Like other seniors, my son now has 3 weeks to make a decision about college.
He’s been undecided about major, having applied to schools for engineering, comp. game science, animation, industrial design, digital media design and fine arts.
He has talked about being a game designer, but I’m not sure. He is a creative designer type, for sure.
But he also has some health and learning issues (math disability, low energy, diabetes) that are concerning to me (he thinks he’ll be fine), and I worry he’ll not be ready to go to college in the fall. He was leaning towards So. Cal schools before he got the acceptance from Penn. However, he does say he feels “behind” and would like a gap year, if possible.
He got admitted to a lot of schools, but because of finances, is probably looking at chosing among the following:
University of Pennsylvania-Fine Arts major, but could move into Digital Media Design-an engineering degree with lots of CS and Fine Arts- at end of freshman year. By far, the most affordable and he could take a gap year if they approved. DMD has math through Calc III. Apparently has some connection to Pixar.
UCI-Computer Game Science; seems a very marketable degree near gaming studios and my son seems to like it. Has math through Calc II, and has Stats and Boolean Algebra. Unfortunately, the cost is about 5K more than Penn. The least generous UC. Could not take a gap year.
Cal State Fullerton-Entertainment Art/Animation; he's waiting to see if he got a full tuition scholarship. Even with that, it would be about 3.5K more than Penn. Again, though, in So. Cal and close to game studios/film studios. No gap year.
UCSD-Interdisciplinary Computing and Arts; sort of a weird major. He doesn't want to try to move into straight CS. Not sure what it would be used for, but this is the local UC, so he could be close to home. Living on campus would be 3K more than Penn. No gap year.
Purdue-Industrial Design; Honors College. Has not visited, so not sure it's even viable. Would be 2.5K more than Penn. He could also switch to Computer Graphics Technology. No gap year.
He’s eliminated other schools due to cost or dislike. (Northeastern, U Rochester, SJSU, CSULB, SDSU, etc)
Which school would be best for Game Design/Animation industry? What other factors need to be considered?
Most people are telling him to go to Penn because of the reputation and low cost. He and dh are visiting next week. We don’t want to influence his decision, but do want him to consider variables.
Would it be correct to assume that Penn is the only one of the above that allows deferring admission if he wants to take a gap year while retaining an admission offer?
Something to consider is whether being nearby versus across the country makes that much of a difference (if he lives on/near campus, rather than at home) in terms of managing the medical issues. Has he been able to manage them on his own these days? Also, if being somewhat near a relative is desired, isn’t his older brother in that region?
" UCSD-Interdisciplinary Computing and Arts; sort of a weird major. He doesn’t want to try to move into straight CS. Not sure what it would be used for, but this is the local UC, so he could be close to home"
for these 2 reasons I’d advise UCSD.
1- If he has trouble with math then he should stay far away from Engineering classes, whcih require a LOT of College level math.
“this is the local UC, so he could be close to home-”
2-kids with LD’s will probably have some trouble adapting in college. A lot of changes, all at once, can wreck havoc on young students who are not yet prepared to live on their own.
Being close to home will be a comfort to him, and you.
Go with your gut and let him have a Gap year if he wants it. He can hone some of his CS skills with online classes and be more ready to tackle college successfully .
I vote for the gap year, perhaps attending a CC to get the math out of the way.
I’m sure you have looked at the academic support at all of these schools. I found that it varied wildly when we were looking for my child. My quick rule of thumb was if it was in the basement then there would be issues because the university didn’t value that college students are different. Kind of silly I know, but I interviewed a lot of them.
Here are the math requirements for the schools. He is outstanding at math reasoning (thus high scores on reasoning tests) and weak on computation. He’s had a tutor (2-4 X a month) for all his math classes so far. He’s currently taking Calculus I at the CC. Getting a high B, but stressing about the class because of the professor.
UCSD: Calc I, II and possibly Calc III
UCI math: Calc I, Calc II, Linear Alg, Discrete Math, Boolean Alg., Prob & Stats.
Penn: Calc I, II, III
He CAN’T take a gap year if he goes to UCSD. UCs don’t allow it. That’s the issue with the So Cal schools. He would be off to college in four + months if he chooses a So Cal school.
So, you’re saying 12-20K worth of debt is worth it for UCSD/UCI? He would have no debt with Penn.
You think UCSD’s major would allow him to go right into a job in the game design/animation field? They don’t have any animation classes. It’s 75% applied and 25% theory, so they say.
UCB, brother is in Boston. I thought maybe Northeastern would be a great choice, but he just visited and didn’t like it, so it’s off the table.
He would not know anyone in the region. My first cousin is in NYC and graduated from Penn. That’s the closest person to Penn.
Gap year typically means no college attendance during that time. Many colleges will require the student to apply as a transfer if s/he takes college courses anywhere after high school graduation, although some colleges may make exceptions for deferred matriculation or other delayed entry programs for students they have already admitted. If the student takes a gap year with deferred matriculation to Penn, then he needs to ask Penn specifically whether taking any college courses during that time is allowed while keeping the admission offer.
