Pleeeease Help Us Decide!!!

Parents Forum
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<p>Hey you!</p>

<p>Does your DD have any one that she likes a little more than another? Is she leaning towards any one in particular?</p>

<p>Of course with a Tar Heel win last night that might shift things!!! It was all Carolina Blue here today.....every kid at school was wearing the blue......</p>

<p>Maybe she will have a better idea after visiting Chicago, now that would be a fun town! For some reason my kiddos have placed a fun factor on their college selections......such intellectuals.....I swear I live in RAH-RAH land!!!</p>

<p>Hopefully other posters will have lots of info about the other schools.</p>

<p>Kat</p>

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<p>All I can say is our visits so far have not helped us eliminate anything yet. Tomorrow we are off to JHU....wake up at 4:00 a.m....lots of on-the-road-bonding.</p>

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<p>Chocoholic, congratulations to your daughter on these acceptances. Such choices...no wonder it is hard to choose. </p>

<p>If certain of business, especially in the east, Stern would be a great choice. But she's not sure, so that puts that to maybe. Great city as a campus, if she really is into cities. The double major is interesting, but make sure it is actually doable. If she ends up as a science major, if that is a possibility, it is sometimes more difficult to double major with a lot of lab time. The Stern Scholar thing sounds very intriguing, tempting as it is meant to be I suppose!</p>

<p>She hasn't yet seen Chicago. A lot of kids have strong feelings one way or the other about UChicago, so a visit might make your choice easy, either way it goes. If she loves it--there you go. If she doesn't, you've got other choices.
Hopkins...you're gonna be there soon. Try to have her sit in on classes and talk to a lot of people, here and wherever she visits. If English is a possibility, check that out at Hopkins. And of course get the scoop at the school about pre-med rigor from pre-med kids. And if she goes the business route, how is that at Hopkins?</p>

<p>The above are all city settings, all rather rigorous schools or programs.
UNC, more laid back, different climate. College town rather than a city. Tons to choose from course-wise --and maybe more work to find out the really good profs and courses(but they are there for sure), but if she's a people person and a go getter, she can probably handle this. Any other honors perks, like preferred registration?
This option would save a ton of money, and she'd finish in three years--so gotta check this out. She could do a lot with that time and money, like travel or put it towards grad school. But, as my mother always said, "Never buy anything just because it's on sale." Be happy about the sale if you would have bought it anyway-- as in, if she'd be happy there.</p>

<p>I am wondering what Kat, who is in NC, knows of the academics there. I have heard that they are not so easy for a state school, thus explaining the lower grad. rate. Also that upper courses are much much smaller. ?</p>

<p>So I guess I have not helped at all, only made you feel not so alone in thinking this is a tough choice. Good luck to your daughter, and congrats again!</p>

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<p>What kind of girl is she?</p>

<p>Academics aside, these schools offer VERY different living experiences. NYU is awesome--but it isn't a traditional college experience like UNC.</p>

<p>I have a niece who went to UNC Honors. She loved it and works in NYC as an editor at one of the big publishing houses.</p>

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<p>Wow, Choco, no advice except, visit if possible - her choices are kind of like comparing apples and oranges and grapes and bananas - all tasty fruits, all plenty of vitamins, each very different! Congrats and good luck, it is a good problem to have.</p>

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<p>ya Cangel, she would like to have fruit salad. She has been torn over the past few days, and asked if she could go one year to each school, and thus experience NYC, beautiful campus, gargoyles, etc.</p>

<p>(I got out of bed to put my sunglasses in my bag, and could not resist 10 more minutes on CC)</p>

<p>Cheers, she is in many ways leaning towards the business/science major at Stern, but it could be a lot more complicated than a business/pol.sc.</p>

<p>Cricket, thanks for the detailed analysis. Unfortunately my D was raised by a mom who "never walks past a sale", lol. UNC is a good school, though,...</p>

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<p>Don't know anything about UC or Stern but I was on the faculty at JHU Med School (as a PhD. researcher type in Neuroscience) for 4 years and then went back to Med school at UNC.</p>

