<p>This is on behalf of my son, who has always loved the Pacific Northwest and would be interested in going to college there. (We are from the Midwest, suburban.)
Very interested in creative writing. Not really "countercultural," but marches to the beat of his own drummer. Quiet, but of the still waters run deep variety, but can cut loose and have a good time if he wants. Liberal socially. Immerses himself in creative endeavors he cares about; doesn't always have the confidence he should in his ability to handle math and science (though still does well). Likes the outdoors, nature walks, rock climbing. Is the kind of person who needs to bloom on his own terms (I realize I'm mixing metaphors here) and can be resistant to what he perceives as outside pressure. Extremely kind, the world would be a better place if more people were like him. </p>
<p>Reed? Whitman? Can someone compare and contrast the two student bodies and give me any more perspective or other thoughts? Willing to entertain outside of the Pacific NW as well -- I see him as more the LAC type than the uni type. (Grinnell? Oberlin? Carleton?)</p>
<p>From what I gathered on my Reed visit and other's descriptions, there is a lot of stress and pressure at the school...very little free time and people are always working on schoolwork (which is part of what turned me off and I am no longer applying there). So if your son hates stress and likes to learn more casually, that may not be a good choice. But some stats and whatnot would help in determining what level of academic rigor would fit him.</p>
<p>THAT I SO NOT TRUE!!! I have a friend who is taking an advanced chemistry course their and he's in high school at my school...he said Reed was really easy (he's not even a crazy hard worker) and was surprised at how everyone says it's so hard...but i still think it's better than Whitman....</p>
<p>I don't know much about Reed (except for the nuclear reactor thing, which is awesome and all sorts of amazing), but I think Reedies are known for being highly motivated thinkers who can study hard and play hard.</p>
<p>On the other hand, I've been to Whitman on a campus visit and for the interview, and I think that your son might have a great time there...all of my friends seem to be put-off by the location (many Seattle residents seem very attached to their city), but I found the rural setting peaceful and beautiful. Also, Whitman is very big on the environment and the outdoors. There was a rock climbing wall right along the tour route, and the outdoor program is own of their points of pride...there's more information on their website if you haven't checked it out already. :) </p>
<p>It seemed to me that the students I've talked to were fairly laid-back, and I was told during the interview that I wouldn't find cut-throat academic competitiveness here (though I don't know to what degree that claim is true). I felt like the administration would actually listen if I came to them with a concern about registration or whatnot, and the overall impression was that it was a cozy, comfortable campus where one could pursue one's passions and indulge in intellectual curiosity away from the GPA craze. </p>
<p>Then again, there's Walla Walla to think about. Hmmm.
(anyway, I hope that helps!)</p>
<p>A small anecdotal fact: I knew a couple of guys who went to those schools for their undergrad. The Reed graduate is very outgoing, very liberal and very outdoorsy. He loved his years at Reed. The Whitman guy is a bit resrved, a bit on the conservative side, but fun and easy to deal with. Also loved his school. They both are exceptional writers, unlike me! :) Both are married to their college sweethearts...</p>
<p>Reed: near a big city, winter is rainy but warm, no frats, no varsity sports, but active clubs.</p>
<p>Whitman: near nowhere (Walla Walla is nothing spectacular), winter is cold, frats and sororities, D-III teams and everyone plays some sport.</p>
<p>For Reed, here is a comparison with Trinity. I don't know Trinity, but I found the Reed (where our D attends) part to be mostly fair and accurate.</p>
<p>Visited Whitman when looking for schools for my D and one of my D's best friends attends. Excellent, almost a model for what a small LAC should be. Walla Walla is actually becoming a retirement destination, growing wine industry, nicely preserved downtown, some culture primarily associated with Whitman. Drawbacks: long way from anywhere, so getting out of W2 is an issue. Small (1800 students) so combined with Walla Walla isolation I wonder if students are chomping at the bit to get out by senior year.</p>
<p>Reed on the other hand is in cosmopolitan Portland (it does rain more) with city attractions, thriving downtown, theatre, music movies etc. and of course a major airport. I used to live in Portland, many years ago and socialized with ex-Reedies. One thing to research is campus atmosphere. In the 1970's Reed had the reputation of driving students to "intellectual exhaustion", with students withdrawing for a semester or longer just to recover. Some may enjoy that, but may Reedie friends thought it was really too extreme. Can't say if that has changed.</p>
