https://www.wsj.com/articles/is-the-ivy-leagues-admission-bias-a-trade-secret-1490740763
from Wall Street Journal. Latest on Princeton’s attempt to hide their data which could reveal discrimination against Asian applicants.
And It could reveal no discrimination. Mr. Riley seems to have drawn conclusions before seeing the evidence.
^^^Well if there is nothing to hide, why not release all the data willingly?
For the reasons that Princeton has given, which may or may not be valid. Just because an organization has nothing to hide doesn’t mean that it wants its books open to all. Coca-Cola protects its formula; Google protects its search algorithms. I’m not at all on Princeton’s side but I am wary when the worst is immediately concluded. Building a class is complex and apparent discriminatory patterns may be deceiving.
^^College Admissions ain’t Coca-Cola. I think most would agree that transparency is important to the process. I think we all want to know that every kid gets a fair shake.
No, every kid doesn’t get a fair shake. Not at any of the top colleges. It will never be entirely fair. Princeton, et al., are private colleges, they can choose who they like.
^^^Well let them come out and say directly then they don’t like ORM’s, and not hide it. That will change the climate, and many students will steer away from colleges that don’t necessarily want the “best and brightest.”
Aren’t the vast majority of stduents at the tippy tops still ORM’s? Seems that they like them pretty well.
^^^No, the vast majority of students at the tippy top colleges are largely white. If you look at admissions by race, Asians represent usually around 14% of the class, that’s 7% men and 7% women. Asian women have the most competitive stats when it comes to grades, standardized test scores and ECs. This 14% is not keeping up with representation of Asians which is growing in the general population as this article above points out.
stats do not completely define the qualifications of the student. Many top schools factor in the environment from which a student comes. My alma mater (a top 5 liberal arts college) recently posted that 25% of their incoming class is first generation, and something like 30% come through specific outreach operations to low income students such as Questbridge. I have no doubt that if you compare the quantitative stats of those students to those from legacy families, or high socioeconomic families, they will be different–quite likely quantitatively lower. It doesn’t mean the students are less qualified. These top schools are trying to level the playing field by NOT strictly using quantitative stats. I get that you don’t like it. It’s the way it is.
^^^No, you don’t get it. People are deemed qualified on different factors other than test scores. No problem. But don’t discriminate on someone just because of the color of their skin. That’s what I don’t like. I truly believe that at some point the Supreme Court will get it right. There are many ways that colleges can weigh factors to create diverse classes, but color of skin or race should not be one of them.
Why is it always this^? Who cares what their stats are? That is the opening bid. That is all! And frankly, they have a minimum threshold to stay in consideration…but after that, it switches over to the other nonobjective items, such as essays, ECs, life stories/circumstances, connections, sports, etc. (you say Asian women also have the best ECs? How could you possibly know as this Cannot be objectively measured and is not on CDS!)
But it’s not all about grades, bc they are only one element, and tons of kids have them. Stop (over) working on the stats and start working on life experiences, working as a team, giving your teachers a reason to say in your rec…“best kid I’ve ever had”, not “punctual, hard working and super smart”, bc colleges want to see the “best kid” recs. And obviously, many Asian kids can show that bc they get in! Every top kid can’t get in. Get over it.
By the way, I don’t think the public has a vested interest in the transparency of Princeton admissions. Most of us could care less what they do, and how many cookie cutter kids from fancy prep schools they admit. Not even a “first world” problem.
Also, it’s ironic people want to pull down the ladder after they no longer need it…
Identity politics is the new imprimatur of liberalism. College campuses are the bastions of liberalism. Of course they are going to utilize identity politics in their admissions and hiring practices. As private organizations, there is little to do about it.
However, the recent article about the Ivy League’s massive tax suck might stimulate some wondering about how much subsidizing these elite and vastly wealthy institutions need.
Elite schools at one point tried to claim that Asians chased high GPAs and high test scores, and hid behind a “holistic” approach claiming that Asians were not “well rounded.” It wasn’t the case. It’s a myth, and that’s what this thread is about. Bias in anything is not a good thing, and in particular in college admissions.
“Every top kid can’t get in, get over it.” No I and others who represent ORMs will not “get over it.” Not when there are “quotas” for Asians and any other racial minority.
^^^You may not care what Princeton does, but you don’t represent the universe of parents. Most of us want to see that every student gets a fair read on their application at a top college, and we want to eliminate racial bias in college admissions.
I think my view represents more of the universe of parents than yours.
This is such a weak and old argument. If Asians were at 2%, you’d be arguing the opposite. Yes, get over it. They all get a fair read. But that doesn’t equal proportional admissions…
How much racial bias do you want to eliminate? Is the SAT biased? Is out public school system biased? Maybe the college’s are trying to eliminate THOSE racial biases?
^^^It’s too bad we can’t all be concerned with minorities having an equal voice.
Perhaps some of us are concerned about ALL minorities having an equal voice, and some are only concerned about one minority…
ok, good, now we’re getting somewhere. Yes, let’s all care about all the minorities, including the over-represented ones! Yea! One person down…