<p>My son wants to major in computer engineering or computer science and has been accepted to: an out of state college that has a great reputation for engineering and computer science, one that is an ivy but is not as highly ranked for engineering or computers, and one that is in-state and solid though not highly ranked nationally, but and would be a lot of fun, cheaper, and closer to home.<br>
My son is intellectual, introverted, and shy so I kind of think the in-state fun college would be good for him and might bring him out of his shell, whereas the highly ranked college is predominantly male, more introverts, and he might not get out of his shell at all socially. The ivy school would also be a "fun" school and would carry the Ivy reputation, although not specifically known for engineering or computers.<br>
Which should he choose--reputation (ranked for engineering/computers), prestige (Ivy, but not high for engineering/computers, or in-state (solid and fun, but not highly ranked nationally).
I want him to have a great college experience (my college years were the best in my life and brought me out of my shell), but I also want him to be able to land a great job afterwards and to have the income potential that his intellect deserves. He would love to work for Google or Amazon and wants to do programming.. He is really hard on himself and quite serious, but quite frankly also needs to learn to let loose and relax a little. </p>
<p>I am currently trying to decide between similar options. there is a great public school option that offers a solid engineering program, yet I am afraid it will not give me as much of an advantage coming out of school as other out of state private schools with elite reputations. its a hard balance to find. </p>
<p>Others may help you better if you named the three schools and their net prices after estimated financial aid grants (from the net price calculators if you do not have actual financial aid offers).</p>
<p>There are many schools with good quality CS departments (including some with low general prestige), but there are also some with with relatively weak CS departments (including some with high general prestige).</p>
<p>What does your son think is “fun”? You can’t make him into an extrovert… no matter how much you want him to loosen up, just putting him in a college environment with less work/more parties isn’t going to change him. </p>
<p>My D2 is also pretty introverted and interested in science. She had a variety of schools to choose from, and picked the highly ranked engineering/computer college. And she is happier than I ever, ever could have imagined she would be at any college. Just yesterday she was talking about her college as a place where they are really trying to find out things that no one else in the world knows, and she is so excited by this. Does she work crazy hard? Yes. Is she doing problem sets a lot of the time when she is “hanging out” with her friends? Yes. But she is also gaining confidence, making great friends with people a lot like herself (and she hadn’t met many of them before going to this college), and she is building a great skill set along with it.</p>
<p>I really let her make the choice – we went to accepted student days at the three top colleges she was accepted to, and left the decision entirely to her. Going in to the visits, I think she expected to like another school better. But her overnight visit to her college sealed the deal – she had found her people, and her only regret at this point is that she can only spend four years on campus.</p>
<p>Let your son choose what type of academic and social environment he wants for the next four years – don’t try to force him into a choice that would be your choice instead of his. </p>
<p>Hard to opine without knowing the schools you are considering, The in-state option is likely the cheapest but it doesn’t sound like the best possible fit to me. Fit is an important part of the equation. If price is not a factor, he should go to the schools where he feels most comfortable. What is “fun” for one person may not be “fun” for another. He will likely become more social if he is in a situation that feels comfortable with people he relates to. I’d try to visit the last few schools being considered again if you can. If a goal is to work for a company along the lines of Google/Amazon those firms may only recruit at certain select schools so that might be a factor to consider as well.</p>
<p>What does HE want? He sounds like the kind of kid who may actually come out of his shell more at the STEM school. since he will find a lot of people who share his interests and personalities. </p>
<p>I have always maintained that most any school can be a ‘fun’ school. That said, I also maintain that there are certain careers where school ‘prestige’ does not matter as much as things like internships and experience and CS tends to be one of those. When we hire on my team, we tend to look at experience far more than what school they got their degree from. (And we are on Fortunes Top 10 companies to work for). I would look more at things like relationships they can build and whether the school has many kids getting some hands on experience more than the prestige factor.</p>