<p>I spoke to recent Reed alums at our high school college fair (they were the most honest college reps I met). They were nice and friendly, but said that it was very intellectual and only for someone who could do huge amounts of school work and be under a lot of pressure. I also know one guy from our academic decathalon team who loves it there. I think is very self selecting and people are happy there, but they knew what they were getting</p>
<p>Take a good look at several schools in the area. Maybe plan a spring break trip. See the schools and some beautiful country. You could fly into portland visit Reed and Lewis and Clark. The next day visit pacific in forest grove and George fox (religous) in newberg. take another day and visit Linfield and Willamette. (S and Ds schools) All in the middle of Oregon Wine country. Then drive along the beautiful Columbia river towards Wihtman in Walla Walla and see the oregon/washington bread belt. You could even drive up to UPS and PLU and fly home from SEATAC.</p>
<p>All of these schools have something to offer somebody are are pretty small LAC's. We liked just about all of them and know kids at most. Check their webs and maybe plan a week of some of the prettiest country you could ever see.</p>
<p>My son is a student at Whitman and loves the school. The outdoor program is very popular - there's a climbing wall in the middle of campus, always kids hanging from the wall. The students are friendly, unpretentious, and more down to earth type. Princeton Review named Whitman students #1 happiest in the nation. Walla Walla is a small town, but he loves it, says it reminds him of Bedford Falls in "It's a Wonderful Life." It's been featured in the NY Times because of its emerging culinary scene and wine industry. Fun for the parents - good food and good wine within walking distance. The downtown area (admittedly just a few streets) is very pretty. Walla Walla is isolated from the big city, both Portland and Seattle are 4ish hours away. The positive is that kids stay on campus and there's a rich campus life - theatre, music, lectures, intramural and D3 sports. Most kids are serious about academics and lean to the left politically. </p>
<p>We live pretty close to Reed. Very pretty campus. Students have the rep of being more quirky and intense. Portland is becoming a destination city for young people. I've heard the advice that Reed is a "must visit before attending" school.</p>
<p>You need to look at the graduation requirements for Reed, and not just compare locations. Reed requires students to write a senior thesis paper, and also has a "core" Humanities requirement similar to Columbia and the University of Chicago. Because of this, Reed has a tendancy [ like Chicago] for attracting very smart, seriously academic students who are there above all for the love of learning. A larger percentage of Reed graduates go on to earn PHD's than any other US college. Reed is not for the student who wants the "typical" college life of classes, athletics, parties, etc.</p>
<p>Well, I'll put my head in the lion's mouth and say your son sounds llike a clone of my and he loves Williams.</p>
<p>Another very similar boy is at Bates and he loves it too.</p>
<p>BTW: D has a senior thesis at Barnard and it seems to be one of the best aspects of her education. The have colloquia to help write the thesis in which they get to know the other majors from their department quite well and they share their results with them; they also get quite close to their advisors. I think this is all helpful for the professional world because they have someone who really knows their work to recommend them for graduate or professional school; they also learn a colloborative work style. This is meant in sujpport of Reed.</p>
<p>Oh, another college in the east that might also be perfect is Bard. My nephew attends and he is very happy.</p>
<p>Sorry, I know you didn't mention any northeast schools in your post; that's why I said the lion's mouth. Please disregard with my apologies if irrelevant.</p>
<p>Concur with noseemom. Two of my kids have gone to Whitman and were ecstatic all four years with their choice. In fact, both of them were torn about doing a semester abroad because they did not want to miss out on a semester at Whitman (they both did end up doing a semester abroad). I think too much is made of "Walla Walla being in the sticks". I personally love Walla Walla and would not mind living there in the least. The students', faculty's, and administrators' lives revolve around the campus, thus making for a very close community and one that is very rich in cultural, social, academic, extracurricular and outdoors activities. The parent who mentioned Williams is probably right on as well. Whitman was modeled after Williams and has a lot in common with other LACs in that class. But all this aside, the most important is the fit for your son. I would encourage him to spend at least one full day, if not two, at the schools he is interested in - attending classes, meeting current students, spending the night if possible - to see how he feels at the school. He sounds like a great kid, and I'm sure will be able to make good choices. Best wishes.</p>
<p>This is all very helpful -- and no problem with the NE references, there are no regions of the country that are out of the running at this point, with the possible exception of the Deep South.
