. Cafeteria is exceptional! Physics department is small, so could be an issue, but we’ll cross that road later.
-Moravian - unfortunately a poor tour. The student didn’t seem to know much and it was a very cursory overview as we walked past buildings. She also didn’t exude intellectual curiosity like the other student guides we’ve had, and for my kid that’s a big turnoff. Campus is pleasant, but feels very small, probably due to the split campuses and number of commuter students. It’s off the list.
-Dickinson - Attended Dickinson Day and it was packed. Tour groups kept bumping into each other simply due to the turnout. We did take walk around again, focusing on science, after lunch, and that was much more leisurely. I could see his brain just lighting up in the science building. Fantastic campus. He liked the very visible political activism (lots of chalk messages on campus sidewalks and a very prominently hung banner). He dove into the school newspaper and relished the political commentary section. I like that it meets needs but not need blind so will be a stretch for sure, but I suspect he’ll apply. Food was good as well, though not the same spectacular setting as Muhlenberg. I really thought this would be his frontrunner due to the enthusiasm he showed while were there.
Next is mapping out the spring break tour. Will go to Oberlin and probably Denison, with others to be determined. The 2 hour or less drives to each of the schools this weekend was fantastic so PA schools hold an appeal.
@SammoJ I don’t know what part of the country you are in but Lafayette or Lehigh are two schools that have both strong liberal arts and engineering and are smaller and smaller class sizes etc. than the big state university.
@Momof3B You should way more restraint then I ever would have. The nerve of that woman! And 500 hours of tutoring…really?? Who even has time for such a crazy recommendation!
I pray my daughter finds a man like your son, he sounds great!
We went to see SUNY Bing yesterday and D really loved it. We have plans to go see RIT and SUNY Oswego, and also she wants to look at Manhattan College, but that is local so no big trip needed. SUNY Stony Brook is on her list to apply, but it’s her fall back school. This is all getting very real!
@AlmostThere2018 working on it ?
@AndreaLynn that is very kind of you, blessings for all our children!
@SammoJ For a kid who is interested in everything and hasn’t ruled out engineering entirely, I would recommend the following:
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large universities with honors/scholars programs. These can be a good fit for intellectually curious undecided kids because many emphasize interdisciplinary learning. In theory they provide the best of both worlds - LAC experience with similarly bright kids within a large school that offers many majors and programs. Not all are the same, though. Barrett Honors College at ASU, for example, has 6,000 students. Honors at U of Central Florida is also quite large (Both of these universities are huge overall, which is not necessarily a bad thing, just putting it out there). You can contrast this with Rutgers Honors College, which is much smaller and more selective. You would also need to check at potential schools of interest how difficult it might be to transfer to an engineering school if your son has a change of heart along the way. It’s generally easier to be accepted to engineering and transfer out than the other way around.
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schools where there aren’t barriers to switching between engineering and Arts & Sciences - Case Western, Wash U St L, and Rochester are three examples where this can happen.
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I wouldn’t rule out LACs just yet. A lot can change between now and May 2021. There are many paths to finance beyond an undergraduate finance degree. If there are some LACs that appeal to him, it might make sense to have a few in the mix.
Finally, I know plenty of people who majored in Political Science who are not baristas!
@Momof3B I am so sorry you and your son had to endure that. I can’t believe she expected to get business from you after the way she spoke.
@SammoJ For a kid with a strong quantitative bent + interest in political science, what immediately comes to mind for me is political polling or related social science research. Might want to double major or major/minor in something like PoliSci + statistics/math/data science.
William & Mary might be a good fit. Larger school (about 6K) than most LACs but still a LAC experience, focused on undergrad education and big emphasis on involving students in research. Strong in public policy with links to DC including the opportunity to study in DC. Maybe their interdisciplinary program in Public Policy would interest him – “Students pursuing our undergraduate major study economics, statistics, politics, law, ethics, and policy domains. This grounding is excellent preparation for further study at the graduate level and for participating effectively in the policy process at government agencies, nonprofit organizations, and private-sector firms.” They also have a 3:2 engineering program w/ Columbia if he comes back to that.
@Momof3B - sorry that you ran into such an unpleasant person. Really not cool. Also, who has time for 500 hours of tutoring? That’s insane.
Finishing up spring break planning. Heading down south like others here - Washington & Lee, University of Richmond, UVA, and American University. Will be a quick trip.
We’re in a similar boat @SammoJ My son is very undecided, but has engineering as a maybe. It’s really tough as a ton of schools require you to declare your engineering major when you apply or at the very least declare general engineering. I realize that ABET engineering has a high course load, so it’s tough to enter too late, but it’d be nice if there were more options. I don’t think he’d have any issue taking the typical first year engineering prereqs to stay on track, but doesn’t really want to declare.
My S21 is engineering right now. He says it’s easier to transfer out than in. So he’ll start there (at least that’s the plan now!) and then if he changes his mind – likely to CS or business – he’l transfer out. Of course, CS can be hard to get into some places b/c there’s so much demand. If he goes to a NC State and we’re paying in-state I won’t care so much if he takes an extra semester b/c he changes major. But if he goes OOS or private, I have serious worries b/c of the $$.
@Momof3B I was so upset reading your post! I would save the 25K for tuition and research the MANY test optional colleges out there. Kids are more than their test scores and GPAs. If he can spend time writing some good essays (maybe even about this horrible experience!), he is bound to find a college that is a good match. Also, two of my friends with boys have told me that their sons (one of whom is now at Northeastern in graduate school and one who is working for Teach for America) didn’t really blossom academically until college. One son went to West Virginia University and one went to James Madison University undergrad.
@nichols51 Agree with your philosophy! Do what you love and you will do it well.