<p>At JHU I had some interaction with the undergraduate campus but not much. Was very impressed with the quality and intellectual curiosity of the students. However, they seemed constantly stressed and a little down most of the time... could be because they were mostly pre-med.</p>

<p>As for UNC, I would agree with the above posts. As a big state school, you can slide by or get a great education depending on how much you put into finding the rigorous, stimulating classes. Again, I was at the med school (this time as a student) but I had a lot more interaction with the undergrads and many of the undergrads went on to med school at UNC. One of my classmates finished undergrad at UNC in 3 years (I think he was an out of state student also) and did well in med school. I was at UNC-med '91-'95, so my information is dated but at that time the med school encouraged diverse backgrounds so an econ/business major would have been welcomed. Some of my classmates included a CPA, a graphic arts designer, a NY city police detective (president of our class), and an art historian. Hope this helps some.</p>

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<p>Okay...........we are back from Hopkins.</p>

<p>First of all, 70 degrees, daffodils are out, students laying in the grass.....ahhh, what a gorgeous day, what a beautiful campus. Very compact, small cosy feel, anyone would feel at home here.</p>

<p>My daughter really really liked it. The student body is very diverse, from all over the U.S. and the world. Did not seem preppy/East Coast, (but we had never heard that anyway.) </p>

<p>Most of the students we spoke with were science majors. some English/writing, and some IR. (what's with IR....the new hot thing?). Hopkins definitely has a lot to choose from, and very flexible with interdisciplinary studies. They bragged about their 95% Law School acceptance rate, and 100% Med School rate. I don't know why I feel sceptical about these numbers....can they not be manipulated by not allowing students to get to the app. process, and eliminating them earlier in the game??</p>

<p>Hopkins--very seriously into research. Even sophomore students had campus jobs doing research, and either getting paid, or getting credit for it. There is no doubt that it is a science-oriented school. People I talked to said that it is very competitive, and though most kids are helpful, there are some, who are so bent on getting ahead that they will not help you out. 2 kids in the cafeteria told us that they were very unhappy with the atmosphere their freshman year, but feel much better about it now.</p>

<p>I felt that students were a little on the somber side, though. The few I talked to said that there was not a huge amount to do outside campus....Most students said that they go downtown when they want to eat out, and used the inter-college shuttle that runs between 4 local schools. They were not happy talking about safety issues , I guess with what has gone down there recently.</p>

<p>Housing is only guaranteed for the first 2 years, and for the moment 3rd and 4th years must move off campus. New dorm construction was in evident progress though. (Only 600 beds)</p>

<p>My daughter was very interested in their IR and Neuroscience majors. Which they are certainly known for. Wonderful research facilities, state of the art labs and equipment, almost a little scary....</p>

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<p>Oh, and anyone can take free music lessons at their Peabody Institute (after auditioning....), so that is a nice outlet.</p>

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<p>Glad your daughter liked it, Chocoholic! Are you visiting any other campuses this month?</p>

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<p>chocoholic,
I would guess that the UChicago visit will either bring it to the top of the list or cut it off entirely. There is a saying about MIT that it is like drinking out of a firehose. Chicago is a very different animal from MIT, but the intellectual thirst of the students is, I think, similar. </p>

<p>Anyway, have fun and opt for public transit if possible (else a good map!).</p>

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<p>JHU is a great research focused school but the atmosphere is far more than somber, it borders on cut throat competition particularly in the hard sciences. U Chicago is an intellectual hotbed that fosters and perpetuates its reputation via its teaching style (mostly small discussion group format) after intro level larger classes but is not known for having a good undergraduate experience despite being in Chicago. I felt that from a "pure learning style" point of view it was the best place on the planet for my son but he (and we) wanted for him to have a broader undergraduate experience and also have some fun along the way.</p>

<p>UNC because of its size offers both worlds. As OneDown mentioned, you can make the experience there anything you want it to be but with the honors program and the AP credits she'll be entering with she can have a very special undergraduate experience. </p>

