<p>I don’t think “Tuition and Fees” included Room and Board, which is more or less in the 10K range. So, Free Tuition and Free Ride is different.</p>
<p>Ucbalumnus- I apologize for misusing the term “middle class” but only did so to reflect that the UC’s have apparently categorized us as such as apparent by awarding my son the “middle class” scholarship (that is the actual name of the scholarship). While we may not be a true middle class family we are among that group who don’t qualify for aid but for whom it is a big stretch to pay for the UC’s outright. We have been fortunate that we have scrimped and saved for our children"a education and been able to get the 4 of them through with no loans. However a 28% increase in tuition in 5 years far outpaces the rate of inflation and would make it increasingly difficult for those “upper middle class” families who have not adequately saved to afford the UC’s. The days when my Dad was able to put himself through UCB while working and graduate with no loans are gone. </p>
<p>And yes our D did receive talent and merit scholarships at PSU which made it significantly more affordable than her original target school of UCLA. None of the UC’s had money to offer talent awards in her area. When it came down to it, the UCLA department had already significantly cut programs offered within the major because of budget cuts and was in danger of losing more during the period she would have been there. </p>
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<p>If you look at these FA scenarios, you will see that the UCs provide gift aid in amounts exceeding tuition and fees by about $8-10K: <a href=“http://admission.universityofcalifornia.edu/paying-for-uc/how-aid-works/student-scenarios/index.html”>http://admission.universityofcalifornia.edu/paying-for-uc/how-aid-works/student-scenarios/index.html</a> </p>
<p>How a student chooses to spend that extra $$ is up to him, I guess (?)</p>
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The UC also should count all family assets when considering FA application. Using the FAFSA alone is not enough. Many families with low paper income and high asset value receive FA now.</p>
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<p>I do agree that using FAFSA is NOT enough. Too many small business owners getting a totally free pass in that area. (And I think FAFSA shouldn’t exclude handle business ownership the way it does.). And NCP info should be required. It’s too easy in Calif to play games with who has custody in order to qualify for B&G…and yes I know a good number who play that game. </p>
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<p>Pricier states, like Calif, are going to have a looser definition of upper-middle class, simply because housing is so pricey there. A Calif household making $150 isn’t upper class at all. </p>
<p>And I agree that the no-merit-aid privates are also freezing out the upper-middles as well. </p>
<p>@Bay, I don’t think the math works for your assertion that if the UCs did not give fin aid for room and board, everyone can attend tuition-free (unless the online courses are supercheap and you propose to have most classes be online or something).</p>
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<p>I think we would need more information to know if it works or not.</p>
<p>If 55% of 100 students are paying no tuition, and 45% are paying the full $13,000 (and it is probably less than 45% because some of them are getting partial tuition FA, but for the sake of example I’ll assume all 45% are full-pay), that means the UCs need $585K in cash (what the 45% are paying) to cover tuition for all 100 students. If the UCs are also paying out $585K (or about $10K) to the no-payers for room/board/extras over tuition, then eliminating those extra payouts means they can cover everyone’s tuition. This is just a hypothetical, obviously, but it is not out of the realm of possibility that it could work.</p>
<p>We have seen 0 EFC UC students get about $20k in free money, with the rest of COA covered with Direct and Perkins loans, and work-study. Any small gap is likely personal expenses and transportation…which a student can cover with a summer job.</p>
<p>@mom2collegekids:</p>
<p>I just don’t see $13K tuition a year as freezing out the upper-middle class.</p>
<p>^^ That’s not the entire issue. UCs have pricey R&B so their COAs are over $30k. Which of course will increase with any proposed increases plus increases in R&B costs.</p>
<p>FA Allowance for R&B off campus at UC Davis is $10,000. You can easily get your own room in an apartment there for around $600 -$650. Many kids share rooms paying around $400. So $10000 is a very generous allowance,</p>
<p>@mom2collegekids:</p>
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<li><p>The UCs don’t have much control over R&B prices. Those are mostly due to CA real estate being expensive and CA being a high-cost place in general. If those kids weren’t attending a UC but living away from the parents, they’d be racking up comparatively higher costs as well, so I don’t see how you can blame the UCs for R&B costs.</p></li>
<li><p>I don’t see $30K as freezing out the upper-middle class either. As a percentage of income at the 90th percentile level, that’s still less than what privates costed 20 years ago, and the upper-middle class since then certainly didn’t feel the private elites were freezing them out as those schools have jacked up tuition tremendously yet the percentage of full-pays have stayed roughly constant at those schools.</p></li>
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<p>Other than Davis, there are still cheaper places for off campus rent, such as Riverside and Merced, some times rent in Irving are still feasible. The more expensive places are LA(Westwood) and Berkeley. Am considering a small house to purchase in Berkeley, rent, based on the realtor is around 2500, not too bad with three student sharing. The more expensive locations such as those near Palo Alto and San Francisco don’t have UCs there. On campus housing is obviously expensive, but off campus housing is not so bad.</p>
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<p>Sure they do. Each campus sets the price for its dorms and food service. And that is why off campus housing in Berkeley can be a lot cheaper than dorms.</p>
<p>(btw: the Units were built years ago. Its disingenuous for Cal to claim that local housing prices affect 50 year-old, concrete dorm buildings. And of course, that land was a whole lot cheaper back then.)</p>
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<p>And how many kids of cooperative divorced parents playing that game are there compared to kids of divorced parents where the NCP is unwilling to cooperate or contribute to the kid’s college?</p>
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Probably just as many as there are intact households where parents won’t pay…yet their info is required to determine aid. </p>
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<p>Is this really true? If so, apparently, there is a lot of fat in FA.
I do not mind paying for lower income families’ kids tuition.
But I really have problem with this kind of largesse, if it is true.
If my niece can live off campus at Berkeley for about $500 a month (which translate to $4500 for the school year), some kid at Davis should be able to do the same.</p>
<p>^^ Off campus living at $500/mo is $6000/year, you do have to pay rent all year round, unless you can sublet during the summer. Then what about food etc.? It does add up to $10,000. I was paying $1000/mo for my D in Chicago.</p>
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<p>Divorced parents are much more likely to be in poor financial condition, due to both having spent money on lawyers fighting each other, and having higher expenses maintaining two households instead of one. Plus, they are less likely to be cooperative (if the divorced parents hate each other, then the kid’s college funding will likely be a point of argument and instability).</p>
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<p>Including food?</p>
<p>Berkeley’s student budget for off-campus students is $7,112 for housing and $2,556 for food, for a total of $9,668 for the academic year. Among the cheaper off-campus housing options is the BSC co-ops, at $6,702 for the academic year including food.</p>
<p>Moving off-campus often means 12 month leases…so you’re not just paying for the school year. </p>
<p>@furrydog Does that $500 a month include electricity, water, internet, cable? Often those are extra costs. </p>