Rank the Ivy CAS's

College Search & Selection
21

<p>truazn8948532, there is no evidence that Penn "yield protects", other than its use of ED, which is comparable to that of several other Ivies (actually identitcal to Princeton's, which of course will end this coming year). Penn's RD yield is about 50%--comparable to other Ivies--and would be significantly higher if Penn was "yield protecting" in its RD admissions.</p>

<p>Also, your Penn CAS admit rate estimate is too high. While the Wharton admit rate is lower than the total Penn admit rate of 15.9%, the SEAS and Nursing rates are higher, and the CAS rate tends to be at or below the overall admit rate (i.e., 15.9% or lower).</p>

<p>
[quote]
In fact, just 10-13 years ago Penn was ranked #15-16 on USNews before it revamped its admissions practices which despite the fact that many consider these changes to be controversial, has done wonders for its prestige.

[/quote]

10-13 years ago, Penn was actually #11-13:</p>

<p><a href="http://chronicle.com/stats/usnews/index.php?category=Universities&orgs=&sort=2007%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://chronicle.com/stats/usnews/index.php?category=Universities&orgs=&sort=2007&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p>

<p>And it wasn't merely a revamping of admissions practices that contributed to Penn's rise--there was also sigificant investment in the surrounding neighborhood, substantial increases in research funding, rapid growth of endowment, introduction of a college house system and other significant enhancements of undergraduate education, etc.</p>

22

<p>"but it does speak as to the University's desirability and aggregate talent of the student body."</p>

<p>Not really.... yield protection and small class sizes give a high yield. If Cornell accepted a larger number of its ED applicants (heck, say even 100%), and had a smaller freshman class, then its yield would rise, plain and simple.</p>

<p>The "talent" of the student body (as measured by SAT scores) would almost certainly drop, even while the yield rises. Thus, in such a case, a higher yield would give Cornell CAS a LESS statistically accomplished student body.</p>

23

<p>I do not know a single person who has a realistic chance at HYP Columbia Penn that has ever applied Cornell ED. How many IMO, USAMO, 4.0, 2400's can you name that has ever applied early to Cornell? </p>

<p>Like I said-- there are those that has their Cornell as #1. But most top tiered students WILL NOT ED to Cornell.</p>

24

<p>"I do not know a single person who has a realistic chance at HYP Columbia Penn that has ever applied Cornell ED."</p>

<p>-So your limited knowledge of Cornell's applicants is some how proof of your claims? How do you know if a person has a "realstic" chance at HYP, Columbia, or Penn? Are you saying that ALL people who could get into HYP, Columbia, or Penn could get into Cornell? </p>

<p>"How many IMO, USAMO, 4.0, 2400's can you name that has ever applied early to Cornell?"</p>

<p>-I don't work in a Cornell admissions office, so I have no idea. I'd say the same thing about most any other school. Are you actually saying that you KNOW that people with said stats DON'T apply to Cornell early?</p>

<p>"Like I said-- there are those that has their Cornell as #1. But most top tiered students WILL NOT ED to Cornell."</p>

<p>-No matter how many times you say it it doesn't make it true. By the way, what the heck is a "top tiered" student anyway? </p>

<p>Also, what does any of this have to do with the fact that:</p>

<p>"If Cornell accepted a larger number of its ED applicants (heck, say even 100%), and had a smaller freshman class, then its yield would rise, plain and simple."</p>

<p>All I want you to see is that your conclusion that higher yield = more desired is flawed. You seem to say: "gee, HYP have high yields and are good/desired schools, THUS higher yields equal better/more desired schools", and this sort of conclusion is way off-base to me.</p>

25

<p>In terms of reputation:</p>

<ol>
<li>Harvard, Yale, Princeton</li>
<li>Columbia, Dartmouth, Penn, Brown</li>
<li>Cornell</li>
</ol>

<p>Quality of education
1. Yale, Princeton, Dartmouth
2. Harvard, Columbia
3. Penn, Brown
4. Cornell</p>

26

<p>"Quality of education
1. Yale, Princeton, Dartmouth
2. Harvard, Columbia
3. Penn, Brown
4. Cornell'</p>

<p>-I find it funny that everything you do seems to be an attempt to compare Dartmouth with HYP....</p>

27

<p>In what way does one compare the quality of education at the CAS' of different ivies? Is there some metric that I'm unaware of? Aren't we just splitting hairs for the sake of making one feel better about their own school?</p>

28

<p>Well obviously Cornell CAS is the 'least' desirable OF THE IVIES. I mean after all, if you could automatically go into any of them, would you choose Cornell over Harvard, Yale, Princeton, Columbia, Upenn, and all the rest? I think not</p>

29

<p>I would choose Cornell over Penn and give Dartmouth a run for its money.</p>

<p>And since when does desirability = quality of education? The point of this thread is to rank the ivies CAS - if you wish to do that by desirability, so be it, but don't confuse it with the quality of education.</p>

30

<p>
[quote]
In what way does one compare the quality of education at the CAS' of different ivies? Is there some metric that I'm unaware of? Aren't we just splitting hairs for the sake of making one feel better about their own school?