<p>My son entered UNC with 40 AP credits and is in the honors program. He has taken two honors classes each semester and has been quite pleased with the content, professorial engagement and quality of students in his classes. All have been taught by full professors, several by department chairs or asst chairs. He has been able to fulfill most of his core requirements via the AP credit, is taking upper division classes as a second semester freshman and will have all his requirements for med school and be ready for the MCATs after his sophomore year. This will allow him to either seek dual degrees or have have double majors and minors and concentrate his last two years on courses he WANTS to take. He has found a great cooperative spirit among his classmates with study groups easy to form and everyone willing to help. He loves life in Chapel Hill and says he has never been happier in his life.</p>

<p>His calc class (non honors) had 50 students (capped) and was taught by a full professor that spoke English. By comparison, his best friend's same calc class at Penn had 300 students and a TA that could barely speak the language. I guess my reason for mentioning this is don't believe the sterotypes (small or Ivy always equals small classes and no TAs and state or public offers something of a lesser education) because they aren't always true.</p>

<p>The neuroscience dept at UNC is very strong with several of the leading researchers in the field on the staff at both UNC and the medical school. They are doing pioneering work in a particular area of neuro linguistics. You will need to talk to my son for more on this. </p>

<p>Please contact me via email or PM if you would like to get my son's email or IM addresses. He can answer things for you first hand about UNC. He has met with several CC families when they visited UNC and has exchanged emails and had phone conversations with others.</p>

<p>He passed on Yale (albeit to accept a major scholarship) but has never looked back and never had a regret about his decision. He was among the 45,000 on Franklin Street Monday night having a once in a lifetime experience after the Tarheel victory which is particularly notable because one year ago this would have been the farthest thing from importance to him. Do contact him.</p>

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<p>Momof2inca
We are going to be in Chicago for the admitted students' overnight April 14-15. Since we have never even seen it, I really don't want her to eliminate without visiting. At this point she is getting frustrated with herself, and about not being able to decide.</p>

<p>eadad
I know how strongly you feel about UNC, and really, we had a very positive visit there. My daughter definitely feels a little cheated of AP credits at some schools, after having taken 11 in H.S., and gotten 4's and 5's. The purpose of taking the AP's was for challenge, and bec. of having already exhausted other courses, but then there should be some acknowledgement of this. JHU gives credit for 5 of her APs, and Chicago for 4. NYU(Stern) I believe was not too bad, with about 9.</p>

<p>Is your opinion of JHU based on what you have heard, or personal experience? I did specifically ask students if the competition was cutthroat, and they laughed and said they a few crazy kids, but most students are very co-operative and helpful.</p>

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<p>the neuro classes at jhu are amazing, and if you like neuroscience you get to work closely with some of the top professors in the field. They are currently building a new cognitive science building on campus with an MRI and other equiptment. There really isnt that much inter-student competition, more just wanting to do well. There's a ton of money going into the school right now and they are trying to make it more of a residential campus. The 600 beds for upperclassmen is a start, and I think that they have more planned. Also, if you pay as much for an apartment as you would for a dorm, youd be able to get an apartment in a nicer area surrounded by campus, the real problem is whne people move off campus and try to save a lot of money by living in row houses on the outskirts of the bad neighborhood surrounding hopkins.</p>

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<p>ec1234
Are you a current student...and what year? Have you enjoyed being at JHU or was there a long adjustment period. The students I talked to, said it took them quite a while to feel happy.
Are you pre-med? I am really interested in knowing how JHU is able to get a 100% Med School acceptance rate; do they only "allow" the sure bets to apply in the first place?</p>

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<p>I'm not a student there, but my boyfriend is a freshman who is a planning on majoring in neuroscience. He loves his classes, especialyl the neuroscience ones.</p>

<p>Id say that the adjustment period seems to come second semester, because first semester is pass/fail so most people take that time to socialize and not work as hard in their classes as they might. While second semester it hits them. That could make the JHU workload seem heavier, because they complain, and yet I have atleast as much work as they do.The social life is what you make it. I heard it quieted down there a lot second semester. There are frats and drinking, and also people just hanging out around the dorms. I dont think that many people venture into downtown Baltimore that often, although hopkins sponsers a lot of trips to the inner harbor, and the colltown bus now goes there. It also goes up to towson, which is a nice town with some shopping. On campus Friday nights theres a free coffee place thing with board games and stuff. Basically, its not a crazy social life, and there are people who just study all the time, but you dont have to do either if you dont want to. </p>

