OK!!! Good points!!!..Hummmmm! Saving us a lot of grief here!! Back to the drawing board to look for more opportunities!
@thumper1, et El…
At 16 I worked in the OT department of a major hospital system assisting and working on patients directly with supervision being the head of my high schools medical club. Yes direct hands on. They also had one of the first stroke rehabilitation water programs in the country and I got into the water to work one on one with brave recovering stroke patients. Of course with supervision.
At 17-19 I worked the ER and imaging being an orderly. When someone came in with a nail in their foot the ER doc would grab me (knowing I was going to be a foot doctor in the future) and had me take out the nail (put Stat on nail and pull… Lol… ). These were with supervision and amazing experiences.
Flash forward 31 years and being a mentor to high school, college, premed and a surgical residency director and trained hundreds of doctors if not more… I have a clue (patting self on back ??).
In my own practice my kids at 12/13 would wear my lab coat and bring patients into the rooms and ask why they were there.(once in awhile).
If the doctors child wants some patient interaction (yes, much better term), in their “own” practice it should not be an issue.
She can be taught to take vitals with another nurse or medical assistant. She can cut suture for a minor procedure in the office. Yes, she can be taught how to draw up for an injection. (I would do it away from the patient ". These are easy things BTW.
One of the most important things she can do is listen and observe. The old adage" keep your eyes open and mouth closed " Questions are asked and cases discussed outside of the treatment room.
Patients always are asked if it’s OK if the doctors daughter observes but honestly… Who is going to say no.
She can observe in office surgery. The list goes on.
Can she database… Sure. Can she input information into the chart… Sure but someone else would sign the chart.
Can she clean the room, take out garbage, mop the floor??? All part of an office structure…
Shadowing each person in the office can be a very educating experience. Shadowing her father or another PA or Doctor in the office can be accomplished.
Good Luck to her.
Perhaps your husband could reach out to some doctor friends and ask about shadowing opportunities.
It probably depends on the practice, hospital, state etc
I know my D’s friend couldn’t volunteer at the hospital until she was 18, and couldn’t shadow at a doctor’s office in high school because of HIPPA laws.
Malpractice insurance is very expensive in PA I think so maybe they are just trying to protect themselves.
I need to talk to my association about this. We are part of a high school /college mentorship organization that is through out the United States and the whole point is to bring in kids that are interested in medicine and hopefully educate them on different fields… They can sign a bsa form for hipaa but that seems to much for just shadowing etc. When they do 1 month shadowing with us, there are forms /evaluations to fill out etc. Maybe I should have them fill out a bsa? Hmm…
We live in Ohio and my D did volunteer at a hospital but I honestly don’t know what all forms she had to sign during orientation but she was a volunteer. I know she was trained to answer phones, direct visitors, assist with flower deliveries, etc. She sat at one of the information desks.
Most hospitals have policies in place that don’t allow under 18s to have direct patient contact due to patient privacy and liability concerns. (Liability, in that your child might be exposed to diseases or to the bodily fluids of a patients, for example. As a minor, your child cannot legally consent to being placed in a position where she might potentially be exposed.)
Your D might have better luck volunteering at a nursing home or hospice care center. Summer camps for physically or mentally disabled children would be another option to consider.
Seriously? Hey, my teen with no formal medical training wants to watch your private medical procedure and help out. You ok with that? Uh…no.
Times have changed since you were a high school student over 30 years ago. The liability issues for doing things with patients is HUGE now…huge. You don’t want to put your license into jeopardy by doing something unethical.
No question…a BSA form should be completed at the very least. But really, there are huge limits on what a high school or college student can do when shadowing in your office.
A million years ago, when dinosaurs roamed the earth, DH and his brother were able, in HS, to work in a military hospital on their base. DH worked in the ER/ortho dept casting broken bones and ]}#=~> BIL worked as a phlebotomist. Yep. Drew blood while a HS student. Good thing ya can’t easily, if at all, sue the government!
And those things would not be allowed now in any well run practice or ED in this country. Not at all.
I agree since I am getting bashed here but they can observe like taking out sutures etc. Not formal surgery. I have them follow me around and every patient is asked if it’s OK that they come in to observe. There are things they can do in an office setting.
Absolutely, with patient permission, these students can observe.
But this thread is talking about patient contact hours for PA school purposes, and watching is not considered hands on patient contact.
PA applicants are required to have PAID clinical hands-on patient experience.
Paid because the hours and the duties need to be formally documented.
@WayOutWestMom - I’m not sure what the situation is for EMTs because some get paid, but some do not.
WayOutWestMom, Thank you for the link!! https://www.thepalife.com/hce-paschool/
I know there are lots of volunteer EMT opportunities ( one of my kids was a volunteer AEMT w/the local Mountain Search & Rescue), but in order for any particular EMT experience to be used to fulfill the patient contact hours needed for a PA school application, the position must be a paid position.
My daughter was allowed to shadow in a doctor’s office in NY state when she was 17, so it seems to differ by state. It was for high school credit, so it was part of an official program. Not saying it would count for grad school, but just saying it was allowed 3 years ago.
Shadowing is VERY different than hands on patient experience which is what PA schools require. Shadowing is basically watching. That’s not patient hands on experience.
This poster is looking for what PA schools require. They require hands on patient experience (some include this during their program…some direct admit schools). That’s not shadowing.
I have read that if you can smell the patients, that counts as patient contact. You aren’t expected to do patient care, but be around patients.