I think my problem is that as a midwestern I have a feel for Reed's reputation but I don't have a feel for Whitman's. What other LAC's might it be considered comparable to? And are there other small towns / college towns that could be seen as comparable to Walla Walla just to give me a better feel?</p>
<p>I visited both this summer, did the interview and info session and all else. I'm estatic about applying to Reed, I'm no longer applying to Whitman (my thread in the Whitman forum recounts my reasons for this descision).</p>
<p>I really fit into the "love to learn" category and I'm not particularly outdoorsy. And I'm a Moderate, politically speaking. So I don't FIT the reed-student-mold that seems to be portrayed, but it was sooooooooo different from my whitman visit--obviously in a good way.</p>
<p>And, for the record, both Reed and Whitman have lots of outdoorsy kind of stuff you can get involved in. I know Reed has like a bunch of equipment that students can rent and a cabin on some nearby mountain or whatever. So you'd definately be able to get your fix of mountain-air if you need it. :)</p>
<p>My wife's ancestor founded Whitman, so we have a fair amount of connection with the place. Only one of my children considered it, so we took a visit two years ago. I'm very sorry to say that it was extremely disappointing (I was really rooting for a good visit).</p>
<p>The tour was very thorough. It included a core class, a class in his area of interest, a thorough tour, and a luncheon with some Whitman students. My child reported the following:</p>
<ol>
<li><p>In the core class, there was a young lady doing her nails. The rest of the class seemed similarly bored. When the teacher threw out a softball "think" question, no one bothered to answer until my child felt so embarrassed that he answered it, himself, to much amusement.</p></li>
<li><p>The class in his intended major was underwhelming. He felt he's already learned more in high school. He had an interview with the professor afterwards, and was told that Whitman is weak in the area he was most interested in.</p></li>
<li><p>The lunch was with Whitman frat boys. They talked about how easy it is to nail girls there. Another kid came by while they were eating. One of the escorts asked the kid if he had studied for a particular test. The kid replied, "Oh, I never have to crack a book for that class."</p></li>
<li><p>I went on the tour. The tour guide spent a lot of time telling us which classes would let students satisfy core requirements without having to do much work. The tour guide also got a lot of the information about the school wrong, which one should never do with members of the family that founded the place ;-).</p></li>
</ol>
<p>Having said all that, the admissions staff was extremely friendly and the attention to the day visit was first rate. Pizzagirl, Wallla Walla is not at ALL like a small, Midwestern town. It is hundreds of miles from nowhere. If you've never lived in the West, it's hard to imagine how far it can be between places.</p>
<p>I sent a detailed message to the head of admissions for Whitman about our visit, and it's possible that some or all of what happened on that day have been corrected. Or not. We felt that what happened there could have been just bad luck, but that the most likely explanation was that the culture just didn't fit that particular child.</p>
<p>I have no first-hand experience with Whitman, but I'm so surprised (and disappointed) to read Tarhunt's account. I teach in a very competitive graduate program, and the Whitman grads I've taught have been really impressive both as students and as people. It could be that our program just skims off the top students, but teaching them has led me to believe that Whitman kids are well prepared to think, speak and write at an incredibly high level. </p>
<p>Still, your son's creative pursuits make him sound more like a Reedie to me. They get an amazing education there. I think it takes a somewhat intellectual bent to be happy there, and you haven't really described your son in that way. So, it depends.</p>