Princeton is indeed somewhat preppy

Colleges and Universities A-Z Princeton University
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<p>I came back from my visit to Princeton yesterday.</p>

<p>I loved the place and the students I met there. The gothic campus is gorgeous.</p>

<p>The culture and style of dress of many of the students at Princeton are indeed preppy. I dont understand Princeton fanboys who have tried to argue that Princeton has no preppiness whatsoever which is clearly wrong. Did they see the same campus I saw. I went to several dining halls, residential colleges, and eating clubs and saw many, many students.</p>

<p>I'm not saying that most Princeton students are preppy, but the school definately has a more preppy culture than many of its peers.</p>

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<p>
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definately?

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</p>

<p>J. Crew is a only short walk. Whatya expect?</p>

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<p>This is just a hypothesis, but I think the preppy culture comes from Princeton, not from its students -- meaning, it's not because its students are all very blueblooded and summer in the Hamptons, etc. There are just lots of people in Polos and seersuckers, etc. because after a couple of months/years people start buying into the stereotype, so to say. It's a little contagious, the same way people start suddenly buying orange clothes when they never did before. (I'm one of them, I admit -- I just bought an orange polo shirt a few weeks ago because everyone at the ED reception was wearing orange and black, and I didn't own any orange! I felt un-spirited. :p)</p>

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<p>So... point is, lots of people in preppy clothes does not equal lots of preppies. In fact, the vast majority of Princeton's student body is probably anti-popped collar (according to Facebook, anyway.) If you visited Yale and Harvard as well, you'd have found that people are quite preppy-looking there's as well. (Yale, imo, is a bit of a visual anomaly -- guys wearing layer, popped Lacostes walking around in the streets of New Haven.)</p>

<p>Another possible reason is that the classic preppy look is probably better suited for school at these places. It looks nice but isn't too formal. Students generally develop far too much respect for their professors to be wearing skintight teeshirts that read "Hot Dog Eating Champion," etc. like what I often see girls wearing in high school these days.</p>

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<p>really? I get the sense that Princeton is particularly preppy... More so than other ivies (esp/ Yale and Brown, I suppose) because of the eating clubs etc...</p>

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<p>i exactly don't know what 'preppy' means. Does it pertain to the way that people dress? and if so, why does it carry a negative connotation (as it seems)?</p>

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<p>i like preppy :)</p>

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<p>Idamayer, have you been to Yale? ;)</p>

<p>Hello123, preppy often refers to people who went to a New England prep school, is WASP, was born into money, wears certain classic styles of clothing -- think Vivian Kensington (Selma Blair) in Legally Blonde. (Of course, not all of these need be true.)</p>

<p>The negative connotation comes from a perception that these people act richer/more superior-than-thou, and don't work hard because they have an easy lifestyle sailing and playing lacrosse, etc. Though some of this may be true for some preps, it generally won't be the case for those who are at HYP, etc because, we've seen, even people with a ton of legacy had to work extremely hard and be incredibly brilliant to get in.</p>

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<p>or you can read the Official Preppy Handbook. it provides a pretty good (and amusing picture) of what preppy means and where the term comes from.</p>

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<p>DiamondT, speaking as a loyal Princeton alumnus, I hope that the first part of your post mentioning that you “loved the place” is the best overall summation of your experience and I sincerely hope that you decide to come to Old Nassau. Congratulations on your additional acceptances (as I saw in an earlier post of yours) to Stanford (early), Amherst and Williams. You noted that you’ll be deciding among these four schools and you would likely have a wonderful experience at any of them. I do remember that you seemed to have a very strong impression of Princeton prior to your visit.</p>

<p><a href="http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/showpost.php?p=2147202&postcount=22%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/showpost.php?p=2147202&postcount=22&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p>

<p><a href="http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/showpost.php?p=1915949&postcount=22%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/showpost.php?p=1915949&postcount=22&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p>

<p>I hope that you went with an open mind. It’s easy for preconceptions to color later experiences. That having been said, I very much hope that you’ll decide to wear orange and black!</p>

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<p>you're at a school where a lot of kids are rich. preppiness isn't bad. at least the entire old guard of princeton hasn't been erased</p>

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<p>Diamond- So now you know, who’s telling the truth and who’s just denying things and trying to sweep things under the rug. Princeton has a tradition of preppy/snobby/elitist for a long time. And alas, the rich tradition is still alive and well.</p>

