Picking classes for soph year HS

Parents Forum
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<p>Hi, I have freshman twins who are picking out classes for soph year in HS, and wanted to ask a few questions.</p>

<p>There are 7 class periods. We live in a state that requires daily PE all 4 years, so that leaves 6 class periods. The 5 "cores" are English, History, Math, Science and Foreign Language, so that leaves 1 period to try something new.</p>

<p>The school's honors courses are weighted (and indicated) such that an A gets you a 5.0, a B a 4.0, etc. Good but not outstanding suburban public hs.</p>

<p>As freshmen, they are currently taking Honors in the 3 categories in which our school has honors for freshmen: English, Math and Science.</p>

<p>For next year, dd wants to take Honors in English, Math, Science, and Foreign Language ... stay regular track in History (there is an AP History offered for sophs but she doesn't want to take it)... and then choose between Journalism (full year course, also gets her involved in an activity) or taking Intro to Business paired with Consumer Education (Consumer Education fulfills a distro requirement). She's undecided in terms of long-term interests. </p>

<p>Ds wants to take Honors in English, Foreign Language and AP History ... regular track in Math and Science (the regular track would still get him to calc as a senior -- he was recommended for advanced track in Science but he works really hard to do well in Math / Science) ... and then take TV 2 (an interest of his, which I fully support) paired again with the Consumer Education for the distro. He is definitely a humanities / writing / film production type of person.</p>

<p>My questions are this.
When people talk about colleges wanting to see that you've made the most and taken the hardest classes available in your school, does it have to be in <em>all</em> areas? IOW, is the kid who's going to be the writer / film producer going to be hurt if he is just taking regular math and science? My gut tells me that 4 honors classes (dd's load) is OK but 3 (ds' load) isn't enough. I need a reality check here.</p>

<p>And how do colleges look at those courses that hs require, such as Consumer Ed? My bias is that they'd be better off taking courses that speak to an interest and saving that kind of stuff for second sem senior year, when they can enjoy the blow-off. To be honest, I don't even want them taking Drivers Ed in school because I would think it looks lame to an adcom (am I right, or am I old school)?</p>

<p>They're aiming pretty high and they are double legacies at a USNWR Top 20 school that they are interested in.</p>

<p>Thanks for any advice!</p>

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<p>I see nothing wrong with any choices your kids might make for their sixth period.</p>

<p>However, they should realize that if they choose anything other than all honors courses for the five major academic subjects, they are not choosing the "most rigorous" curriculum, and the eventual counselor report from their high school will reflect it.</p>

<p>Brutal but true.</p>

3

<p>It probably depends a lot on the school, and, as readers of your CC post, we are not familiar with what is the norm at your school. </p>

<p>At our high school, there is a very large group of unmotivated students in the regular college prep classes, so almost all motivated and able students take all "honors" courses, even in areas that are not their strength (e.g. science and math in your son's case). In math and English in 10th grade, there is actually a level above "honors" for students who are very strong in those subjects ("Pre-AP English", as opposed to Honors English 10, and "Honors Math 1", as opposed to Honors Algebra 2). At other high schools in our area which have a greater percentage of motivated and high achieving students, it is not as common for students to take all Honors classes because the regular college prep classes are more demanding and taught at a higher level. </p>

<p>For what it's worth, my daughter did not take the highest level of math offered. (She took Honors Algebra 2 in 10th grade instead of "Honors Math 1" and the next courses in this sequence in 11th and 12th grades.) She is an excellent student but math is not her strength. Her math track led to "Honors Calculus" rather than AP Calculus as a senior, and she and I were concerned that this might hurt her in college admissions. She did pursue areas of interest to her, including an AP independent study of a subject not offered at our school. I do not know if the counselor said she was taking the "most rigorous curriculum" but she is now a student at an excellent college, so it apparently was not held against her.</p>

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<p>I think there should be a balance. Students should take the hardest classes in subjects they will do very well in. If they will be struggling the whole year and probably not able to get above a C, why risk it? OTOH, if they are "aiming high" and they want to get on THAT path, then I think the standard answer is that they have to take the most rigorous classes AND they have to do very well in them. </p>

<p>This is the craziest forum where it's assumed that students will automatically excel in the hardest classes and that the best fit college has to be a well known one.</p>

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<p>im not so great at recommending a course track, but as a current 2nd semester senior, i have one caveat: do not do not do not do not save your required classes for 2nd semester senior year. you are left with no option but to take them at that time and you will absolutely HATE being stuck in a class that is boring and stale from being recycled year after year when you finally have discovered some interests that you would like to pursue in electives.</p>

<p>maybe your D could get involved in journalism as an EC? that would be a great solution. </p>

<p>bottom line: i very very highly recommend getting required courses out of the way sophomore year. the college weight on junior year is heavier.</p>

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<p>A little off the subject, and this doesn't apply to this poster since her children must take PE all 4 years, but I recommend 9th graders sign up for debate class,or at least a speech class, early in high school for maximum benefit. Also, where I live the students only need 1 1/2 yrs of PE and 1/2 yr of health. I recommend postponing the PE/health until junior and senior years, when their course load is harder and they welcome the break. Also, postponing PE allows an additional course in 9th and 10th grades, so a student can enroll in an elementary level course in 9th and stay with it in 10th, for instance, speech 1 and then speech 2. Mine took drama in 9th and then Mock Trial in 10th, which she fell in love with unexpectedly.</p>