Should he go ahead and ask that now, ucb? When he visits next week? I’m kind of scared for him to bring it up before he commits to a school. Penn gives a student until June 5th to request a deferment.
I know MIT allows students to take CC classes. I know he’d love to take one more semester of animation at the CC as third semester is doing something he really wants to learn. He also wants to form a quartet and get gigs for money. And then I think he wants to get a real handle on his low energy.
Taking another semester of Calc at the CC might be a good idea, too. (With a different teacher-the current teacher is the pits, unfortunately).
It will also give us more time to find someone to retest him for documentation for his math disability since his testing is now five years old.
But I’m afraid of his asking them now about a gap year/deferal. I’m not sure what I’m afraid of, though. Maybe them saying they made a mistake?
I have asked son and dh to find out about disability services when they visit Penn. I think that’s very important, too.
If he is studying game programming and he doesn’t have to study linear algebra and discrete math, he is not studying game programming. Don’t be fooled when looking at the Digital Media Design curriculum at Penn. There are six required math courses in the math department, but all the computer graphics courses are also math courses. Have a look at the course objectives for Computer Graphics, a required class:
Topics cover: geometric transformations, geometric algorithms, software systems (OpenGL, shaders), 3D object models (surface, volume and implicit), visible surface algorithms, image synthesis, shading and mapping, ray tracing, radiosity, global illumination, sampling, Monte Carlo path tracing, photon mapping, and anti-aliasing.
I guess the other thing is this whole game design/animation idea. I mean, he’s totally a creator/designer, but who knows how stable this industry is. I feel like a degree is a really good thing…but I’m not him.
Would it be better to stay in So Cal for this industry? What does one do with ICAM or Fine Arts (there are a number of animation, modeling, and digital design classes at Penn; very few at UCSD)? Go to grad school? Or are they stand alone?
I know it’s hard to know the future, right?
Would the Penn network be valuable even with a Fine Arts major? (I guess so in as much as there’s the connection with Pixar)
I was looking up on Linked In for Game Design jobs, and it doesn’t seem like all of the jobs even need a degree.
@CArdinal Fang, thanks for the more detailed info. Here’s the thing about math that we know:
If it’s applied (like in his physics class that he took at the college), he does really well. It make sense to him. He can reason very well. So he thought Boolean Algebra and Discrete Math seemed fine.
If it’s just math (trig, calculus) and not combined with other areas, it’s hard for him. He’s never gotten below a B, though. He works very, very hard, harder than anyone I’ve known in math.
He doesn’t have enough experience in math to know about all those topics, but I think he can talk to his brother about them.
Do you use math in Java? That’s been an easy class for him, but I don’t know what you do in it.
@ucbalumnus, great idea. We will do that once he’s over his illness. Right now, he’s just trying to get through calculus this week while being very ill. Good life experience-ya gotta keep going in college even when you’re sick.
Appreciate all the things you’ve given us to talk about/think about.
Writing computer programs often does not require much math per se (unless writing a program that does math), but the ability to think logically that is important in writing computer programs is something that is common to the type of thinking done in math. Math topics like boolean algebra and discrete math will be, in terms of thought processes, more in common with computer science than topics like calculus and differential equations.
Ask if he can take CC classes if he takes a gap year for Penn.
Also, you, as a family, need to decide about distance as a factor given his health concerns. Make sure he has health care providers at other locations before you make your final decision. Also check your insurance for coverage OOS.
I think the math in the game programming would be fine because he’s connecting it to something he’s really interested in. If he’s motivated, I think he’ll understand it better.
I do see that the DMD department gets good professor reviews. He’s also had a good interaction with someone in the dept. who knows his disabilities and thinks he’d still be a good fit. Who knows, though.
I know UC Irvine has tutoring through Calc II, and then you have to sign up specially for tutoring in other classes. I assume Penn and UCSD would, as well.
I guess at Penn, he could switch out of DMD if he can’t hack it, but what does one do at UCI? Can you switch out of that major? To what, is the question. I think at UCSD, you can move out of ICAM into Communications or Media.
@thumper1, good point about emergencies. The extra time would also allow us to find a local endocrinologist that he/we like.
Can I just call Penn up anonymously, or should he ask that when he’s there?
Sbjdorlo- make an appointment for them with the disability director at Penn. I did that with my S at each school and it was invaluable. They can look over the documentation you have, explain what level of services the school offers. They will all be different. The school my S ended up at was great about not requiring us to retest him saving us a lot of money.
At all the schools ask what is the policy on medical leave. The UC that my D attends only allows 1 quarter over 4 years.
And last but not least congratulations.
Thank you so much, @mom60! I don’t know why I didn’t think to talk with disability office. I am not getting a clear understanding of their schedule for the visit at Penn, but I will try to get the info and make that appointment.
And that’s good to know that at least one UC allows one quarter leave. I guess I need to look up policies. I was going by hearsay.
And @ucbalumnus, you gave me an idea; we can talk with ds’s endo and see if he might have recommendations for us. He may even know someone in thea area. That’s great that they have a teaching hospital on campus. Our insurance is very good (BCBS PPO), so I don’t think that will be a problem.