<p>fascinating story, intparent. where’s juillet when you need her?</p>
<p>Ivy grads do very well in placements at the companies you mention, even if it isn’t particularly famous for engineering or CS, however quite a few are more than good. Where are you seeing this undergrad ranking anyway? Google particularly is still prestige oriented for new grads even though they spread a wider net now. Things are different after you get experience, however. It sounds like the OOS engineering school will be good for placement too. I’m sure he will be fine at your instate, CS grads are apt to do well right now, though he might not get the initial boost and salary edge certain colleges do. I think your reasoning about fun is misplaced. If his idea of fun isn’t drinking a lot of beer and going to a football game when everyone thinks that is the bomb then he isn’t going to be happy. I agree he sounds like he will have more fun doing his thing and finding his peers. Many engineering colleges have students having nerdy fun in their nerdy way MIT and Harvey Mudd parties, for instance, are pretty famous for attracting outside students. Money is another issue and has to be considered. I wouldn’t pick a just okay college over a ivy level or well known CS program if I could afford it. But I wouldn’t put myself in a bad position for it. Now you have to spill on these schools so we can really dish.</p>
<p>One of my great discoveries on CC is just how much fun can be had at MIT. High octane doesn’t preclude fun, close relationships and engagement. That said, it;s not just some outside raking that does it. Look at dept strengths, professor interests and affiliations, what;s cutting edge or unique, what sorts of internships are offered/promoted, the strength of career planning depts, etc. As well as activities on campus. Lay it out, let him spend time on the campuses, and see.</p>
<p>A computer science degree is very marketable. You don’t have to work for Google or Apple to find interesting, well-paid work. You also don’t have to go to MIT, Berkeley, or Carnegie Mellon to get good training. There may be differences in relative strength, but I doubt that any of the Ivies have weak CS departments. They’re all going to cover the fundamentals, and more, of the ACM CS curriculum. On the other hand, I doubt that many state flagships have weak CS departments, either. There is too much demand and too much at stake in state economies not to invest in this area. </p>
<p>After the first few years, the difference between good pay in a programming job and excellent pay in a leadership position isn’t likely to come primarily from his college CS training. It will be at least as important for him to develop good communication skills and the ability to think flexibly about business problems. </p>
<p>In my opinion you can base this decision on the overall quality of arts & science education, personal “fit”, and net cost without placing too much emphasis on differences in CS department quality. </p>
<p>Is he happy, but just not a party person? As an introvert, I had tons and tons of fun in college, but it was through small group activities, not football games and big parties. Sounds like you want him to relive your good times. Let him do it his way. There’s nothing wrong with having a small circle of friends and preferring activities other than parties. </p>
<p>By the way, an intellectual introvert will do MUCH better when surrounded by his “tribe” than he will at a party school. </p>
<p>In my opinion, your son needs to decide for himself what kind of college experience he wants. Personally, I would probably choose the Ivy because Ivies and Ivy-caliber schools are excellent all-around and your son would likely enjoy the intellectually stimulating environment coupled with lots of opportunities for fun outside of the classroom.</p>
<p>Gotta agree with many of the voices on here.</p>
<p>-“Fun” means different things to different students - for me “fun” was a laid-back atmosphere with lots of parties, but for your son “fun” may mean he gets to discuss problem sets and host all-night hackathons with like-minded nerdy friends in the dorm all night 
I’m serious! I know a couple of undergrads like that at my Ivy grad school.</p>
<p>-Also some universities also surprise you; they’re not as tightly held to stereotype as people would expect. Plus students can gain other opportunities outside of the campus. I have a friend who attended Georgia Tech; although the place is not known for the party atmosphere, she joined a sorority and sometimes went to other Atlanta-area campuses to find a good time - or just went to social events in the very active life of the city.</p>
