<p>Is it normal for a student to see a teacher rec before that teacher sends it off, or do students in most cases have no idea what a teacher wrote for the rec.</p>
<p>I am going to ask my AP Stats teacher/math team coach and AP Spanish teacher for recs but I was wondering what is the proper procedure/rule. I want to know how well the recommendation is because I have another teacher (APUSH teacher) that I can ask.</p>
<p>You ask before the teacher writes the recommendation: "Would you be willing to write a strong, positive recommendation for me?" If not, move on. If so, you may or may not see it before it's mailed. That's up to the teacher. </p>
<p>In no event should you see the letter in order to decide if it's "good enough" so that you can choose someone else if it's not. That's insulting to the teacher, wastes his or her time, and doesn't give the "second choice" teacher sufficient time to write his or her recommendation.</p>
<p>The only real requirement is that the teacher knows you well enough and likes you in my opinion. When I ask for recommendations, I never say "positive" but just ask for a recommendation. </p>
<p>I've never asked to see the letter either, and you're not supposed to in my opinion. Usually they're supposed to mail it directly to the college, right?
If you're asking someone for a req, you should trust him or her enough to know that they would say something positive. And most teachers will unless they really hate you or are really honest. Teachers want to see their students go places.</p>
<p>You should see if there are any specific anecdotes that the teacher can include that back up the general positive remarks. Maybe in your talk, say "I remember when I was able to do project X in your class"</p>
<p>Also, it's bad manners to proofread the recs. You'd be seen as such.</p>
<p>You cannot see the rec before it is sent off. If you read a rec, it is not considered by colleges to be an official rec, and you'll have to get a new one if they found out. Ask the people who you think will write you the best recommendations and do not ask to look at them; it's poor taste since it is strictly not allowed by colleges. If you have a maximum number of recommendations that can be sent to schools, then chose based on what you know now.</p>
<p>Also, type up a sheet explaning your activities over your high school years. This will give the writers a chance to see who you are outside the classroom and see the background from your achievements, as well as giving them something to write about that expands upon you for the colleges.</p>
<p>You should ask the teachers that you TRUST to write a good rec, so that you don't have to worry about anything. If you have to ask them if they will write a rec or to proofread it than that rec is simply not going to be nearly as good as a teacher that you have a relationship with that you don't even need to question their abilities.</p>
<p>
[quote]
You cannot see the rec before it is sent off. If you read a rec, it is not considered by colleges to be an official rec, and you'll have to get a new one if they found out.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>Not true. You check off the box that says that you waive your right to see the recommendations. That just means that you cannot demand of the college to show it to you. If the teacher does show it to you, of his/her own free will, that's fine.</p>
<p>My d's favorite teacher left at the end of her junior year. He wrote the recommendation letter and gave it to her before he left. She put it in the appropriate envelopes and sent it out. It was just as "official" as any other recommendation.</p>
<p>Chedva, I believe for most colleges that is not the case. This is the reason that recommendations must be sealed to show that they have not been opened. If your daughter was able to put it in an envelope herself, close the envelope the normal way, and have her rec count, she chose the right colleges to do that to. For many (most?) that won't work.</p>
<p>I've never heard of that - can you identify a school that requires this sealing? Or that will not permit a recommendation that the student has read?</p>
<p>Chedva, theres really no need to identify.</p>
<p>Any school that provides a special envelope that you give to your reccomendors is obviously a school that doesn't want the school reading the letter and doesn't want the student mailing it off</p>
<p>If you read Columbia's application, they provide you with the option to have your reccomenders do it online or by mail. Obviously if they are providing the reccomenders with envelopes then that means they don't want the student reading it or mailing it</p>
<p>scroll down and you'll see where it says recommendation advice</p>
<p>OK, we're obviously talking about different things. Columbia's application says:
[quote]
We suggest that as a courtesy you provide them with addressed and stamped envelopes in which to return their recommendations.