<p>no-poison-lady responded as,</p>

<p>“Princeton is not exclusive in having these type of kids. All the elite schools do”.</p>

<p>Of course they do. Every elite school, including “HYPSM”, shares a fair amount of preppy rich kids present in their student body, no doubt. The reason that P kids behaviors are so openly publicized and criticized is due to “eating clubs”, especially those bicker clubs. </p>

<p>In Princeton, due to its isolated location in central New Jersey, they are not many places to go for the social outlets in and around the campus. As a result, almost all social activities centered on the eating clubs, which is a nice breeding ground for “dumb jocks, and rich dumb legacies” flaunting their dad’s wealth and feeling good about themselves (in spite of their horrible academic performance). This tends to divide the student body. Imagine, while you’re working at the dinning hall to cover your text book cost, mopping floors, eating the left-over-specials from the buffet”. Those “privileged” are having a seated a-la-carte course meals (served by Jamaican waitresses), making a casual insensitive remarks on underprivileged. And they think they are OK doing those things due to its school spirit. I just shudder at the very thought of it. Shouldn’t you?</p>

<p>Look, I am not saying these despicable behaviors are only applicable to P. However, in Harvard, academic comes first, so rich kids also study hard, more often than not studying along with the less privileged and spend little time “flaunting their wealth”. In Yale, the liberal atmosphere, coupled with its indomitable school spirit, makes the flaunting unadvisable or moderated at least. In Stanford, those California weather and spirit melts student’s minds, and that tends to unite “the haves” and “the have-nots”. I have not seen any “significantly” bad report from MIT relating the issue. </p>

<p>So whether you like it or not, Princeton’s “eating club” is another “negative” for the cross-admits.</p>

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<p>[flame comment removed - Mod JEM]
There is a lower percentage of private-school grads enrolled at Princeton than at Yale. With Princeton's anti grade deflation policy and junior and senior thesis requirements it is definitely a challenging school, as you will see students stating all over these boards; no way does "flaunting" come before studying.</p>

<p>Having said that, I would agree that students at Princeton tend to be more clean-cut than at some other schools, though I would draw the contrast to Columbia and Brown, not with Harvard or Yale. </p>

<p>Why do you see pastel polos and sundresses on the Princeton campus? Well, first of all the weather in Princeton is milder than at any other Ivy, so the students are not all bundled up. Having visited recently myself I know that the flowering trees are in bloom everywhere. It's beautiful, and I think it's not a campus that inspires students to walk around in black with nose rings. There is joy in all that color. That said, you are quite likely to see students walking around in tee-shirts and pajama bottoms, dance clothes or athletic gear, and especially in Princeton hoodies and sweatpants. Just about every organization on campus gives out tee-shirts and the students love wearing them.</p>

<p>And there's fun and irony in dressing up as the stereotypical Princeton student. Some reported here that last year a very diverse group of students arranged themselves on a campus lawn during pre-frosh week, dressed very preppily and playing...was it badminton?...as a joke on visitors.</p>

<p>Glad to hear you enjoyed your visit. I wouldn't assume that the clothing you saw was any indication of a "culture." Congratulations on your admission and good luck with your decision.</p>

<p><a href="http://www.dailyprincetonian.com/archives/2004/02/24/opinion/9720.shtml%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://www.dailyprincetonian.com/archives/2004/02/24/opinion/9720.shtml&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p>

<p><a href="http://www.dailyprincetonian.com/archives/2005/09/23/opinion/13179.shtml%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://www.dailyprincetonian.com/archives/2005/09/23/opinion/13179.shtml&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p>

<p>"As a freshman, I came to Princeton having heard that I would be surrounded by a sea of snooty, elitist, beer-drinking sons and daughters of politicians...I have found this stereotype to be quite false. Lawnparties is the one time when it's acceptable for everyone to dress like a professional croquet player or, equivalently, to look like a complete douchebag. It's a sort of wonderful joke."</p>

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<p>OK. Yes it may be more preppy in appearance than Brown or Columbia. Yes it might be marginally more preppy in appearance than H or Y. Yes it is possibly marginally more conversative and focused on physical attractiveness then H or Y.</p>

<p>And? You want your pretention preppy or you want it Eurotrash? Each campus has their own slice of pretension. Pick and choose.</p>

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<p>If you happened to have rich parent, all powers to you. Go and jump on the P-wagon, and you will have a wonderful 4 year.</p>

