<p>Just discovered CC and want to maximize our search in a short time. My D would like to be a research scientist and is looking for rigorous biological science programs at colleges likely to offer significant merit aid. She is NMS Commended, 2120 SAT, 31 ACT, 4.29 GPA, ranked top 2% of class (No. 8 out of 725) in CA public. She was selected for an American Cancer Society biology research internship last summer (loved it) and is also a musician (flute, violin, piano). Please give advice about which colleges to target. Would Emory, WashU be likely to offer merit aid or should we look at somewhat less selective colleges with strong biology programs? (Suggestions welcome.) What about the womens colleges? All advice gratefully accepted.</p>
<p>Check into the University of Miami-strong biology and music programs with the possibility of significant merit money. Good luck.</p>
<p>Women's colleges would be a great admissions choice as they are a great admissions value. Remember that women's colleges don't highly advertise their merit aid and it can be VERY limited at the best of the women's colleges, and wholly unavailable at others. You'll have to look deep into their websites. </p>
<p>That being said, there are options. Biology departments at many LAC's are very good. </p>
<p>Emory and WashU would be problematic for merit aid with her test scores (excellent but not excellent enough for merit $ at those two.). </p>
<p>What are you thinking significant merit aid would be?</p>
<p>and what is her CR+Math?</p>
<p>If your daughter wants to be a research scientist, the hands-down most important academic quality of a school is that undergraduates are able to participate in research projects. </p>
<p>The best schools for a hopeful scientist are ones where the student can get his/her hands dirty early and be deeply involved enough with a project or two to produce publications.</p>
<p>Lawrence U -- Great sciences and profs that publish with students plus the music conservatory -- likely to get aid $5-$10K per year.</p>
<p>Other places to look would be tier 2 universities connected to med schools and small LACs in towns with a med school. The bio faculty may overlap with the med school faculty, or, in the case of the LACs, develop a relationship with the med school faculty that leads to the LAC students getting research opportunities. The ones I know are far from home, you can find better opportunities closer. Two you might want to look at that don't come to mind immediately are the Uni of Wash and Uni of Arizona.</p>
<p>I'd be surprised if you found an even moderately selective college that did not have a decent biology program.</p>
<p>If you really want merit aid, you'll need to look at colleges that are somewhat lower down the academic rankings, and that has its risks. You might want to seriously consider the excellent state U options you have in CA if money is a concern to you.</p>
<p>The unfortunate truth is that NM commended students who love science, have some lab experience and also are musicians are common, even with a high GPA. The elites yawn at such a background. The elite wanna-bes, the ones who give merit aid, know the score, too.</p>
<p>There is a tier of schools that are good who offer generous merit aid. They aren't names that drop jaws at cocktail parties, though. Example are Illinois Wesleyan, and Knox college, both of whom offered my cousin's kid decent merit aid. He graduated from a catholic boys HS in the top quarter of his class, very good SAT scores, NM commended etc.</p>
<p>Suggestions:</p>
<ul>
<li><p>don't sweat the Bio. It will come with any decent ed environment. Same with research opportunities. Even LACs offer great research experience to undergrads (OK, most, not all!)</p></li>
<li><p>if affordability matters, by all means include some decent affordable options. You can go for gold, but if you don't get the merit aid, and you likely won't (it is pretty random...), you need a fallback.</p></li>
<li><p>consider that college is a time of discovery and many kids start in science, only to falter. Many drop out after general chem, even more after O chem. And a kid may discover that the econ (or sociology or whatever) that they had to study for a general ed requirement is pretty interesting in its own right.</p></li>
</ul>
<p>Friend of mine's D got merit aid to University of the South (also called "Sewanee") and then got into a doctoral program in biochemistry.</p>
<p>As previously noted, merit aid tends to be offered as an inducement to attend a college you'd otherwise not attend. If you actually NEED merit aid (need-based aid just won't cut it for your family), then you'll choose from among those (Mt. Holyoke is excellent in bio and offered my D, with similar stats, a good merit award). However, Reed College is #1, followed by Cal Tech, Swarthmore, U Chicago, etc., if you're looking at colleges producing graduates who go on to earn PhDs in biology. Interestingly, looking at female PhD productivity, Cal Tech and Reed switch places. I've had two kids choose Reed and they haven't been disappointed with the rigor.</p>
<p>
