Princeton FAQ: Get your questions answered by current students

<p>Hey guys! The 2008-2009 application season is starting to hit full swing, and hopefully many of you are applying to Princeton. This is a thread for you to ask current students whatever you'd like to know about admissions, academics, student life, and anything else related to Princeton. Since certain questions spring up so often, I thought I'd post them myself and try to answer them as definitively as possible. Below is a "Table of Contents" for the FAQ. Clicking on one of the links will take you to the post which responds to that question. It will not take you to another thread. If your question is not in the FAQ, then ask away, and we'll do our best to answer. Best of luck with your applications!</p>

<p>Am</a> I eligible to apply to Princeton? Does Princeton have Early Decision?
What</a> factors are most important to Princeton? Is it better to have a high SAT or a high GPA?
How</a> much does legacy matter?
Am</a> I better off using the Princeton Admission Application or the Common Application?
How</a> good is Princeton's financial aid? Is it still as good as Harvard's?
Does</a> Princeton consider my freshman year grades?
What's</a> the deal with the eating clubs?
Does</a> Princeton have grade deflation? Is the atmosphere cutthroat?</p>

<p>There are no minimum grades or test scores required for admission. Princeton accepts applications from students who have not yet begun studying at another university and have not been accepted under another college's binding early decision program. Most applicants are high school seniors, but Princeton will also consider applications from those who wish to leave high school early. Princeton recently eliminated its early decision plan, so all applicants apply under the same regular decision plan.</p>

<p>Eligibility</a> Requirements</p>

<p>In its 2007-2008</a> Common Data Set, Princeton ranked various factors in terms of importance.</p>

<p>Very Important
[ul][<em>]Rigor of secondary school record
[</em>]Class rank
[<em>]Academic GPA
[</em>]Standardized test scores
[<em>]Letters of recommendation
[</em>]Essays
[<em>]Talent/ability
[</em>]Character/personal qualities
[li]First generation[/li][/ul]</p>

<p>Important
[ul][<em>]Extracurricular activities
[</em>]Alumni relation (legacy)
[/ul]</p>

<p>Considered
[ul][<em>]Interview
[</em>]Geographical residence[/ul]</p>

<p>Not Considered
[ul][<em>]State residence
[</em>]Religious affiliation/commitment[/ul]</p>

<p>I found it interesting that Princeton seems to prefer first generation college students to legacies, all else being equal. Although ECs are given less weight than many other things, they are often used as a "tiebreaker" since so many students have excellent academic qualifications. Don't use the CDS as an excuse to play video games instead of starting a club. ;) If you're wondering if you're geographic region will give you a boost, check out this [url=<a href="http://www.princeton.edu/admission/applyingforadmission/admission_statistics/map.htm%5Dmap%5B/url"&gt;http://www.princeton.edu/admission/applyingforadmission/admission_statistics/map.htm]map[/url&lt;/a&gt;].&lt;/p>

<p>Many students, especially lopsided ones, wonder whether it's better to have a high GPA or a high SAT. The answer is both. ;) The admissions office is kind enough to release acceptance rates by GPA and by SAT. Students applying in the 2006-2007 application season with a 4.0 unweighted GPA were accepted at a rate of 16.8%. Students applying in the same season with an SAT I in the 2300-2400 range were accepted at a rate of 26%. Acceptance rates for other scores can be found [url=<a href="http://www.princeton.edu/admission/applyingforadmission/admission_statistics/%5Dhere%5B/url"&gt;http://www.princeton.edu/admission/applyingforadmission/admission_statistics/]here[/url&lt;/a&gt;].&lt;/p>

<p>Princeton's legacy acceptance rate is 40% (Source</a>). Two factors contribute to this higher rate: </p>

<ol>
<li>Princeton gives legacies a boost.</li>
<li>Legacies tend to be more qualified than the general applicant pool. </li>
</ol>

<p>Legacies (those who are children of Princeton alumni) make up 14.7% of the Class of 2011 (Source</a>).</p>

<p>Princeton has signed an agreement to give the Common App equal consideration. Any college which accepts the Common App is required to do this (Source</a>). Some people say "Well why do they bother having their own application?" or "Couldn't Princeton still give an edge to people who use the Princeton app?". Princeton has no incentive to give an andvantage to those using the Princeton App. It seeks to enroll the most talented, accomplished, and diverse class it can. The bottom line is that you should use the application that you feel best allows you to showcase your talents and abilities.</p>

<p>Princeton has need-blind admissions, which means that students are admitted without regard to their ability to pay. Princeton meets 100% of each student's demonstrated need, and financial aid packages do not include loans. Princeton is one of only six schools across the country to meet the full need of international students. Financial aid is "citizenship-blind."</p>

