<p>Is this the type of job you need to take classes to prepare for? Or can you study independently (I’m aware the exams are rigorous and many, many hours are required) and take them on the side?</p>
<p>I’m a few years out of college but am looking at this as a possible career. I had a few math classes in college (up to linear equations) but did not major or minor in a math or business-related field.</p>
<p>“This is the type of job that is easily outsourced overseas.” </p>
<p>if you think about it, most jobs could be easily outsourced overseas. i don’t think you made your point unless you’re more specific.</p>
<p>^^ This is a job that is very math-statistics intensive (guess which countries are full of these people?) . It also does not require direct personal contacts. It can be done anywhere in the world.</p>
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You are darn right.</p>
<p>[Actuary</a> Salary Survey - actuary jobs - D.W. Simpson & Company, Inc. , actuarial, actuaries, Employment, Salaries, Insurance, Statistics, Mathematics, FCAS, ACAS, ASA, FSA, Student, FCIA, FIA](<a href=“http://www.dwsimpson.com/salary.html]Actuary”>Analytics and Actuarial Executive Search - DW Simpson)
here is the link to average salaries for actuaries starting out. Some companies like John Hancock accept undergrads who have taken at least one of the exams and help pay for the others. I think starting pay is like 48,000 but the exams are brutal. The more you pass the more money you make but it is easier said then done.</p>
<p>First off, I don’t know what legislation people think is going to reduce the need for actuaries. Regulation increases demand for actuaries. I’m not aware of anything in the upcoming financial regulation that reduces the number of required actuaries. The healthcare legislation would have increased the number of required actuaries as well - or, at least, increase the workload for the ones currently employed.</p>
<p>Secondly, this talk of outsourcing actuaries is mostly silliness. Credentialed actuaries are not technicians. They’re first and foremost businesspeople, and sending the whole department overseas makes sense so long as you send the rest of the business with it. Anyone whose goal is to sit in front of a computer 40 hours a week doing rote excel work should worry about their future. The rest of us are fine.</p>
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<p>Pure hilarity. Where do people get this stuff?</p>
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<p>The route to being an actuary is something like the following:</p>
<p>1) Have one or more degrees
2) Pass Exams
3) Get a job</p>
<p>Don’t spend too much time obsessing over the details of step 1. A good GPA is important. A quantitative degree helps a little (but is certainly not necessary). Employers won’t go far beyond that.</p>
<p>I dont think the thread title has been appropriately addressed. Theres lots of talk about the value of working as an actuary in this thread, but a degree in Actuarial Science isnt necessary to be an actuary. The question remains as to what value that degree has.</p>
<p>You can get a more complete view by reading the large number of threads on this topic at the ActuarialOutpost. Ill try to summarize.</p>
<p>The advantages of having a degree in Actuarial Science is include that it signals to an employer that this is what you intend to do (that you are serious about a career as an actuary). It may give more specific training that could be useful on the job. Most importantly, a structured program often has contacts that can help students get internships and jobs.</p>
<p>Having said that, I think the general feeling towards most actuarial science degrees is a bit negative (though keep in mind this may not apply to all universities).</p>
<p>While some employers posted on the AO that they appreciated the degree, most didnt seem to care much either way. Some even said that having a degree in actuarial science was a strike against a candidate! Almost everyone agrees that a better measure of whether a candidate is serious about the field is the number of tests theyve passed. Few, if any, posters suggested that candidates leaving an actuarial science program actually learned useful job skills there, though they sometimes noted that the classes helped candidates pass more tests.</p>
<p>The biggest problem (in my, and a number of others opinions) with an actuarial science degree is that it prepares a student for a career in actuarial science, and only that. Degrees in math, physics, engineering, financial mathematics or other quantitative areas leave students with a number of employment options, one of which is being an actuary. Dont underestimate the value of having options.</p>
<p>When considering an actuarial science program, look hard at what it will bring you. What is the placement rate for students? What is its relationship with employers (and which ones)? What are the test passing statistics? </p>
<p>The most important point you can get from this is that it isnt a simple equation of I want to be an actuary; I get a degree in actuarial science. Weigh your options, gather information and think critically.</p>
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<p>Sarcasm aside , this is totally not constructive. Explain yourself.</p>
<p>What needs explaining? Do the actuaries where you work seriously not have to deal with other people? Don’t get me wrong, I do my best to hide away in my cube some days, but this is a losing game. The less someone is a technician and the more they are an actuary the better their communication skills have to be.</p>
<p>Ultimately the job I do only has value because it is done for and presented to other human beings.</p>
<p>Emergent, you’re an actuary? How old are you? How many exams have you passed?</p>
<p>I’m most accurately described as an actuarial analyst - I think (some might disagree) to really be an actuary you need to be credentialled, and I’m probably a year from my ASA - a little less if things go well. I’m a career changer, so I’m older. I’ve passed P, FM, MLC and most recently MFE. </p>
<p>I strongly suggest [DW</a> Simpson’s FAQ list](<a href=“http://www.actuarialoutpost.com/actuarial_discussion_forum/showthread.php?t=9931]DW”>http://www.actuarialoutpost.com/actuarial_discussion_forum/showthread.php?t=9931) for people considering the degree. A look through the career forum there could be valuable as well - things are hard now for entry level people, but they could be (and have been) worse. DW’s salary survey is very good, too.</p>
<p>Not a good sign when you see a link for:</p>
<p>“Giving Up on Exams … ideas for other careers?” / “alternative jobs”</p>
<p>That depends on why those people gave up, whether you expect to have the same issues, and what the results of their future career change were.</p>
<p>Emergent, what city do you work in? Is your salary on the upper end or lower end of the DW Simpson survey (based on your age)?</p>
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How is that any different from the massive number of jobs that have been farmed out?</p>
<p>Because it’s completely different? </p>
<p>The reality is that the US has actually seen far fewer outsourced jobs than is typically played to in the media, and those that go are ones that are easily packaged, highly routine and require a minimum of management.</p>
<p>People have repeatedly professed the belief in this thread that actuarial work is easily outsourcible without actually showing any evidence its being outsourced or demonstrating any understanding of the profession.</p>
<p>The burden of providing evidentiary support just isn’t mine.</p>
<p>Lil<em>Wayne</em>Fan,</p>
<p>I think I fit into DW’s Salary pretty well. </p>
<p>There are two comments I’d like to make on DW’s Salary.</p>
<p>First, DW is often accused of padding the numbers to attract recruits. This problem with that argument is that DW needs to market to both sides of the table – they need to attract job seekers, but they also need to attract companies seeking employees. They have everything to lose by disappointing either side, and a lot to gain from being straightforward with their marketing.</p>
<p>Secondly, one important fact that I think is missing from the DW salary survey is the distribution for each cell. Claude has stated in the past that the low test/low experience cells are roughly normal in shape, but the more advanced cells tend to pick up a right skew. That’s critical in understanding what most advanced actuaries actually make – you can’t just jump to the half way point between the 10% and 90%.</p>
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Huge portions of R&D departments have been farmed out. It’s literally like you have no clue about the semi-conductor industry or something.</p>
<p>Funny enough, I do.</p>
<p>Did I mention I was a career changer?</p>
<p>;)</p>
<p>There are some very serious issues facing people getting a science degree - especially those going into solid state/condensed matter physics in industry. As the only person in this thread so far who has both a hard science and actuarial work background, I can tell you that the issues are very different.</p>
<p>Now, it’s possible they become more similar in the future. My crystal ball becomes increasingly dim as we reach out beyond 5 years. I hold strongly to and earlier statement I made:</p>
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