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<p>In our SD, PE can be "waved" if one participates in HS sports (JV or Varsity -does not matter), .25 credit per season up to a year of PE. Health and Fitness, two other state-mandated requirements, can be taken online. It is not widely advertised, but all athletes are aware of it. Also, AP Psychology satisfies "Consumer Ed" (or something like that) state requirement.</p>

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<p>Perhaps we should just listen to the choices the op has given us. From reading CC for years I have found that individual school districts within the same state can have different choices. The freshman and sophomores in my kids school district cannot "postpone" or get out of gym. They must take it one semester each of the four years. My kids school district has none of the classes that Irvingstones#1fan has.</p>

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<p>I wholeheartedly agree with KathieP: Balance should be the focus, not making choices based solely on what some college somewhere might want some day, but rather based on what each child is interested in, and can realistically handle without going nuts.</p>

<p>While many here believe that you must take every AP and Honors course available, the truth is that <em>most</em> kids don't and manage to get into very good colleges. </p>

<p>The bottomline: Talk to the GC about what your school considers most rigorous, get some feedback from other parents about what the courses and teachers are actually like, but also listen to what your children's preferences are, take into account their individual abilities and interests (my daughter would NEVER have been able to handle AP Calculus BC; My son loves it), and - this is important - make choices based on what is best for each child, not solely because someone who doesn't know your kids tell you they'll never get into college if they don't take such-and-such. There are PLENTY of college options to suit every kid, even kids who don't take a single AP or honors course.</p>

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<p>Thanks all - what makes it difficult is too much reading of CC where every kid took all-honors in every subject, and cured cancer over the summer while raising money for the underprivileged :-). I'm going to give the ownership to them. I've made my opinions known and that's that.</p>

<p>I'm just not sure the college counselor at the school really knows what it takes to get into the top unis. I would say of a graduating class of 500 or so (upper middle class suburban area near a major city), maybe about 10-15 go to what I'd consider top unis or LAC's. The sun rises and sets on the state schools here; our state school is a very good one, the Northern / Eastern / Western etc versions are just "eh" but they attract a lot of kids. It doesn't have the same vibe as the high school one town over, which is a wealthier area but more importantly parents may have attended better unis or LAC's themselves.</p>

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<p>What is the difference between honors, pre-AP, and AP?!!</p>

<p>What determines the level of difficulty??</p>

<p>My schools offers very zero "special" courses (honors, pre-AP, AP, My-child-takes-all-classes-with-fancy-titles, etc..).</p>

<p>Why can we just call it, "English"? There shouldn't be need to file everybody in difficult categories. Kids are being awarded more points to complete extra homework. Go team! </p>

<p>OP:</p>

<p>Don't bust your kids with unnecessary courses. If your kids want to be in the visual arts, TAKE VISUAL ARTS CLASSES!</p>

<p>If he wants to be in film/writing/whatever, enroll him in activities geared towards that interest. An adcom will be more impressed by a kid who demonstrated genuine interest in x activity than a kid who got all A's in AP European History.</p>

<p>Don't delude yourself with over-glorified scores. Adcoms see through that.</p>

<p>If he wants to be in film production, attend film festivals. Make short films, join local cinema clubs and write reviews for local publications.</p>

<p>If you're betting on your kid getting into USC School of Cinematic Arts based on his <em>gasp</em> A in x class, you will be sadly mistaken.</p>

<p>Also, don't take drivers ed at HS. That's beyond lame. Most states offer online courses...</p>

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<p>"Also, don't take drivers ed at HS. That's beyond lame."</p>

<p>This is one area where I personally am paying for them to have private lessons, but it seems that about 99% of the kids do indeed have drivers ed through school. Again, how do colleges look at these? Do they think "lame" or do they understand that schools may require it, kids may have activities such that they can't take private driving lessons, etc.? I'd welcome others' opinions.</p>

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<p>I would go by what your children are capable of. Would your son be willing to work really hard to do well in those math and science honors courses this year? Having to work hard has its benefits, you know.<br>
I would definitely put my child in journalism, since she leans toward it, and postpone the state requirement until senior year. And tv sounds like a great course for your son, since he is interested in this field and this course could cement that interest.
So sorry for getting off-track earlier. I will not do that again!</p>

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<p>PS driver's ed isn't so lame as it unnecessary. It takes up too much time and the quality of lessons are very questionable.</p>

<p>Take the basic course online, do the written exam at the DMV, and google some respected independent drivers training program.</p>

<p>All that should cost you less than $200.</p>

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<p>My kids HS mandates drivers ed in the classroom (grad requirement) and offers free but optional on the road training outside of school hours. Again, don't assume that what your own HS offers is what universally available. At my kids school there is no choice about the order of most classes. </p>

<p>In each schools profile that they send with the transcript, it should show all of the classes that are required by the school. Colleges are well aware that some schools like mine require gym 4 years, technology for 2, health for 2, etc. It does make for a cramped schedule - most of the kids at my son's school will only have 6-8 classes in a total of four years that they actually choose outside of required acadmics - but it also makes it so they could easily apply to any state school and make the minimum prereq's.</p>

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<p>HSisOverrated, aren't you a hs sophomore yourself? I'm more interested in parents' experiences as to how colleges look at consumer ed, drivers ed and similar required classes, which is why I went to the parents forum. Apologies if I'm mistaken.</p>