<p>Somehow I missed that you lived in Calif. - sillly me.</p>
<p>I tend to agree with Sylvan, except that I’m one of those naturally risk-averse people who always likes to have a Plan B. Sounds like UC fits the bill pretty nicely. The application process is pretty straightforward. I would encourage him to apply to a couple of other UC’s besides just UCSD, especially if he isn’t crazy about the campus (my kids weren’t either). For all that Cal and UCLA are giant, they at least have the depth in math, physics, and engineering that he’ll be looking for. And a lot can change with him in 9 months. The kid who starts out the fall not wanting to go to a big state uni can have a change of heart by next spring. It’s one application; he just clicks the box by each UC campus that he wants to apply to and pays an extra $60, so there’s no time or emotional investment in applying to additional campuses. Those 3 schools don’t really fit the definition of safety except that you can look at the grades and test scores of this year’s entering class and have a pretty good idea of whether he’ll be admitted or not. As opposed to private uni’s, where the admissions process is a lot more “black box.” </p>
<p>The other strategy that worked well for my kids was to apply early to their top choice school. I’m not a fan of applying binding ED, especially if cost is a concern, because it locks a kid into a choice that might not be appropriate 6-8 months later, and it can lead to real financial issues later on. My kids both applied SCEA, and it worked well for them. For my younger, it was truly his top choice, and when he was accepted in Dec. he was done - decision made. For my older, it was her top choice until her bf broke up with her (nothing like combining teen hormones with the college app process), and she later ended up making the agonizing decision to go to School B. However, it made the application process much simpler for both kids, as they only applied to schools that had an application deadline prior to when they would hear from their SCEA school (and in my older’s case, School B - after the breakup). There’s a huge risk to applying early, which is that if he doesn’t get in he’ll only have about 3 weeks to submit his other apps, and he’ll be feeling pretty dejected. For that reason he needs to have a very clear list of schools that he’s going to apply to if his top choice rejects or defers him. If he doesn’t have a clear top choice, then he might want to consider applying early to schools that have unrestricted early action, just so that if he gets in he doesn’t have to bother applying to the schools on his list that he’s not as interested in.</p>
<p>This strategy only works if he’s had a chance to investigate his list pretty thoroughly, which might mean making some visits if you can swing it financially. In particular I’d recommend that you visit MIT, as I think it might change his mind about tech schools.</p>
<p>Ask DS to explore the breadth requirement at his college. At least at DD’s college the core curriculumn, including the following 18 courses
, is so comprehensive that you can delay the ** major decision as late as 4th semester ** and still graduate in time.</p>
<p>At DD’s college one can take Economics as a concentration, minor or a major. So if the similar arrangement possible at your DS college then it might make sense to take Economics related classes in 2nd semester along with some EE pre-requisite. If he decides to continue on EE path he can move Economics to a concentration or minor. If he doesn’t like EE then he can continue on to his Economics major.</p>
<p>POIH…I’m a little confused. If a student is an engineering major, in many cases Chemistry, Biology, Physics, Calculus (and all the labs you have listed) are included in the major.</p>
<p>What is a “restrictive elective” ? At my daughter’s school, that was an elective within the major field.</p>
<p>Does that “8” mean eight credits…because if it does…that means that for a STEM major at your daughter’s school, only 8 credits of non-stem courses are considered core.</p>
<p>At my daughter’s school, they had an 8 COURSE core course requirement that included courses in the humanities, arts, social sciences, history, scienced/math, religion.</p>
<p>^^^: The General Institute Requirements at DD’s college including those 18 courses are required by everyone including any humanities major.</p>
<p>Some requirements as you listed might overlap with major requirements specially with engineering/Physics majors.</p>
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Restrictive Electives can also be from major related or can provide a little more breadth depending on how a student wants to progress.</p>
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<p>There are 8 courses (One per semester) restriction on the humanities courses, that’s why it is sometime joked there that one learn more humanities than a humanities major. Each student have to pick one area of humanities to concentrate in (at least 3 courses).</p>
<p>As stated above…even within the same field of engineering, jobs vary a lot. In fact, endless possibility (some more techie than others). </p>
<p>DH and I both did MechE at a techie-centric college. We’ve studied and worked with a variety of engineers. Still we didn’t feel like we knew what type our kids were best suited for. (LOL - that’s probably why they both started as Undecided Engineering / MechE default plan. One eventually switched to Econ, and the other is now leaning toward Computer Engineering). </p>
<p>In general, my thought is that engineer=problem solver (with tolerance for a very heavy load of problem-sets homework in college).</p>
<p>I’ll discuss what you say about applying to other UC schools. UCSB was on the list once because of their CCS program as we understood that the physics dept. at UCSB was terrific and they were very response to emails, etc. However, it does seem like a big party school and he wasn’t so sure about it. My son has one friend at church interested in UCLA as a transfer student so maybe they can talk. I think both UCLA and USC are interesting schools…You’re right. He could feel differently in 9 months! </p>
<p>For now, he’ll stick with his original list and he’ll apply SCEA to a school and the rest, obviously, RD. </p>
