<p>Recent posts have me wondering about the perceptions Cornell students have about each other in different schools. One poster, for example, nearly spat with contempt at the thought of transferring to a less 'prestigious' college within Cornell. Others asked about the various acceptance rates. I know there will always be people who judge, but I'm wondering, past the usual politically correct answer about 'fit': will a kid in, say, HumEc or ILR be made to feel somehow lower-status than a Arts and Sciences or Engineering kid? Is there some silent but perceptible sizing up that goes on ?</p>
<p>“Is there some silent but perceptible sizing up that goes on ?”</p>
<p>I would probably say that is the best way to put it, and it is what it is. Realistically there are major differences between the endowed schools (eng, A+S, etc) and the contract colleges (ILR, Hum ec, Cals). Objectively speaking the admissions test scores/grades of the contract schools students are lower overall. There is significantly less diversity in the contract colleges since such a high percentage of students come from the same state (NY) and pay less tuition. As such the resources aren’t quite equal as professors in the endowed part are paid significantly more. </p>
<p>That is definitely not to say there aren’t top students in the contract colleges and that the programs aren’t top notch. Though again realistically there is a perception among SOME people that these variations between the types of colleges (and the fact that they differ from other top 15 schools) are significant. In my 4 years I’ve seen plenty of extremely talented students come out of both sets of colleges, so don’t think that being in a certain college limits potential.</p>
<p>Thanks for your honesty. I’m not so much worried about limiting potential–I know my son will find challenges–I’m worried about him being made to feel somehow inadequate or illegitimate in the eyes of his classmates. He is a smart kid who has worked hard and I don’t want him to feel like he has to prove himself or is second-rate. Is that an issue? </p>
<p>Also, how does the lower cost of the contract colleges mean that there is less diversity at them? I’d think that lower costs would open doors to more families, no?</p>
<p>You’re obviously referring to me.</p>
<p>Nobody overtly condescends or belittles someone in a contract college. You might get some good natured jokes about getting in through the backdoor or being a farmer or something, but that’s about as much as you’ll hear.</p>
<p>Is there silent prejudice, though? Not from everyone, and it’s only used in snap judgements. Once you get to know the person, it doesn’t really matter that much. There are smart and dumb people in each college. There’s really nothing to be worried about.</p>
<p>This perception isn’t unfounded, though. ILR majors + non-science Ag majors (Communications, etc.) are in fact generally not as bright as CAS/Engineering and it’s relatively easy to get in. Seriously though, who cares? You like having these people in your classes because they’re good for the curve. My FWS is filled with ILR/Aggies + Engineers (their speciality obviously is math and not writing) and I have done a total of one homework assignment and write all the essays the day before they’re due, yet I still have a solid ‘A’.</p>
<p>Edit: Another point. Why does prestige concern you when the choice should have been made based on fit?</p>
<p>^^^Hahaha, my ILR D1 graduated with a 3.9 GPA with an IT minor. (that is basically computer science.). </p>
<p>Okay, so I do not know every ILR graduate. Nor do I know every Cornell grad. But your statement is ridiculous. </p>
<p>D1 graduated in 2010. She’ll make about $170,000/yr this year. How are you doing two years out ???</p>
<p>So your statement about –
ILR majors + non-science Ag majors (Communications, etc.) are in fact generally not as bright as CAS/Engineering and it’s relatively easy to get in.</p>
<p>is completely ridiculous.</p>
<p>This is nothing to worry about. Cornell is a school with top faculty and top programs. Unfortunately many a student will find any reason to say he or she is better than someone else. And this attitude partially poisons the social atmosphere since it extends beyond academics.</p>
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<p>…I think this is just the “attitude” she is talking about! While stats do show CALS in general to have moderately lower SAT scores, HE & ILR match up fairly well with CAS. </p>
<p><a href=“http://dpb.cornell.edu/documents/1000176.pdf[/url]”>http://dpb.cornell.edu/documents/1000176.pdf</a>
<a href=“http://dpb.cornell.edu/documents/1000177.pdf[/url]”>http://dpb.cornell.edu/documents/1000177.pdf</a></p>
<p>Before my kids went to Cornell, I thought each school would be more vertical without much of integration, but I was wrong. My kids have friends at different schools. They all live together freshman year, are able to take classes outside of their own school, and most on campus recruiting are open to all students. I think most students think they are Cornellians first. When my kids talk about their friends they do not mention which school they are at because it is not that important. D1 will say, “He/she is in this fraternity/sorority.”:)</p>
<p>You see people asking about acceptance rate for different schools on this forum because people are trying to game the system. But for the all the years I have been on the Cornell forum, I don’t think I’ve got it figured out if it is easier to get into a contract school as a NYer or not. I know D1’s boyfriend was in CAL then transferred to engineering so he could pay lower tuition for two years.</p>
<p>^^
Great, thanks for completely cutting out the first part of my post.</p>
<p>@Morrismm</p>
<p>Why on earth do you constantly mention your daughter, her 3.9 GPA, and her investment banking job? I’ve literally heard this story 30+ times, and your anecdotal evidence does nothing to refute what I said. </p>
<p>@Oldfort</p>
<p>Of course people have friends in other colleges. Are you kidding me? Nobody refuses to be someone else’s friend because they’re in a different college. It’s not like it’s a social stratification system or something. Seriously, nobody really cares and if they ask, it’s only out of a personal interest standpoint.</p>
<p><a href=“http://www.dpb.cornell.edu/documents/1000003.pdf[/url]”>http://www.dpb.cornell.edu/documents/1000003.pdf</a></p>