<p>On the other hand, if you are from middle/lower family, I would advise "HSYM" or other top schools. Trust me you dont wanna spend 4 years in Princeton.</p>

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<p>Ex-Princetononian's Confessions</p>

<p>“ I enjoyed reading laughlinks' article and appreciate his/her point of view. I have another point of view and since it's always best for both sides to be presented, I thought it worthwhile to write.</p>

<p>First of all, I WAS a princeton student. However, I decided to leave the university after my sophomore year. Part of the reason was the eating club system, particularly the selective club system.</p>

<p>The selective clubs have a tremendous impact at Princeton because, though they are just 5 of 13 clubs, usually about twice as many students try to get into them as can. So essentially a great number of students get 'rejected'. This came into play in different ways. First, even though the 'bicker' process officially starts late in the sophomore year, it starts earlier than that socially. Second, alot of students have serious self-esteem issues after getting rejected at clubs. I was trained as a peer-to-peer counselor during my sophomore year and this issue came up more than any other single issue in the meetings. Personally I decided to leave Princeton and spend some time abroad. But I heard of social splits and fights between members of my friends over the eating club issue. In fact, someone I knew (not so well) even killed himself, and I heard 'on the grapevine' that part of it had to do with being rejected by the selective clubs. Of course, you can't blame the clubs for that - I'm sure there were other much more serious issues, but I'm sure the selective 'bicker' process put a big additional strain on him.</p>

<p>For me, the club system at Princeton is a mistake - I felt it systematically split the class up (selective or non-selective) and that the selective clubs especially have a great price. It was one of the reasons I chose to leave the school; I just felt it was an unethical system. I don't oppose fraternities or sororities, by the way, which are really external organizations to universities. But the club system at Princeton is very tightly fused into the very fabric of the school and in my view damages as much as it helps, and an old medical motto is 'First do no harm.' I feel it fails in that regard, regardless of the benefits.</p>

<p>Best,
Another View”</p>

<p>“ re: minorities, I just know that a good friend who was black didn't bicker and the rep was that most african americans didn't bicker, but I'm sure some do and I'm sure some do and get into the selective clubs. I remember examples.</p>

<p>re: why i didn't just go somewhere else to begin with, which someone brought up, when I applied to Princeton (Yes I did get into equally ranked or higher ranked schools believe it or not :-), I didn't realize how powerful and pervasive the eating club system was. it's something you don't feel until you are actually on campus.</p>

<p>In my social group, the guys with less self-esteem bickered. But in other social groups, almost everyone bickered. it depends on how you are situated. But it's a very dominant phenom on campus - are you going to try to get into a selective club and if so which? as I said, in my year about 2/3 tried and about half of those got rejected. In peer to peer counseling it just kept coming up again and again and again - and let me tell you - people were HURTING. They wouldn't show it on the 'street' but they were in serious pain inside. In my social group, the 'coolest' person was ethically against the selective clubs and in fact there was a fight between him and someone else about it. At the time, 3 of the selective clubs were 'all-guys' and he thought it was sexist besides being against the social selective process in general. I really admired that guy, he was supercool, smart, blah blah and could have gotten into Ivy and he thought it was all just a crock of ..., and he didn't want to hurt his friends or see them hurt by the process. A prince. Since then a woman bickered all 3 all-male clubs, got rejected, went to law school and SUED them to become co-ed, so now all clubs are co-ed. But she was roundly hated by the selective clubs during her tenure and after.</p>

<p>I'm actually socially CONSERVATIVE, by the way. I'm not a liberal. I like George W. Bush and Condee Rice. But I think the selective clubs are damaging emotionally to a substantial part of the student body. As a roommate of mine put it (who got into a selective club) - 'Its a DOG EAT DOG world out there - if I were born in Russia during the USSR, I'd be a card-carrying Communist'. Sure, in a sense he's right, it is survival of the fittest out there. I just hate to see 'survival of the socially fittest' as a social value at a leading institution like Princeton. Sort of defeats the higher purposes of this country.</p>

<p>Again, just my 2 cents, it's people's RIGHT to have these places, but it's not morally right (and I'm not sure it should be an embedded right at Princeton unless the majority support it, in which case, what can you do? Go to yale ...). Kind of like gossiping about your wife behind her back. Hey we all deserve freedom of speech, but when it hurts others (and they have the right to say BAD things about bickerees at some of the selective clubs, by the way, while their pictures are on the wall in front of the whole club) - when it hurts others, it ought to be seriously reconsidered. There are plenty of ways to have fun in this world without adding to the injury of our fellows. Again, first do no harm. If your parties suffer a little, it's worth it! Life isn't just about this world, but the next ...</p>

