<p>^^not true at all colleges. BC and Notre Dame consider Asians URMs.</p>
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<p>Enjoy reading through the first dozen or two posts in this FAQ thread, into which your question, always of interest at this time of year, was merged. The short answer is that every college gets to decide what students it wants to target for recruitment (within the limits of state law for state universities) and few colleges specify with exactitude what kind of students get the biggest boost, all other things being equal, when applying.</p>
<p>I was wondering if I qualify to put African American? I am actually one fourth Egyptian. My question isnt whether being egypian counts as african, my question is if being one fourth African qualifies?</p>
<p>not at all</p>
<p>“African American” refers to Americans who are of black African descent. Are you?</p>
<p>I am one fourth Egyptian, which IS a country in Africa. How “african” does one need to be? Does it need to be full?</p>
<p>Mark all that apply.</p>
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<p>In the usual case, that would mean that you are “white.” See the FAQ posts at the beginning of this thread into which your question was merged. This question comes up every admission season.</p>
<p>A news story on an allegation of civil rights violations in a public school district: </p>
<p>[Asian</a> advocates plan federal complaint after school attacks on Philly students | StarTribune.com](<a href=“http://www.startribune.com/nation/79123432.html?elr=KArks:DCiUMEaPc:UiD3aPc:_Yyc:aUU]Asian”>http://www.startribune.com/nation/79123432.html?elr=KArks:DCiUMEaPc:UiD3aPc:_Yyc:aUU)</p>
<p>The article cited in post 291 is an important story. It also has absolutely nothing to do with college admissions. </p>
<p>(Hint: Not every civil rights complaint is related to college admissions.) There’s absolutely no reason for this story to be on this thread. Off-topic.</p>
<p>It sounds like some high school students in Philadelphia, if the reported problems </p>
<p>[City</a> sets up meeting to mediate school ethnic tensions | Philadelphia Inquirer | 12/13/2009](<a href=“http://www.philly.com/philly/news/local/79150522.html]City”>http://www.philly.com/philly/news/local/79150522.html) </p>
<p>are factually correct, can–if they apply to college–write in college essays and otherwise show in their applications that their high school context was rather different from that encountered in my town routinely. That’s something every college applicant should do: make clear what is different about the applicant’s local context from what might be most familiar to a college admission committee.</p>
<p>I understand how diversity in the student body is important for a student’s development . However, I thought “underrepresented minority” meant someone who did not have the same "advantages and resources ", and is thus under represented…many of the URMs list their families’ incomes as $100,000 /yr ! These kids from well heeled high schools are getting into the Ivies and top colleges by saying that their maternal grandmothers were part minority, ( under represented ) , but they are just as “whitebread” as all the caucasians and asians in their high schools. I feel this leads to an unfair advantage. How is this fair?</p>
<p>" I thought “underrepresented minority” meant someone who did not have the same "advantages and resources "</p>
<p>That’s not what “URM” means. It means people in racial and ethnic groups that are underrepresented in colleges compared to their proportion in the U.S. population.</p>
<p>There are a number of other similar threads on these boards, and the theme is always the same. Hopefully the schools with holistic evaluation processes will ferret out the kids trying to use the “hook” without having experienced any hardship whatever. There are many threads with the same taint of bitterness about athletes, musicians, and even males who get slots that would have been better suited for the poster or the poster’s child.</p>
<p>Schools can select who they want for their slots, and people will always try to find a way in. OP, our D is URM, and yes, my family income is right around 6 figures. I was a HS dropout who worked like a dog to provide for my family, and give them the opportunities not afforded me. My children open-enrolled into schools further from our home, because the opportunities there were better than in neighborhood schools. As a trade-off for those opportunities, they were sometimes met with the notion that they weren’t quite as smart as their peers. There was one occasion when my daughter tested extremely high on a math screening exam, and the principal seemed shocked. Their dad picked tomatoes and eventually landed a civil service job. The only reason I mention this is because current annual income doesn’t always tell the whole story.</p>
<p>Of course, things make so much more sense when you factor in context, no?</p>
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<p>The last time someone I personally know did that, she got into the school of her dreams. Even if it were just correlation as opposed to causation, it can’t hurt.</p>
<p>I disagree about equating musicians , and athletes,to URMs those students have something to bring to the table, that they worked at, and is a real accomplishment. Schools do not ferret out the kids who weasel their way in on the basis of a name…I can say U Chicago was happy to admit someone who used her surname, to cover up C’s and 600 SATs…and she was roundly rejected at Johns Hopkins … UChicago knew the difficulty in getting URMs of any social strata, so they blindly fulfilled their quota. Even ifthe student is really from a disadvantaged URM, I feel this is unfair. It creates ill will ( admit it ) among those who suffer from this discrimination, and by lowering the bar for URMs, you are fostering poor academic quality in minorities as well, URMs are being lulled into a false sense of security. I feel it is patently unfair to discriminate against ANY race. how would you feel if your child consistently got As, 750s, was first chair in orchestra, had an art portfolio, went to an urban magnet school, and still got rejected from the top schools, while posters who are urms freely post 600 SATs , no AP courses, ranked #100/300, and gleefully post that they were ACCEPTED into Harvard, Yale, Princeton…isn’t there something wrong there?Why are we floundering as a nation…#40 in the world, in 8th grade science achievement </p>
