<p>Two questions about being an undergraduate at Caltech:</p>
<p>First:</p>
<p>Aside from SURF, what other research opportunities are there, and after how many years at Caltech can one expect to participate? How much (if at all) do they pay? I also checked out the JPL site, but it was vague at best. I still have no idea what sort of work an undergrad can expect to do as an intern there or what teh stipend is...</p>
<p>Secondly:</p>
<p>I understand Caltech has the simplest possible AP credit policy, but still allows students to place out of certain classes, at least in theory.</p>
<p>Whether or not it is recommended that this is done (I already know Caltech has the attitude that since proficiency at least at the AP level is assumed in all its introductory courses many students are going to refute the wisdom of my question), I would like to know how bureacratic the process is. If, for instance, I happen to not do as well as I would like on a placement test for some silly reason, will I meet resistance if I try to skip that course anyway? What if I mess up a question for a non-stupid reason (ie, having a fundamentally poor understanding of a concept), but can rectify the problem without burning up an entire course?</p>
<p>Many people do SURF's after their freshman year. Most research at JPL is done through SURF (or space grant)- you won't find any information on JPL's website.</p>
<p>I wouldn't worry about testing out of classes. You take the tests, and it'll probably be pretty clear if you tested out or not. Any anyways, even if you think you know the subject pretty well, you'll still learn a bunch if you take the class.</p>
<p>I guess a better wording for my question is then, what non SURF research is there, both during the summer and the academic year, and what does it entail?</p>
<p>Also I wonder what response I would get if I simply didn't want to take math 1a, for instance. I know that there is always something to be learned from retaking a course, but when I have time to rigorously understand single variable calculus, I will take analysis, not math 1a.</p>
<p>If my placement test is poor, will faculty take my word for it that I can handle the next course or will I get some canned "Caltech is more difficult than what you've done before" answer and then let them hold my hand as they herd me into the introductory course?</p>
<ol>
<li><p>Professors will hire students to do research outside of the SURF program. It entails... whatever the professor wants to do with it, pays... whatever they decide but I've heard $15/hour as pretty standard.</p></li>
<li><p>You will probably run into problems with the registrar letting you drop Ma 1a. Also, you won't graduate without some sort of credit for the course. I would also that you would fail the placement due to a stupid reason. The tests are only 5 questions or so, so I assume there's partial credit and the such. Out of curiosity, what makes you think that Ma 1a won't be valuable to you?</p></li>
</ol>
<p>I should have been more clear--math 1a was just an example. I also don't think it would be a useless class either, just that my time could be spent more efficiently elsewhere (a subtle distinction, I know). For the record, I have never gotten along well with registrars. Ever.</p>
<p>If I understand correctly, Caltech offers sections of all its introductory courses in three flavors--2 sections dedicated to students with little or no familiarity, 6 "average" sections, and 2 more advanced. How different are they?</p>
<p>And another clarification to my first question: what does a professor typically need and undergraduate for and much do they pay? How many hours can a student expect to be able to dedicate to research during the academic year? Understand that my entire reason for applying to Caltech was the focus on research and the mathematical sciences (and even mathematics itself)</p>
Also I wonder what response I would get if I simply didn't want to take math 1a, for instance. I know that there is always something to be learned from retaking a course, but when I have time to rigorously understand single variable calculus, I will take analysis, not math 1a.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>This, for instance, is a perfectly legitimate reason to want to skip even a rigorous intro calculus class. One reason I like the school I attend (of course, there are many like it) is that pretty much nobody cares how many rules I break in what I sign up for, in terms of prerequisites. </p>
<p>One can "learn a lot" in a lot of classes, but college is short, like life, and if one can get away with doing exactly what one likes, assuming one has such preferences, it ain't such a bad thing. =] I.e. I hope people will give this OP some feedback, instead of presenting doubts that skipping such a course could at all be valuable.</p>
