<p>I am applying to neuroscience programs for the fall of 2010 as an untraditional student (was a musician for 10 years). I went to a good school for the arts over 10 years ago, did badly, and dropped out. I went back to school 4 years and have a pretty good record since -- a 3.93 GPA from the university where I graduated with a bachelor of science. I have a fair amount of research experience (got a summer research grant in neuroscience) and another semester doing some electrophysiology with a mentor. I have a huge amount of teaching, community service, organization president stuff, shadowing (in other words, my resume is packed with things that might not matter, I'm not sure). I'm also doing some research in counseling psychology now for the year I have while applying to schools. My biggest issue is the GRE.</p>
<p>I got a 600 V, 660 Q, and a 3.5 on AW! Writing is one of my stronger areas so I have no idea what happened. Also, the 660 Q may not look as great to schools... I was practice testing at about 1350 (but mainly higher in V, not a lot higher in math). I could at least have my AW rescored, but that will hold up my applications for a month and I can't do that in order to meet deadlines.</p>
<p>Can you guys tell me if you think I have a shot at some higher tier schools still, or will I just be lucky to get into a lower tier school? I also still have the grades from a zillion years ago on the other univ. transcript which makes my cumulative GPA 3.71 although it says on my transcript from my home univ. 3.93. Help! Thanks!</p>
<p>Neurohopes, you have both research and a high science GPA. The only thing you can do now is apply and see what happens. It never hurts to reach for the top (as long as you can afford the application fees and aren’t counting on getting in), although you would be advised to add a couple of lower tier schools, just in case.</p>
<p>Out of all the things that will make your grad school packet, the GREs usually count the least. I suggest applying to programs that don’t list an average GRE score since those that do usually value it more. Maybe your LOR writers can address your writing and math ability in their letters.</p>
<p>Thanks for the great advice, Momwaitingfornew… A lot of the top schools have said that my math and verbal are in the lower end up what they will look at (math, less so) but I am wondering if the AW score will automatically kick me out of even getting my application looked over. I think I should have pretty solid letters of recommendation and my CV is pretty long, even though with 2 semesters and a summer of research experience (that part could be thicker)… </p>
<p>Also, I am wondering if I should talk much about being a musician for 10 years or if it will just make me seem too much like an outlier to the admissions committees, provided my application makes it that far.</p>
<p>Oh, and I am also wondering if I need to put a cumulative GPA on my CV when I graduated from my home school with a 3.93 (the last 50 courses or so)? I was thinking of just putting University X GPA: 3.93 (they will see the other old grades from years back on my transcripts that I have sent anyway and some of the apps ask for it, which I would obviously give – but I’d rather not highlight those two semesters on my CV if it’s honest to do that). Thanks!!</p>
<p>The AW score may indeed knock you out; however, you won’t be able to tell until you try. </p>
<p>If you want to mention your music, you should do so in the context of where you are now, intellectually. Perhaps you realized that being good at something requires more than talent. Or maybe you are interested in auditory perception, based on your past training in music. You can also include it on your r</p>
<p>Neurohopes, some departments have rigid requirements relating to gre scores, some don’t. If a test score would prevent you from being considered, would you really want to join a department like that? What would happen down the road if you required flexibility in changing a thesis topic or advisor in a department that is so inflexible about admission policies? </p>
<p>I realize that nobody knows where they stand the first time they apply for grad school; how would they. In my opinion, you will make a very competitive applicant at any program you apply to. You have a very high grade average, at least a year of research experience and probably a bit more maturity than most grad students would upon entering the program.</p>
<p>Momwaitingfornew, that is also great advice about the auditory processing. I’m interested in several other fields but if I find a professor who is studying that at one of the schools where I am applying, that might be a good way to tie it all together. </p>
<p>Belevitt, thank you for the kind words – I hope that admissions committees take the time to go over my whole application and see me as a whole package and that that dopey AW score doesn’t make it impossible to just get a good look. My math score could be better too, but all in all, I was pretty okay with the Q and V. </p>
<p>My dad, a lit professor on a lot of admissions committees told me an interesting story last night when I was vexxing over that AW score. He said a colleague of his who had taught writing for almost ten years, had tons of publications, and won lots of lit awards, took the GRE (I think she had a masters or something and was applying for a PhD after a certain amount of years), got an almost perfect verbal score and a 20th percentile on the AW writing. He said their admissions committees tend to think that there is a real glitch in the GRE grading system on analytical writing and they generally don’t give it much weight… Any thoughts on that story?</p>
<p>I can give you some thoughts on the AW section.</p>
<p>First, most universities don’t give it much weight, although they will be concerned to see an exceedingly low score. I suspect that they’ll then look at the SOP to make sure that the applicant can indeed write. Publications should trump any low AW score.</p>
<p>Next, I’ve seen the sample questions on the AW, and I’ve read how the section is graded. It doesn’t test writing ability as much as it tests analytical thinking (punching holes in arguments and recognizing strengths/weaknesses) and the logical organization of thought. If you’re the type who needs a little more time to organize or if you don’t realize that they are looking for nuanced thinking, then you can easily bomb it even if you are indeed a good writer and scholar.</p>
<p>From my experience as a comp prof, I can also guess what common errors will reduce the score: short, choppy sentences or those containing a single thought instead of multiple ones; weak or blatant transitions; announcing supporting examples instead of integrating them naturally in the argument; posing rhetorical questions that you make no attempt to answer; and a conclusion that summarizes what you’ve already written. </p>
<p>If you assume you’ll do well on the AW and therefore take it without reviewing strategy, you’ll be more likely to bomb it. I suspect that the writing instructor screwed up because she assumed that she’d be able to ace it based on her experience and therefore did not pay attention to the section when she was preparing for the test. She failed to research what ETS wanted to see.</p>
<p>Sorry it took me so long to respond – I think you are probably right on the AW. I didn’t study nearly as much as I should’ve for that section because I thought it would be easy to write a “great” essay quickly. Apparently, I miscalculated, as I am sure she did too, especially with her credentials.</p>
<p>By the way, you are a wealth of information! Thank you!</p>