<p>Many students wonder how Princeton's financial aid compares with that of other top schools. Harvard and Stanford do not require parental contributions from those with annual family income under $60,000 (Source</a> 1, Source</a> 2). "Princeton is currently "tuition free" for families with incomes up to $100,000 and asks for no parental payment for families with incomes up to $75,000" (Source</a>). Harvard recently overhauled its financial aid program, with the goal of making itself more accessible to middle and upper middle income families. Families with incomes between $60,000 and $180,000 can on average expect to contribute 10% or less of their income. Princeton has not made any similar guarantees, so it's unclear how well Princeton is competing with other top schools in the upper-middle income range. You can use the Princeton</a> Financial Aid Estimator to get an idea of how much financial aid you could be awarded. Remember that the Estimator is designed with US and Canadian citizens in mind since purchasing power varies widely across countries.</p>

<p>Back when Fred Hargadon was Dean of Admission, ninth grade wasn't considered.</p>

<p>
[quote]
We do not consider the ninth grade. We focus only on the tenth, eleventh, and twelfth grades.

[/quote]
</p>

<p>Princeton</a> - Admissions - Frequently Asked Questions</p>

<p>There's no evidence to suggest that the policy has changed, and many CC posters have reported that admissions officers have told them at information sessions that ninth grade is still not considered. One poster wrote the following:</p>

<p>


</p>

<p>Freshman</a> Grades</p>

<p>First, let's make sure everyone know what eating clubs are and how they work. Eating clubs are places where juniors and seniors take their meals and where, along with other locations, the entire student body socializes. Midway through sophomore year, students decide if they want to join a club. Of the 10 clubs, 5 are selective and 5 are not. The selective clubs are called bicker clubs, and the non-selective clubs are called sign-ins. The first step in the membership process is deciding whether you want to join a bicker club. If you do, you go through the bicker process at one and only one club. Roughly 2/3 of students who bicker are accepted. Those who want to join a sign-in club rank the sign-in clubs in order of preference, and a lottery process is used to assign students to each club. This is called the first round of sign-ins. After that, students who bickered a club and were not accepted have the chance to join one of the sign-ins which still have spaces open. There are always eating slub with spots open, so you don't have to worry about not being able to join a club. </p>

<p>Approximately 80% of juniors and seniors are club members. Although the clubs are more expensive than a standard meal contract, juniors and seniors on financial aid receive a $2,500 increase in their aid package to make up the difference between the average cost of board at a club and the cost of the standard meal contract. Those who don't join a club have a number of other options: living and eating in one of the four year residential colleges, joining a coop, and being independent. Independent students cook their own meals and have access to kitchen facilities, often in their dorm rooms.</p>

<p>Most of those who are in sign-in clubs joined in the first round. It's not as if the sign-in members couldn't get into bicker clubs. Each club has its own unique characteristics, and most students base their decision of what club to join on these factors rather than on a desire to join a bicker club. </p>

<p>One of the most common charges leveled against the clubs (and Princeton in general) is that they are elitist. For example, one prospective applicant recently asked:</p>

<p>


</p>

<p>The short answer is that the elitist stereotype is outdated, and the eating clubs are much less exclusive than their counterparts at Harvard and Yale. I'm only a sophomore, so I can't tell you what it's like to be a club member. But I can say that after spending a year hanging out at the clubs on weekends, I have not gotten an elitist vibe at all. Even at the clubs where I probably wouldn't fit in, the members have been very welcoming. Below are some of the most insightful past posts on the subject:</p>

<p>


</p>

<p>For balance, here's a more critical take on the clubs:</p>

<p>


</p>

<p>And finally, what I consider the best post on what the clubs are really like:</p>

<p>


</p>

<p>For many years, Princeton was deserving of its elitist stereotype, but times have changed. Princeton is now an incredibly diverse place, in terms of its racial, socioeconomic, and ideological makeup. I won't pretend that you won't run into some extremely wealthy people here, but you will also meet students from extremely disadvantaged backgrounds. More often than not, it will be something in between.</p>

<p>High schoolers often see something mystical about the Ivy League, believing it to be almost otherworldly. Tagging Princeton with the snobby label is one way of making these views seem justified. The truth is that Princeton is not all that different from any other college. Sure, we have a bigger endowment and our students have higher test scores. But once you're here, you go to class during the week, unwind on the weekends, and take exams at the end of each term...just like you would anywhere else. Fundamentally, Princeton is made up of students trying to get an education, many of whom share the same passions, goals, hopes, and fears as yourself.</p>

<p>The administration has instituted a policy under which A's and A-'s are supposed to account for no more than 35% of all grades given in undergraduate courses.</p>