<p>Caltech also typically won't care what you sign up for in terms of pre-reqs. However, it is difficult, as far as I know, to get away with ignoring graduation requirements, especially Core requirements. I was mostly asking to see what the OP's reason would be for skipping Ma 1a. Saying "because I feel like it" will most likely not get them out of it.</p>
<p>Ma 1a is a single variable calculus course. I am quite familiar with single variable calculus. I assume most people in Ma 1a are. This confuses me:</p>
<p>If the point of Ma 1a is to build up the calculus as rigorously as possible, why doesn't everyone just start with analysis (where the number system isn't even taken for granted...)?</p>
<p>I'm also very happy that Caltech is not prereq obsessed, by the way, but I would like to know what generally constitutes a legitimate reason for skipping out of ma 1a. How many people do it, and is there a placement exam for it as there is with mechanics?</p>
<p>There is a placement test, but I think the diagnostic test (which is used to determine your section for Ma1a) determines if you even get to take the placement test.</p>
<p>Placing out of Ma1a is extremely rare. I recall people who went to high schools that offer rigorous programs were more likely to place out (eg, Blair or TJ or Stuy).</p>
<p>I happen to have a copy of Apostol's Calculus text, coincidentally. It is I agree absolutely different from what I saw in high school.</p>
<p>Now that I've accidentally brought up ma 1a, what sort of math backgrounds do the people who skipped tend to have? What kinds of topics can I expect to see on the diagnostic and placement tests? I assume these are not proficiency based tests where the person who has memorized the most trigonometric integration identities is going to score the highest.</p>
<p>So I just did a search for ma1a caltech and the first or second link on google was the Fa 07-08 page with the pages to read for each week and the homeworks. That probably gives a good idea of what would be on a placement test.</p>
<p>My son says that Math 1a is the course that causes most new freshmen the most difficulty first term. Most of these students have extensive backgrounds in single variable Calculus; however, that does not translate necessarily into work on rigorous proofs. Cramming to try to pass out of the class may not be the best idea. My son knows someone who had not taken series Calculus and crammed a little knowledge in to avoid the "special" section of 1A and taking 1D, then wound up failing the normal section of 1A.</p>
<p>I agree with dLo. In my experience, Caltech doesn't really care about prereqs. They really do care about having you pass certain classes, mostly because it's their way of ensuring that you know X, Y, and Z. If it's that distasteful to you, and you're that good at Calculus, then the homeworks should be relatively easy, you don't have to go to class- so you can think of it like a few extra calculus problems you have to do each week. And it's always on pass/fail.</p>
<p>The only thing you may encounter difficulty in is if you try to sign up for too many classes while on pass/fail. They frown heavily upon "taking advantage" of the pass/fail system to take a bunch of difficult classes, and while you may not be doing it just to take difficult classes on p/f, it will almost certainly be construed that way.</p>
<p>I take it then that the vast majority of all freshmen don't place out of anything. Just wondering though, are the 1b courses in general even offered during first term?</p>
<p>I don't believe the 1b courses are offered in the fall. My impression is that only about half a dozen would pass out of Math 1a, but lizzardfire probably knows the stats for sure. Chem may be a little different, I think kids that know they want to major in Chem right off the bat try to pass out of that. They send a separate test for that which is optional.</p>
<p>I'm curious about how many test out of the core math, physics, and chem courses, too. </p>
<p>Would it be OK to post numbers on that? Also, what is the background of the people that test out? College courses during high school, self-study...?</p>
<p>And how many are told they can skip a course and take it anyway?</p>
<p>
[quote]
I've heard $15/hour as pretty standard.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>You're getting paid more than us grad students. ;_;</p>
<p>Also, I think Caltech is pretty loose with pre-reqs, at least at the graduate level, because many grad students haven't had any of the pre-reqs, and we'd never be able to take any classes here if they made them hard and fast requirements. I think they're definitely seen more as suggestions.</p>