[/quote]
</p>

<p>I tend to agree with brand on this one. I normally agree with Slipper on most issues, but I think splitting up the Quality of Education of the Ivy CAS' into 4 tiers is a bit much.</p>

<p>Given the inherent undergraduate focus at the LAC-like Ivies, I'd give the nod to Princeton, Dartmouth and Brown overall -- though all of them will provide outstanding educational experiences.</p>

<p>Grad school is a different story. Harvard, Yale and Wharton (UPenn) all the way.</p>

31

<p>I chose it over Yale, Princeton and Columbia (and Dartmouth), did not bother to apply to Penn (and I was waitlisted at Harvard, which I made up for somewhat by going to law school there)...and Cornell Arts and Sciences admit rate is now about 13%, well in the range of the other Ivies. I do think Cornell is not for everyone, but it is an excellent choice for a student who wants to be in the most economically and socially diverse school in the Ivies, in a beautiful setting, with more course offerings than any other school in the Ivies, and with what is now the best varsity sports program in the league.</p>

32

<p>columbiahopeful! - you are just a ****ed off ex-cornell student who couldn't make 30 facebook friends in a year at the school (really, I've seen his facebook profile). You're still miserable and it makes me oh so delighted! </p>

<p>" "How many IMO, USAMO, 4.0, 2400's can you name that has ever applied early to Cornell?"</p>

<p>-I don't work in a Cornell admissions office, so I have no idea. "</p>

<p>I work in a Cornell admissions office!! They get a solid number of 2350+ 4.0 students, and I find it humorous that some of them really are rejected. As one of my bosses told me "the real story lies with who we reject - not who we accept".</p>

33

<p>It amazes me how, despite not having a single ounce of experience with most of the Ivies, people can so definitively rank them in terms of "quality of education." Wow.</p>

34

<p>(I've attended two Ivies). </p>

<p>The reason I put Dartmouth with Yale and Princeton for undergrad education is based on endowment/student, spending per student (Dartmouth is the highest spending Ivy by a significant margin), undergrad focus, etc. Princeton excels in these areas and Yale tends to have a strong undergrad focus as well. Cornell is more of a "research university" in the same basic archetype as a place like Cal. So it excels in some areas but loses in others.</p>

35

<p>"It amazes me how, despite not having a single ounce of experience with most of the Ivies, people can so definitively rank them in terms of 'quality of education.' Wow."</p>

<p>People here are incredibly stupid, nevermind the "ivy degrees" ... usually they can't see past their big deluxe edition diploma covers to see the real truth in the issues. Case in point - this thread.</p>

36

<p>The SAT range for Cornell CAS is 1310-1510, which is 20-30 points below Brown, 40-50 points below Dartmouth. I don't know what the SAT ranges are in the other Ivies.</p>

<p>A 20-30 point SAT difference is like the difference between Harvard and Stanford.</p>

<p>A 40-50 SAT difference is roughly the difference between Harvard and Penn.</p>

<p>However, I think the Cornell-bashers in this thread need medication more than they need information.</p>

37

<p>By the way, the combined A&S/Engineering SAT range at Cornell is almost exactly the same as Penn's overall SAT. And, I suspect the SATs at Wharton bring up Penn's overall but I am not sure. Cornell does not have a large Business College.</p>

38

<p>So we've determined that Cornell has the lowest yield. Why does cornell have such a low yield - why is it so undesirable compared to the other schools? Could quality of education be a factor (despite the negligible difference?). If not why is Cornell less prestigious?</p>

39

<p>40% yield is not low. Schools with comparable yields include:</p>

<p>Duke, Northwestern, Wesleyan, NYU to name a few.</p>

40

<p>Cornell recieves by far the most applications in the Ivy League - the schools' peer assessment score is better than half the ivy's out there, and its individual programs are insistently at the top .... buuuut it's a big school that's in a quaint town (the cities are popular now). </p>

<p>Even then, the yield difference is WAY overblown here. Does anybody have the stats for yield at all of the ivy's. Also, Cornell's overall yield is near 50%.</p>