<p>BEST WISHES in your decisions,
Another view (an old ex-Princetonian)”</p>

<p>“ response </p>

<hr>

<p>Glad to hear your post, good luck to your daughter!
yeh, the residential college system was in place, but half of my RA group was figuring out how to bicker by the 2nd half of freshman year... it was like a social-survival TV Show over there. I asked to transfer to another college where I had a group of friends who weren't so into the clubs, but the university rejected me, saying you had to have 'medical reasons' to transfer colleges. If they had said 'yes' and I had been able to transfer with these other friends, I may have felt more insulated from the 'social wars' and stayed. I don't know ...</p>

<p>I did go back to visit princeton once. It was during a conference when I was an upperclassman somewhere else. beautiful place, truly, but I still had negative feelings because of the clubs, and especially because of the suicide of the acquaintance I had. That really did it for me. When I heard about that (I was abroad at the time) I just couldn't go back. He was a nice guy and I met him during Cane Spree athletic competitions between freshman and sophomores. I didn't know him well, but I felt we had a connection because we'd competed, and I really really felt for him and for his family.</p>

<p>My best friend in the world finished princeton and the clubs didn't affect him either (like you). he was very involved in various causes and extracurrics that were important to him and managed to rise above it. I guess I am just more of a sensitive soul than he is about these types of things. He's sort of the 'invincible type'.</p>

<p>Again, best wishes to your daughter and hope she has a great time!
anotherview”</p>

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<p>[flame removed - Mod JEM] two facts i've had to cite numerous times in response to such garbage: 1) princeton's freshman class has the highest percentage of students on financial aid of any school in the ivy league; 2) the princeton faculty is overwhelmingly liberal and the student body is liberal by a substantial but not overwhelming margin. search my previous posts for citations, if you really demand them. diamondt, good luck, and if you have any specific questions or concerns about princeton, air them here or by PM and i'll be happy to answer.</p>

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<p>How amusing that most of these condemning comments come from people who don't even go to school here (right now, not however many years ago, because the campus has changed rather markedly in the last couple of years from what upperclassmen tell me). I'm sorry, but to judge a school based upon the way people dress is a rather superficial form of judgment. I personally went to Yale and saw lots of polos and khakis back in the fall. Do I categorize it as a "preppy" school? No. What does that even mean anyway? An eating club is preppy because it is a mansion that allows all students to enter free of charge to dance and do what they please? Yes, people dress in polos, sundresses, seersuckers, etc. People also dress in sweats and t-shirts. Sometimes they walk out in their underwear. Really, I'd look elsewhere for a basis upon which to judge a school.</p>

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<p>I agree with philntex. Besides, Princeton is offering other alternatives to the eating clubs (the new Whitman college for example). By the time the Class of 2010 are juniors/seniors, the eating club fad will be, at least, in decline, imo.</p>

<p>WhetDreamWeaver: if f.scottie is a Princeton fanboy, then you should consider yourself a Princeton basher (also considering the fact that everytime Princeton is compared or talked about you always view it in a negative light, don't impose you're bad experiences on other people). If you were trying to point out the "truth", you would point out the good and the bad of Princeton not just the bad as you've been doing. Also, bringing up the bad reviews from studentsreview.com and totally overlooking the positive ones (which are in greater in number) proves my point. </p>

<p>On another note, it's not true that all kids who come from low-income families are mistreated. Yes, some are mistreated I've heard accounts of it, but on the other hand some aren't and love Princeton with every fiber of their being. It really depends on the type of person you are and how you handle those types of things.</p>

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<p>Anyone who would take WDW seriously should also consider the wisdom in his or her choice for CC username. Having said that WDW is weaving a web of weird untruths. Of course all elite schools have a small percentage of snooty kids. C'mon...even state schools are full of them.</p>

<p>Why not mention all the religious groups on campus where so many students worship and use as a social hub. Or the sports groups, a capella groups, dance and so on. The club thing is being way overblown.</p>

<p>It's funny I haven't heard one complaint from my son regarding this at all this year. He has been invited to bicker and sign-in clubs and never complained about how he was treated. We are not WASP's and not very rich at least in monetary terms.
If Byerly could conceive he would have WDW:)</p>