[/quote]
They're not providing the recommenders with envelopes; you are. I've suggested it many times in these threads. But I've seen it happen way too many times that the teacher will either give the recommendation to the student to mail (as happened with my d), or will simply give the kid a copy of the recommendation after mailing. I have yet to hear of a school that doesn't accept that recommendation. And when someone says "many schools" do or do not do something, but cannot name one, I tend to doubt the accuracy of that statement.</p>
<p>I think I phrased it wrong. Thats what I actually meant. That the student will give the envelope to the teacher</p>
<p>Besides that, just a week ago when I asked my supervisor from work if he can write me a recommendation for Columbia, he said Yes. After he said Yes, he also told me that he'll check my application with me to see my goals etc. Do you know what he said after that? He said "I'll show you the recommendation I wrote but you have to keep this between me and you"</p>
<p>His Point? IT basically means that recommendations aren't confidential if they are already shown to the student. And this is a person that used to work for Fordham University admissions.</p>
<p>& besides, I feel extremely awkward reading a letter that praises or extolls me. It just doesn't feel right to see read someone complimenting me and then look at them in the eye again.</p>
<p>I don't know if I'm the only one that gets this peculiar feeling but I just feel that way</p>
<p>
[quote]
Also, type up a sheet explaning your activities over your high school years. This will give the writers a chance to see who you are outside the classroom and see the background from your achievements, as well as giving them something to write about that expands upon you for the colleges.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>Carpe, I'm sorry, but I think this is really bad advice. All of this information is already on the application, so putting it in a letter of rec is simply repetitive. In fact, letter that just detail a student's accomplishments are called "standard strong" by admissions reps. In other words, they're strong, but they don't stand out.</p>
<p>What you really want is a teacher who understands the game and understands how to write about you as a classroom contributor ... what you bring to the class and how you bring it. Ideally, this teacher might also know about you outside the classroom and say something like, "I've seen him after a heavy snow go around the neighborhood and clean off all the sidewalks for our elderly neighbors. He does this for free."</p>
<p>I have to tell you, the way I know that a high school teacher will write a standard strong letter is if they hand one of my children a "brag sheet" and asks them to fill out information that's already going to be on the app.</p>
<p>Tarhunt, I agree with you!</p>
<p>Its just like making the bad move of bragging about your extra-curriculars in your essay when they're already going to see that elsewhere in the application.</p>
<p>I would really ask a teacher that you experienced a lot of good things with</p>
<p>Exg:: Lets say you call your teacher on a saturday night for the homework assignement because you were absent the previous day. Not many students in your high would do something like that. If your teacher was impressed by that and remembers it, having her write that on your rec letter will really tell alot about you.</p>
<p>So Authentic:</p>
<p>Yep. I have served on admissions committees when, trying to make a decision about a kid, we might ask about the rec. More often than not, the request would be met with a shrug and the words "standard strong," which meant there was nothing to be learned from the rec. So, it didn't help the kid at all.</p>
<p>I have to disagree. I think it's terribly poor form to ask a teacher to write a rec without giving him such a sheet unless asked not to do so. If the teacher is a good rec writer, he will know not to re-list the things in the rec. I phrased what I meant completely wrong in my former post. I didn't mean the rec writer should list off or talk about those specific things (but that's definitely what my last post sounded like). I meant it gives him a more rounded understanding of the student and oftimes can explain some of the student's habits, quirks and mannerisms; my sheet certainly does that. What I meant by something more to write about was that rounded understanding. I personally wouldn't want anyone writing a rec about me for college admissions without that chance of understanding me more as a person, and what was going on behind the scenes, even if it is never even alluded to in what he writes and even if the rec would have been the best in the world anyway. This writing is about me- and what I do and how I act in the classroom is a strong reflection of what goes on outside those hallowed halls. </p>
<p>Allow me to quote the person who interviewed me at one of the top schools in its field last spring: "When you give teachers the recs (forms), make sure to have them mention (a certain activity we had discussed and was on my app). Having that brought up again highlights it and will make a big impression." It goes to show that although recs aren't for re-listing activities, it can sometimes be useful.</p>
<p>Carpe:</p>
<p>As I said, I've been on the admissions committee at two different schools, and unless the rec gives information that isn't on the app, it's rarely looked at. I've also read a number of books about college admissions over the years. Most of them are written by admissions officers. They pretty much all say exactly the same thing. They want to know about how you are in class and in school and, if the teacher happens to know something about you from your personal life that ILLUSTRATES something already on your app, they want to know that.</p>
<p>As I said, the quickest way to know you'll get nothing better than a standard strong letter is when a teacher asks for this kind of information.</p>
<p>so is this what you mean Carpe?? Example</p>
<p>Extra-curriculaar:: National Math finalist, Participated in the albert einstein math competition. Scored highest in school Math team</p>
<p>Rec. Letter teacher #1:::: John Doe is a very good person in Math, he is a finalist in the National mational math competition and also scored highest in the school math team. Blah blah Blah etc..</p>
<p>Rec Letter teacher #2:::: John Doe has always exceled in math, I remember when we walked over to there store. I bought something but didn't count my change. John doe realized that the change wasn't correct and told me immediately. He's such a good student in math....blah blah blah etc.</p>
<p>Is the Recommendation form teacher #2 what you're trying to justify....or did I not explain what you're trying to say</p>
<p>I'm not quite sure of the question, becuase rec #2 doesn't make any sense to me... sorry. I can't connect rec 2 to anything I would put on an activity sheet. I'm trying to state my belief that having a more thorough understanding of the student as a whole helps in writing the recommendation. I'm not saying that anything mentioned on an activity sheet would be mentioned in the rec, just that I believe what is written will reflect the whole understanding of the student, even if it only deals with academics. I know from what my teachers have told me after writing my recs that their understanding of me has grown greatly from what they learned about me, and I do believe that that was reflected in what they wrote. They were no longer writing about a student, but a person as a student. </p>
<p>Tarhunt, I very much respect your opinion and experience. To clarify, the advice I'm relaying is from people equally as qualified, mostly from the admissions counselors I'm working with right now as I complete my own applications. I appreciate your giving me a different viewpoint on it to consider. Still, right now, as I deal with reps at many different schools, what I'm saying is what I'm being told by all of them. So, simply two differing opinions.</p>
<p>Hey sorry to change the subject a bit, but I have just transferred high schools and it is my senior year. Is it still okay for me to ask for those from teachers at my old school? I'm afraid to ask them for a favor for someone who isn't really their student anymore.</p>