<p>Office</a> of the Registar - Announcement</p>

<p>This does not mean that in every class, only the top 35% get A's. It means that across all classes, only top 35% are supposed to get A's. Some classes, generally the smaller ones, will grant more A's, while others, generally the large lectures, will grant fewer. For example, let's say that the politics department offer three courses: a large introductory course on foreign affairs which has 100 students and two small seminars, one on nation building and the other on socialism, which both have 15 students. If 30% of the students in the foreign affairs class get A's, then 50% of the students in each of the seminars can get A's. Remember that 35% is something the University is working towards. Some of the departments are there already, and some are not. The humanities departments still lag behind the science departments in implementing the policy. </p>

<p>I have not found the environment at Princeton to be cutthroat. Students do their best and are open about the fact that they work very hard. But the general attitude is "I'm going to study so that I can get the best grades I'm capable of" and not "I'm going to study so that I do better than Jack." Students form study groups to prepare for exams, and collaboration on problem sets is common and often encouraged by the faculty. </p>

<p>Most students dislike grade deflation for the obvious reason that it makes it harder to get good grades. I have mixed feelings on the subject. I don't believe that the policy will adversely affect me after I graduate. Princeton has worked hard to inform</a> graduate schools and employers of the policy and there is [url=<a href="http://www.princeton.edu/odoc/faculty/grading/faq/#comp000047219e980000000b7278c0%5Devidence%5B/url"&gt;http://www.princeton.edu/odoc/faculty/grading/faq/#comp000047219e980000000b7278c0]evidence[/url&lt;/a&gt;] to suggest that Princetonians are not being negatively affected. And as a math/science major, it's nice to know that students in the humanities aren't getting significantly higher grades. But at the same time, I am troubled by the effects the policy has on student behavior. As I said earlier, I'm not really talking about competitiveness in class. I took a very large premed course and still did not come across the cutthroat atmosphere that some have warned of. What troubles me is how the policy has affected my friends' approach to course selection. I have no data to back this up, but many of my classmates stick to classes within their major and are reluctant to take classes which are perceived to be hard. There may be no evidence that the policy has negatively affected career prospects, but students fear that it could, and they have changed their behavior accordingly. It's worth noting that a more generous P/D/F policy would go a long way to fixing the course selection problems I described.</p>

<p>Awesome!!! Will post questions as soon as they keep creeping up!</p>

<p>For now, does Princeton give more importance to 'achievers' or medal-hoppers OR to people who have dedicated themselves to good, meaningful work like research and community service, but abstain from medal-hopping??</p>

1 Like

<p>Both types are well represented on campus. But I don't understand why you seem to dislike those who win medals and awards. Just like you may have passion for your community, they have passion for a specific subject.</p>

<p>I personally feel that passion for some subject is better represented in working in various areas of that subject, exploring new ideas, creating some, etc and not solving Olympiad questions. That's my take anyway. Thanks!</p>

<p>im having problems with one of my essays..
can someone please please please help me :)</p>

<p>sure! explain the problem?</p>

<p>I have a question. Do African-American males have a better chance of getting into Princeton with a 1770 SAT score than a Caucasian male does with a 2100 SAT score? And let's say that they have the same extracurriculars, work experience, and GPA.</p>

1 Like

<p>I really need help if I am going to apply as high school junior without GED and graduate. Is there anybody have suggestions.</p>

<p>Why are you applying as a junior? To accept you, Princeton will want to see not only an outstanding, compelling application, but also some very good reasons for you leaving school early. Until we know more details about you, we can't really help much.</p>

<p>Several questions: Would Princeton be a good college for those thinking of majoring in premed or math? for those who are thinking in becoming doctors/physicists/neurosurgeons/etc. ? Also, are college classes taken in high school, as well as AP Exam Scores (5's, national ap scholar) taken into account? How can I show princeton my ap scores and college class grades? Thanks!</p>

<p>Yes. Yes. Yes. The transcript sent from school.</p>

<p><strong><em>How does Princeton look at Native American's?</em></strong>* I've got a 32 ACT (36 Math, 34 Sci, 28 Rdg, 29 Lang), so i'm fairly happy with that, my weighted GPA is a 94.80/100 (no 4pt scale for some reason...) but my class rank is like just barely in the top 10%, but because the top 10% kids want to go to UT and only need to be in top 10% to get in so they take regular classes. I've got loads of AP classes, I've taken harder curriculum than the Val and Sal even. Eagle scout... All of my clubs at school pretty much revolve around Comm service... I'm stuco secretary.</p>

<p>Would all that and my URM get me at least a serious look? Not asking for chances, just if my application will be seriously looked at and not just chucked out right off the bat.</p>