So go to UCLA, apply to USMA next year, and if you get in, go. If you don’t get in, continue at UCLA.
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West Point doesn’t take transfer students. In some cases they might take students who have been in college, but they start at the very beginning, as a plebe, with four years to go.
Oh, I know they don’t take transfers, but the OP knows that too. He said he was going to UCLA this coming year, not waiting to apply again and then deciding USMA or UCLA. If he applies and is accepted, he’ll have to decide whether to start over at USMA or continue at UCLA. At that time, he’ll know more about the ROTC/UCLA route and may decide that’s best for him and his military career.
He wouldn’t be the only one starting college over at the USMA. They have cadets join from the prep school and from other colleges (yes, all starting over).
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Everyone I know who was a graduate of one of the service academies has done extremely well in their civilian careers. Where they are in demand depends a lot on what they did during their military career. One is now a CFO at a big financial firm in San Francisco because the military sent him to business school and that’s the kind of work he did in the military. Another is now a surgeon because the military sent him to med school and that’s where he got his initial medical experience. The armed services are enormous organizations and their members develop a wide variety of experiences and specialties.
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Both USMA and UCLA AROTC are fine paths to commissioning as an Army officer. Hopefully that’s your primary goal. But the paths are very different. High performing freshman in ROTC programs tend to be more successful as Academy re-applicants. Thinking about prestige isn’t going to get you through those tough moments though. Best advice that I got 40 years ago was that plebe year is going to suck, don’t expect anything else and embrace the suck. If you’re not mentally ready for that, then its going to be a tough road. Realistically, going from freshman year at UCLA to plebe year at WP is going to a culture shock. But people can do it. I had a plebe year roommate at USNA who was a re-applicant after having completed his “knob” year at The Citadel. That’s a glutton for punishment.
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I’d be more impressed if you had graduated from one of the military academies.
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Prestige is pretty hard to gauge-or agree on, as the countless CC threads on the topic attest-but what are your long-term goals? The service commitment for USMA is double that of ROTC(8 years v 4); and additional service commitment is often(but not always) incurred should the military pay for business/medical/law school.
If you are planning to do 20, then the USMA is by far the choice. If not, then the choice becomes fuzzier; you’d need to weigh the length of service in light of long-term goals of civilian employment.
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Need to be a little more specific on the service obligation. The 8 years referred to for USMA is five years active duty, three years on individual ready reserve (no monthly drill, no two weeks of “summer camp”). I did three years of IRR and didn’t put my uniform on once.
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The schools are going to be very different experiences. My husband graduated from the Naval Academy in '92, taught there for 6.5 years in the engineering department, and we live very close by. There is a commaraderie among graduates of the military academies (both from your own academy and even, other than Army/Navy game day, among graduates of all the academies) that you might not get if you go ROTC. It’s that shared experience and the traditions that each school has that create a bond. Our neighbor’s daughter just got inducted in the the USNA class of '25 yesterday, and suffering through Plebe summer is just the first of many similar rights of passage that you won’t get with ROTC. If you’re thinking long-term career in the military, I highly recommend West Point over UCLA. If you’re just going for prestige, pick UCLA. I’m also not opposed to choosing a school with more prestige, but in your case I think it might not be the best choice based on your long-term career plan. Also, I agree with whoever said that some companies really like graduates of military academies. My husband is currently a self-employed forensic electrical engineering consultant because the president of the company he first worked for after he left the Navy only wanted USNA graduates (the company is located in Annapolis). It’s kind of a niche field, and he now earns over $300K a year. The president prefers USNA graduates because they tend to be very organized, discipined, and reliable (requirements to survive long-term in any branch of the military).
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But there are those on IRR who served all three and more(cf Iraq/Afghanistan). It’s better to plan to serve all years and be surprised you didn’t than to plan on 5 and out and need to serve 8.
More realistically, anyone on IRR won’t be called back to active duty unless there are extenuating circumstances. After my active duty was over and I went on IRR, I never got called back, and none of the other guys I stayed in touch with did, either.
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Of course they won’t be called back unless there are “extenuating circumstances” but those do occur and have occurred. It appears that no one remembers “stop loss” and the multiple IRR call-ups for the Iraq war.
Almost all IRR call ups were for medical professionals. So it is a concern for that field, and they always ask for volunteers first.
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Stop loss affected everybody, and this line “almost all IRR call ups were for medical professionals” is not accurate.
“The tapped soldiers principally include “transporters, drivers, mechanics, combat engineers, logisticians and supply folks,” according to Raymond Robinson Jr., chief of operations for the Army's Deputy Chief of Staff for Personnel.”
And focusing on IRR ignores stop loss, which affected everybody at different times.
OP has made plans to serve on active duty; it’s a disservice to guarantee that he-or any other recruit-won’t be obligated to serve during IRR status.
I’m assuming we’re done debating IRR call-ups
Apparently my earlier post was too subtle, so let me rephrase.
Per the forum rules: “College Confidential forums exist to discuss college admission and other topics of interest. It is not a place for contentious debate. If you find yourself repeating talking points, it might be time to step away and do something else… If a thread starts to get heated, it might be closed or heavily moderated.”
http://talk.qa.collegeconfidential.com/guidelines
We have exhausted the OT IRR conversation. Move the discussion forward please.
Here’s my opinion, when it comes to this discussion. I myself, did recently apply to USMA, for C/O 2026, but my application was shut-down, due to not being competitive enough.
This being said, I still have a back-up plan, such that being the Senior Military College, The Citadel, in SC. Sometimes, referred to as: “West Point of the South”
Essentially, everything here is the same as WP, only difference being you have to pay for tuition to attend. Other than that aspect, I’d say these two colleges are practically very similar.
I’ve come to the conclusion, as I prepare to enlist in the Army Reserves + do ROTC at respective college, the Army will assist me in paying the somewhat 56k/year tution rates as this institution (for out-of-state resident).
I’m only 1 month into my senior-year, and so far, from what I’ve seen and learned, assuming I will receive either a acceptance/denial. I hope if I am accepted, I 100% plan on committing to the school, and attending next year in Fall 2022.