<p>-I’m also curious where people are getting these undergrad program rankings. Aside from engineering, I’ve only ever seen rankings for graduate departments, and they aren’t interchangeable. For one, placement at the graduate level is completely different from placement at the undergrad level. For two, professors who are excellent graduate level mentors may be pretty bad undergraduate teachers and mentors.</p>
<p>-There’s an engineer who does/used to do hiring and hangs around these fora; he has emphasized consistently that salary isn’t based upon where a new hire went to college - all of his new hires made the same amount. I think that entry-level salary is more determined by firm and by a person’s ability to negotiate rather than school prestige, so I wouldn’t worry about that too much. Sometimes networks and school connections can play a role in securing internships and first jobs, but you may be surprised by the connections that both the Ivy and even the solid in-state college has.</p>
<p>-Introverts are sometimes miserable in environments that are full of bouncy, loud extraverts :D</p>
<p>I agree with the question - what does your son want? Any one of the three schools can serve him well but his voice needs to come through on this one. Also, consider if cost is a concern and you have to go into big debt for the Ivy or the prestigious tech school.</p>
<p>good to have your feedback, juillet.</p>
<p>There are enough “it depends on which schools and net prices” that it is hard to make much of a recommendation. I remember some threads where what the OPs of those threads assumed were the “better” schools were not for the specific academic and/or post-graduation goals of those OPs (or OPs’ kids). Additionally, if school X actually is better than school Y, the question “is it worth paying more for X over Y?” does depend on how much more.</p>
<p>Okay, assuming prices are roughly the same after financial aid, the choices are:
Georgia Tech–great CS reputation but many reviews have indicated not great for social life and many students or ex-students have reported being unhappy there/wishing they had chosen differently; males to females ratio is more males to females (not sure what the official stat is now, but was somewhere around 70% male).
In-state option is Clemson Univ.–strong CS program, but not really known nationally; pretty & traditional college campus, would probably be more fun socially, and he would be the proverbial big fish in the smaller pond, which might be good for his self-confidence.
Ivy is Univ or Pennsylvania–they have a good CS/Computer engineering program, but it is not as highly ranked as Georgia Tech. We visited there and he liked the campus, offers lots of social opportunities, and Philly is a great city.<br>
So… CS reputation-wise Georgia Tech is best, but I’m concerned about whether he would be happy there. Penn has the Ivy reputation, although not necessarily the CS reputation, and would probably be good for social activities, but is farther away. Clemson is closer to home, good for social opportunities, and solid, but not nationally recognized.</p>
<p>I’d go with Penn. In addition, they have a solid engineering program and their CS offerings are very strong. It’s certainly on par with Georgia Tech generally speaking, even if it’s not a Tech School.</p>
<p>I wrote my reply before I realized that the only way he is admitted already to Penn is under ED. So either this is entirely hypothetical which I don’t appreciate spending time on, or it is binding and you are supposed to withdraw from the other schools.</p>
<p>Those are all excellent choices. You are overly discounting Penn’s CS reputation, I’m not sure why. Again, where are you getting these undergraduate rankings? If you are talking grad school, and you shouldn’t necessarily, but Penn does have a high grad school ranking. They are also currently #7 on US news vs #36 for GT if you are looking at rankings don’t discount the overall one then. They offer CS in the engineering dept and have a BSE in Computer Science or a BSE in Computer Engineering as well as many other permutations involving CS. Your son would get a fantastic CS education there and would enjoy the luxuries of the resources, the class size, the research opportunities, the rich offerings for his non humanities/social sciences/elective requirements. I can’t imagine passing that up if costs are not a consideration…except for GT because it is a very particular school and will appeal to certain students who will really want to be there. Clemson wouldn’t be too shabby if costs are a consideration.</p>
<p>Now being close to home seems more a plus for the parent, not the student to me. Depending on him, of course. Going away is a huge plus in terms of being away in a tightknit community environment and getting to explore a different part of the country and become more worldly, for lack of a better term. It’s just a plane ride.</p>
<p>Anyway, good luck to him and his wonderful choices, I hope his is the main say so here, assuming your costs are not a factor.</p>