<p>All of the schools are selective. Yes, it is generally easier to get into ILR and even easier to transfer in. No, nobody uses that to judge individual people.</p>
<p>Thanks, all. It seems like parents and students are in different places on this issue. Parents, thank you for the sensible and grounding words. Islander, when you say it ‘partially poisons the social atmosphere,’ can you give me an example? </p>
<p>Saugus, I’m not thinking about prestige directly. I’m thinking about others’ attitudes making my son feel like crap. It’s the other end of prestige–it’s what people who are hung up on ‘prestige’ think of those who don’t have it. </p>
<p>He’s applied ED so may be a done deal but I wish I’d though about this before.</p>
<p>It’s seriously not an issue and your son will never be made to feel like crap because of what college he’s in. There’s so many students and so much interaction between the schools (in basically any class you’ll have people from almost every school). Really people associate much more strongly with their fraternity/sorority/acapella group/dance team/sports team/ student group/etc. then they do with colleges.</p>
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<p>…this is exactly what I’ve found with my D.</p>
<p>^^^</p>
<p>Like I already said, no, of course that isn’t an issue.</p>
<p>I mean, I would be lying if I said it plays no factor into snap judgements at all among SOME people, but it’s seriously nothing to be concerned about.</p>
<p>*Thanks, all. It seems like parents and students are in different places on this issue. Parents, thank you for the sensible and grounding words. Islander, when you say it ‘partially poisons the social atmosphere,’ can you give me an example? *</p>
<p>Hmm…I’m in Greek Life and you’re not? I’ll be hesitant to interact with you. You’re wearing something I would never wear? I’ll be hesitant to interact you. You have a physical feature I’m not comfortable with? I’ll be hesitant to interact with you. You’re not in a group I’m in? I’ll be hesitant to interact with you.</p>
<p>There are more examples, but those should illustrate enough. The school environment can be very competitive and people can be really quick to dismiss one another for the silliest reasons. Cornell is an objectively diverse school, but aside from maybe students’ first semesters, there isn’t widespread interaction across different groups of people. If a person isn’t interested in you, he or she is much more likely to be subtle about it. But that’s just something that happens; it shouldn’t dissuade a student from attending since there are plenty upsides that don’t involve other students.</p>
<p>My Indian Cornellian sister who is enrolled in AEM is having the time of her life there. She’s active in her sorority, has developed a strong affinity to a professional organization on campus, and is doing reasonably well in school. She has friends across all colleges and ethnicities so I’m not sure what some of the posters here are talking about.</p>
<p>My sister doesn’t feel like the consensus on campus is that AEM kids are inferior to Economics or Engineering students. She says the on-campus recruiting is actually better than what Economics or definitely ILR majors enjoy. She says the grading is also easier than any other college at Cornell so that’s an added bonus.</p>
<p>I bet she will end up making more money than Cornellians enrolled in the so-called “real colleges” like CAS and Engineering. It doesn’t reflect well on fellow students to put others down.</p>
<p>Good for her. I know exactly what you’re talking about since I’m an AEM major, too. But I will disagree that corporate recruiting necessarily favors AEM majors. A lot of that is more of a factor of networking and performing well in interview situations. Then again, I decided to not even pursue a corporate career, so I’m not the best person to talk about that.</p>
<p>Also, money isn’t everything. It’s nothing more than a barrier.</p>
<p>Several things.</p>
<p>1) It is more difficult to get into CAS, compared to ILR. Just look at admissions stats.
2) That does not mean that there aren’t bright people in ILR/ Hum Ec etc.
3) However, the overall quality of student body at CAS may be higher, due to higher bar of admissions criteria.</p>
<p>Lastly, getting a lucrative corporate job (I-banking, trading, consulting) has very little to do with one’s choice of major, coming out of Cornell.</p>
<p>Heck, I know of English, Government, and Hotel majors working as I-banking analysts. The truth of mater is, most entry level jobs in finance demand very little technical/ math skills, and most of what analysts do on the job can be taught by the employer in a relatively short amount of time. Hence, they hire a very wide range of majors.</p>
<p>My I-banking friends tell me 90% of their job is to make powerpoint slides for sales pitch and plugging in numbers into pre-made templates on excel spreadsheets (aka excel “modeling”)</p>
<p>Getting a good job = function of your GPA + internships. Choice of major matters very, very little.</p>
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<p>You come across as very rude and condescending with that kind of attitude. Congrats to your daughter for scoring a banking/ trading job, and making that salary at that age. That’s wonderful.</p>
<p>You don’t need to ask others how we are doing 2 years out, relative to your daughter, to prove your point.</p>
<p>I graduated in 2010. But, I don’t make that level of money now. Sorry.</p>
<p>@Goldenboy</p>
<p>I’ve never really heard that much about anyone looking down upon AEM aside from noting the grade inflation and high presence of recruited athletes. I actually feel like it’s kind of the reverse when applying to finance clubs and going to networking events-- it’s the Econ majors who kind of feel second-class.</p>
<p>You two^^ are funny. I’ m flattered Saugus that you follow my threads and know how often I say something. </p>
<p>And yes, NYU, I do have an attitude. I am sick and tired of Cornellians putting other Cornellians down. It is one thing for a high schooler to ask a question. But for alums or current Cornell students to be comparing the stats of the different schools is rather pathetic. It comes across as " I didn’t get into HPY , so I have to prove my superiority somehow."</p>