<p>Please don’t trade stories about whose parents picked tomatoes, or which HS dropout parent worked like a dog, those stories abound among the non- URM applicants as well. The japanese americans weren’t discriminated against? The chinese of “chinatown” were treated equally and fairly ? </p>
<p>Asians don’t make a big deal out of complaining. They just work harder when faced with adversity. Seems that doesn’t cut it for the 21st century United States.</p>
<p>“There are a number of other similar threads on these boards, and the theme is always the same. Hopefully the schools with holistic evaluation processes will ferret out the kids trying to use the “hook” without having experienced any hardship whatever. There are many threads with the same taint of bitterness about athletes, musicians, and even males who get slots that would have been better suited for the poster or the poster’s child.”</p>
<p>Again: Colleges aren’t assuming that all URMs have had some kind of financial hardship. They are trying to build college communities that are reflective of the racial and ethnic diversity of America as a whole.</p>
<p>That’s also why the colleges that care about such things try to attract students from all 50 states, a variety of countries, religions, etc. Those colleges also view an important part of the college experience as getting to know people who are different from oneself, something that’s much easier to do in college – due to the clubs and living situations there – than it is for most people to do afterward.</p>
<p>GBJ: about 80% or so of American universities (and most non-US ones too) practice admissions exactly in the spirit in which you describe: metrics only. If an applicant meets a certain criteria, he/she is admitted.</p>
<p>However, when you venture into LACs and other privates (who happen to populate the so-called “top 25” list), then you’re speaking of schools that put forth effort into molding together fairly specific student bodies. The fact that some people may not like how they populate their freshmen classes is only a problem because they happen to hold one of those top 25 slots. </p>
<p>The fact is if one doesn’t want to play according to their rules (regardless of how fair/unfair you or I deem the rules to be), there are plenty of colleges willing to welcome in these top performing students. They aren’t bound to change for you or me, or anyone except their own constituency (Trustees, alumni, faculty, administration, students).</p>
<p>By the way, your line of argument is one of the most repeated conversations here on CC. If you do a search on “affirmative action”, you’ll run across a legion of pro/con arguments. Some to bolster yours, some to refute yours.</p>
<p>I would do everything in my power to prevent my HYP alma mater from switching to a metrics-only based admissions. It would alter the fundamental character of a great institution. I’m Asian too, BTW.</p>
<p>T26E4,</p>
<p>Could you provide a reference for your 80% claim? The top 25 universities actually represent probably 5% of American colleges, so there’s 15% missing…</p>
<p>Nevertheless, having a metrics based system should be across the board, not just 80 %. I want it 100%. I find that there is an intrinsically distasteful quality to minority admissions, specifically wrt URMs. I understand about trying to mold the student body, preferentially admitting a student with a skill , i.e., in an athlete, I can assume teamwork, in musicians , creativity can be assumed , but tell me, what particular characteristic are you adding to the student body by preferentially admitting an URM? In today’s increasingly globalized world of political correctness, there certainly isn’t a particular cultural trait you could single out… Let’s assume that schools do go to a metrics only system… So what if HYP becomes >50% “asian”…I think 50% “asian” would be more representative of the world anyway. Maybe not of the US…but we as a country are lagging the world.</p>
<p>What is the “fundamental nature of a great institution”? anyway? How far back is “fundamental”? … in the 1940s when Harvard openly practiced anti semitism? Minority favored admissions is not fundamental by any stretch of the imagination,to any Ivy league institution.</p>
<p>And I’m afraid your being asian doesn’t lend any more credence to your view than my being asian lends to my view. …Asians have long been antagonistic of the other anyway, so your being asian , and favoring a pro minority biased admissions process is not any kind of argument in favor of URMs.</p>
<p>How odd that this system exists in a country that prides itself on “fairness” and equality … our President can freely go to China, and on their turf, lecture them about their human rights abuses. He should look in his own backyard.</p>
<p>My views on the destructiveness of this bias against URMs are shared by many of our constitutional interpreters, the supreme court justices.</p>
<p>Our country prides itself on equality, but equality doesn’t really exist in the world. Is it fair that certain kids have no opportunity to attend those private magnet schools, or even access to an orchestral instrument, or go to a school that has AP classes that you so callously mentioned? No, it isn’t fair, and you are trying to apply meritocratic principles to a system that is not a meritocracy.</p>