<p>It may be not be clear to some folks, but Iranians (Persians), Turks, Arabs and other groups in the same region are not included in the Asian "ethnic category." Their homelands (Turkey, Iran, Iraq Afghanistan) lie on the continent of Asia, but those peoples are considered to be caucasians, just like some of the central Asian peoples of Russia. Another example, Siberia is in Asia, but contemporary Siberians are not included in the group that westerners typically call "Asians."</p>
<p>So Inidans are caucasians too. Does that mean they aren't Asians? Where does the line get drawn? What about Pakistanis? Are Papuans Asians or Pacific Islanders? If you live on an island in Canada or Alaska are you a Pacific Islander? How come we don't have Atlantic Islanders and if we did would Long Island count? Who is in charge of this clasification system anyway? I think we need some standardization. Is a Brazilian hispanic even though he speaks Portuguese? What drawer do we put Surinamese in?</p>
<p>It might be simpler if we just lumped them all into one big category like the Brits do and say wogs begin at Calais. I think wogs might be an offensive term. Plus I think think Calais is a little too far away to draw the line so I vote for dirty little berry pickers begin at Niagra Falls.</p>
<p>Post 9, yep.
Post 20, yep.</p>
<p>The context is everything -- from the context of what the college needs, gets, can get, and wants -- to the context of what else the URM has (sufficient accomplishment to match that of his non-Urm competitors) as well as what he might not have (economic & educational advantages, if so). Way too much is assumed as a URM boost in and of itself. It's just a label, signifying little until attached to a person and a potential incoming class.</p>
<p>Single-dimension admits are quite rare these days, tending to be liimited to the super-duper athlete, celeb, or donor, of any ethnicity.</p>
<p>Higherlead, your comments are nonsensical. It might helf if you start your frame of reference from a historical perspective of the United States. I really have no idea if the rest of the world cares about ethic designation the U.S. includes in its census, or what ethnic designations U.S. laws include or consider.</p>
<p>Isn't LaserBrother pretty well educated and high income (although he doesn't think so)? That'd probably dilute any advantage from being Asian.</p>
<p>Some practical advice from someone who has looked at admissions data pretty extensively:</p>
<p>a) You will drive yourself nuts trying to quantify the impact (positive or negative) of ethnicity in college admissions. It is not possible to quantify for an individual applicant. The things that you might be able to quantify (acceptance rates, median SAT scores, etc.) don't necessarily tell you anything. For example, Swarthmore's acceptance rate for Asian Americans two years ago was 36% compared to an overall acceptance rate of 22%. Does that mean that Asian Americans were getting "affirmative action"? I seriously doubt it. More likely, it simply means that the Asian American pool offered a higher percentage of what Swarthmore was looking for in an applicant than the overall pool.</p>
<p>b) The only thing that really matters at the end of the day is finding a good match. So, for example, an Asian American applicant might want to look at the diversity numbers to ascertain the climate on a particular campus for Asian American students. Are there any? How do they fit into the campus community? Those are the "diversity" issues that are important. If you want a diverse campus with interaction between groups...go find those schools. If you prefer a homogeneous student body with an admissions office that doesn't use affirmative action to boost diversity...go find those schools. There are schools to suit every permutation. Look for them, if it matters to you. Vote with your wallet.</p>
<p>c) Assuming a basic level of integrity in the application process, you really have two choices. Either opt to not self-designate (don't check any boxes) or self-designate honestly and accurately. Significant numbers of applicants refuse to self designate and are counted as "unknown". However, from an admissions perspective, these apps would generally be placed in the "white" stack. It would be a strategically poor decision for an African American or Latino applicant to do that, since most colleges are actively trying to increase the enrollment of those groups ("they don't get as many as they want"). I suppose it could be argued either way for an Asian American student and probably doesn't matter in most cases. However, do you want to apply to a school that would dock you in the admissions process for being Asian Amercian or a school that has a max quota for Asian Americans? If you feel like self-designating as Asian American will hurt your chances at a particular school, why would you want to apply to that school?</p>
<p>d) One general observation: Diversity, in and of itself, is a "feature/benefit" that potential customers are demanding in elite colleges. Colleges are working to increase diversity, in part, because they find it increasingly difficult to attract top applicants without a diverse student body. Consumers aren't stupid. They can look around and see that learning to interact successfully in a diverse environment is a rather fundamental skill set for life in the global world of the 21st century. On a related note, college administrators aren't stupid either. They can read the demographic projections and understand that, if they don't market their product to an increasingly diverse customer base, they aren't going to have as many potential customers in 2025 and beyond.</p>
<p>Words of wisdom from Interesteddad.</p>
<p>interesteddad I don't think there is a school in the country that would admit to having a "max quota for Asian Americans" or anything else which is not the same as saying they don't have a max quota. If you find one that will to it I'm pretty sure their house lawyers will be grabbing for the defibrillation paddles.</p>
<p>I believe that there are probably some schools that have max quotas for Asian Americans. I can't prove it. See my point a) above.</p>
<p>BTW, if you don't mind being a token, there are some really good schools with low diversity numbers that are desperate to attract qualified minority applicants. Some of these schools were late to the party and are trying to play catch up. Others have geographic impediments to attracting minority applicants. Any college, in this boat, looking to compete with the top of USNEWS for full fare kids from the northeast is going to be very eager to increase diversity. Thus, there are some terrific admissions values for minority students in the midwest and southeast. Of course, you have to weigh that against being part of a small minority on campus.</p>