That may be the crummiest statement I've read on CC. The OP said flat out she was looking for schools where her kid can get significant merit aid. I really can't believe you said that. What possible purpose did it serve?</p>
<p>The OP, celloguy is ....incorrect. Many excellent schools with fantastic bio programs have merit aid. celloguy is obviously not a fan of merit aid. I am , and several others on the board have had similar positive results. </p>
<p>My D also needed significant merit aid and found several wonderful schools with exceptional bio programs to choose from, all a far better choice for her than Reed would have ever been. Reed does appeal to a very small subset of kids. </p>
<p>Not one- not a single co-ed school celloguy mentioned is a school you should look at for 10 seconds given the parameters stated. Sheesh. </p>
<p>If you'll P.M. me more data I'll give you a list.</p>
<p>I wanted to add to my last post- </p>
<p>Without merit aid my accepted dang near everywhere D would have going to a state school in Texas and since she despised both A+M and Texas, it would have been a third tier school. Merit aid is allowing her to attend Rhodes, a tier one liberal arts college with a great bio and research program, both through the med school and St. Jude's. With need based aid only, it would have difficult for her to go fulltime to a state school all four years without substantial loans.</p>
<p>And Yes celloguy, Rhodes was on the list BEFORE she got the scholarship. It was a school she liked as were all the schools on her long list. She loved it and had visited 4 times BEFORE scholarship weekend.</p>
<p>Many thanks to all of you who have responded! The info is most helpful already. </p>
<p>curmudgeon: My D's SAT scores were 700 math and 710 CR. I guess by significant merit $, I mean enough aid to make a private cost about the same as sending her to a UC.</p>
<p>curmudgeon,</p>
<p>What is your beef with celloguy? Perhaps you never read The Atlantic Monthly's excellent article on this subject? An article that put, perhaps more eloquently, what merit aid is really about (Hint, not much "merit" in it.)</p>
<p>and now that I've seen your supplementary post, just keep in mind that your kid may have been an exception. At any rate, celloguy's comments were not directed at you or your d personally anyway.</p>
<p>Why to folks on these boards (some at least) persist in taking anonymous comments so personally? And why the attacks? It's one of those things that drives folks away.</p>
<p>newmassdad, thanks for your support, but it's okay. Curmudgeon and I have sparred over this before, and I thought we'd agreed to disagree. I stand by my post: enrollment management is all about inducing the "best" students to apply, and merit aid is part of the strategy. I don't think anybody in the business would disagree. Cur is defending his family's personal choice (an excellent choice for them it would seem), and I, mine. I don't see how my post was in any way disrespectful or disingenuous. As for Reed College (or Cal Tech) not being for everyone, I'd certainly agree. I'm merely offering up the suggestion to look at "productivity" stats -- if a youngster is interested in a career as a research scientist, then undergraduate programs with a very high percentage of grads earning PhDs should be worth looking at.</p>
<p>I viewed celloguy's statement as an attack on the OP. I view your elite wannabe statement equally harshly but I gave you a pass. Some of you need based folks are just a little too preachy and holier than thou.</p>
<p>Sheesh. She said she needed merit aid. What part of that didn't y'all get?</p>
<p>Everything celloguy wrote sounds correct to me. There are cases where need-aid just isn't enough for some families, and some merit-aid is required. Reed is indeed number one for undergrad preparation as a research biologist, but offers no merit aid.</p>
<p>this is a little old but cheers biology in LAC programs</p>
<p><a href="http://www.hhmi.org/BeyondBio101/%5B/url%5D">http://www.hhmi.org/BeyondBio101/</a></p>
<p>( Reed also does not have any merit aid- except linked to need)</p>
<p>
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Reed is indeed number one for undergrad preparation as a research biologist, but offers no merit aid
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vossron, so how does that help the OP?</p>
<p>
Why couldn't we just answer the request posed by the OP?</p>
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My D would like to be a research scientist and is looking for rigorous biological science programs at colleges likely to offer significant merit aid.
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<p>I didn't see "need" in that statement. Scifimom said she was looking for a college where expenses would be more-or-less equivalent to a UC. She didn't elaborate on her family's financial status, so there's no way we can guess. I will say that my D's net expenses at a UC (we weren't eligible for Cal Grant, etc.) were somewhat higher than her net expenses at the $43,000 private she chose (which offered need-based aid only).</p>