<p>We are waiting to hear from MIT for a special visitation weekend in September. He’s accepted and he applied for some travel assistance but he hasn’t heard back from them so I don’t know what’s going on there. We would like to try and visit Stanford in the late summer/early fall. He’s not visited Vanderbilt, Davidson, WUSTL or UTD but time and money won’t allow it most likely.</p>
<p>For now, it looks like the list of schools is 10 with most being reaches, unfortunately. I don’t really know what a match is anymore since college admissions are so fierce. I’d like to say schools like Davidson and UCSD would be matches but who knows.</p>
<p>I have read many posts saying it’s easier to switch out of engineering than into it-we are convinced. But it’s too late, my son is a rising sophomore at a small liberal arts college. He now wants engineering but he did not opt for his freshman year start of 3+2 program. He had solid freshman year (3.67) but no math. He wants to switch his major to physics. What would that do for him? Would he be able to use physics major to qualify him for masters in engineering?</p>
<p>We need more information, providence. Does the LAC your S is at have courses in Statics Strength of Materials and Thermodynamics? Do they have a full-fledged physics major? What type of engineering is S interested in? what motivates the switch in majors?</p>
<p>Your son should probably speak to his advisor, or an engineering program advisor if available. He can find out how to catch up on his courses. I’m not sure why he would want to switch to physics…why doesn’t he just transfer to the engineering 3+2 program? He will be “less behind” in a 3+2 program than a traditional 4-year engineering program.</p>
<p>^^^^ Be careful with assuming that it is easier to switch out of engineering than switch into engineering. There are at least some colleges where this is NOT the case. Case in point is Columbia University. It was one of my D’s top choices, but ultimately she turned it down. We had spoken to several people who told us that it was difficult to switch out of SEAS into the College. My D is planning engineering as a major, but who knows what may happen? So, she changes her mind next year and can’t switch out (or even has to stress about whether or not she will be permitted to make the switch)? No thanks!</p>
<p>providence, An engineering program has some very specific classes, like the stength of materials class mentioned previously. You won’t get these in a physics program. If he wants to do engineering, get into that program ASAP. The longer you wait, teh further behind you are.</p>
<p>Freshman year is typically spent in most STEM type majors getting the basics down and won’t vary a lot. So, he probably isn’t too far behind. HOWEVER, THE MOST IMPORTANT basic class is the MATH. After all, what is engineering really!! It is being able to model physical systems mathmatically. Then using that math model to validate past behavior and predict future behavior. Therefore, you need to understand the physical systems AND have the math background (thru differential equations at least) to model them.</p>
<p>@providence12345 - I think your son’s best route into engineering, from a LAC, is go ahead and switch to Physics and do well. In Physics, he will have to catch up in Math anyway. Then if he does well enough, grad school in engineering with no loss of time. Two of the best engineers I know did BS Physics from a LAC, then MS EE in one case, PhD EE in the other case.</p>
<p>Not a big fan of the 3+2 programs. You end up with two BS/BA degrees. The BS/BA plus MS/ME is more useful in a career.</p>
<p>Strength of Materials is just a general sophomore-junior engineering course. Anyone with a Physics or Chemistry degree has no trouble picking up what they need from that later on. Engineers are trained to learn and keep current, not just spit back material that was “covered” in class.</p>
It would depend on where he wants to attend grad school and in which field. Some schools and some fields require the undergrad degree to be in the same field. I can’t really imagine someone getting a graduate degree in structural engineering without an undergrad degree in civil engineering. They should definitely not just assume the S can get from A to B without researching it carefully first.</p>
<p>providence12345, I’m glad to see someone else sorting this out, my son is in a similar situation as I posted up thread. From what I’ve been able to figure out, physics is the way to go if your headed for a masters in engineering. I’ve been pouring over the websites at UC Berkeley and Stanford graduate engineering programs and they say depending on a students undergraduate major it may be as few as one semester, but probably two (or more) semesters, to take the prerequisite engineering courses before continuing on to masters work. So it looks like a 7 year road to an engineering masters but once you get there, a masters gives you more options.</p>
<p>Does have have any calculus from high school? Nevertheless, he is probably at least a semester behind for the physics major if he has not taken any physics (for physics majors) courses, and probably two semesters behind if he has no calculus.</p>
<p>It may be possible to cram a physics major into six semesters (or nine quarters) if he carefully maps the prerequisites of the required courses, and there is no (remaining) prerequisite chain that is longer than that.</p>
<p>providence12345: I suggest you look at some appplications for graduate school requirements for engineering. Unless things has changed, one of the requirement is that you need an undergraduate degree in engineering or undergraduate degree but you will have to take certain pre-requisits before allowed to take graduate level classes. These pre-requisits typical are the fundamental undergraduate engineering classes, and to enroll in these classes, there may also be pre-requists unless waived by the dean.</p>
<p>No, many highly reputable Schools of Engineering do not require an engineering bachelor’s for admission to the graduate MS program. There are several anecdotes on CC about Math and Physics majors earning an engineering MS. Of course the length of the MS program will vary depending on the specific coursework/preparation completed in the BS.</p>