<p>I hope that helps some</p>

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<p>Chocoholic: Eadad has made some great points about UNC. My daughter also took 10 AP/IB courses and would go in as a sophomore as well. I do think that and the Honors classes are a big plus As a result, she plans on double-majoring. Also, UNC has one of the best study-abroad programs around (and especially in comparison to UChicago's, from what I understand), if that's of any interest to her. As Eadad has pointed out elsewhere, others can [try] to register for honors classes, but these are most often filled up first by those in the Honors program. And through friends, we understand that the Honors and upper level classes are small in size and quite challenging. Even with the entry level larger classes, friends have said they were excellent. In terms of the future--medical school or law school--well, UNC has 2 fine ones (and Duke, of course, is down the road). There are actually many NC students, too, who turn down Ivy's (or Ivy-like institutions) to attend UNC. That's usually because of a combination of things--incredible campus, facilities, programs, scholarships, or the amazingly low cost--terrific for both instate and out of state--for an outstanding education and, I think (perhaps) a really well-rounded 4 years--on many levels. The atmosphere there is just so different in many ways to what my daughter found elsewhere. The kids just seem happier. (Maybe it's the weather??). And I have to add--that of all my years of living here and of all the people I have known go through that school, I have never once heard anyone say that he/she was unhappy attending UNC. Many of her friends have transferred back into UNC, after attending a year of their 1st choice 'dream' school. I'm sure you know all this, though. But your daughter can also take advantage of Duke as well (a limited number of classes, I believe, and a fantastic library, etc). Good luck.</p>

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<p>My comments about cut throat atmosphere in hard sciences came from students from my son's HS who were students there. His HS is known for its strong math and science programs so each year it sends a number of people to MIT, Cal Tech, as well as JHU. </p>

<p>Their comments about JHU always centered on those majoring in hard sciences and how wary they were of their classmates sabotaging lab work, being guarded if not unwilling to help and participate in study groups etc. They said that in some classes that are graded on strict curves (which many of the hard science classes apparently are) it's every man for himself with little regard for fellow classmates.</p>

<p>In programs that are known incubators for high powered research that can often happen, especially when you have people competing for undergraduate research assistantships and ultimately vying for med school. It definitely turned him off to the school. </p>

<p>They also said by contrast that the liberal arts programs (English, creative writing etc) were a whole different story </p>

<p>The area surrounding JHU like that around Hyde Park, leaves much to be desired. We have heard from former students attending both schools that the social scenes are heavily dependent on alcohol and at JHU Greek life as well. </p>

<p>Just a side note about schools and their personalities: </p>

<p>We always viewed New Haven and Chapel Hill much the same way in that both are defined by and owe their existence,if not survival to both Yale and UNC, whereas U Chicago and JHU are obviously key contributors to the intellectual quotient of both Chicago and Baltimore as well as large employers but neither defines nor shapes the identity of the city.</p>

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<p>She could do pre-med courses and still get into law school but she could not go pre-law and get into medicine. How easy/hard would it be for her to take the bio, chem, o-chem, calc and physics courses needed to fulfill the pre-med requirements at Stern? while she could dstill major in business, depending on where se goes, there may be extracouses like bio chem etc. How flexible is the progra at Stern in allowing her to do that.</p>

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<p>Last month a group of us who went to UNC for graduate school in history over 30 years ago got together in Chapel Hill. Most of us had been a seminar in Southern history given by a now retired Kenan professor. All of us regarded our time at Chapel Hill as a seminal experience; it was the place that went a long way in making us what we became. We had dinner with the professor at the Carolina Inn on Friday night; went to the lectures in honor of the 75th anniversary of the Southern Historical Collection Saturday during the day; and ate at a restaurant that over looks Franklin St. Saturday night. We're planning on making this an annual event. The weather was warm; there were flowers on the trees (but the flowers ladies are gone); and all the new construction seems to coming to an end.</p>

<p>As a footnote to nothing--this hasn't been a bad year for my colleges: USC, where my son goes, won the national championship in football, not that he cares, and Carolina won the NCAA final four. Alas poor Rutgers, my undergrad school, didn't win much of anything.</p>