<p>Good suggestion
Thankfully we only sent our son's abysmal SAT scores to the NCAA clearninghouse and his scores were fine for them and he will sail through clearinghouse</p>
<p>Overall, I thinkk it is better for a student to have a low SAT score with a good GPA/challenging subjects then the reverse. A high SAT with low grades may be interpreted as laziness, while a low SAT with decent grades may show "hard work" or over acheiver</p>
<p>MomofaKnight- You're helping me "prove" my unscientific theory/ observation. -- Another sports kid who did badly on the SAT. I have noted it before- SOME sports kids and those in performing arts seem to do a lot worse on the SAT than the ACT.
Zooserman- can't really help you with the list as my d did not apply to those schools except Oneonta where she did get in. We visited York, but d didn't care for it so she never applied.<br>
Friends d who is also interested in science/ possible pre-med fell in love with Siena (near Albany) and only applied there. She was awarded a very nice merit package, so maybe you want to check it out too.</p>
<p>Marny1-My son's college counselor believes strongly that for whatever reason athletes do better on the ACT than the SAT--she has been doing this for many years and works with all the student-athletes at my son's prep school. Thought you would be interested that a seasoned professional concurs with your "unscientific" observation</p>
<p>In addition, she feels that schools like athletes to submit ACT scores instead of SATs---</p>
<p>We visited York, S liked it a lot but W and I did not like the area surrounding the college. They just built a new sports complex and housing this spring, and from a social point, they do not have football, unusual for a 5000 undergrad school. Your daughter's stats should be fine for York. We were told by admissions they have a bottom floor of 900 old SAT. With her SAT and much higher ACT, she should be just fine.</p>
<p>Hi, if you are looking at SUNY Oneonta take a look also at Hartwick College in Oneonta. My son and I toured Hartwick a couple years ago and I recall it was SAT-optional. It is a smaller school and may be more of a safety school for your daughter but we got a good feeling about the school in terms of academics and environment. I remember that they had a new science facility and they were generous with merit aid also.</p>
<p>I agree that sticking with the ACT best if possible. If, for some reason, the SAT needs to be retaken, here are some suggestions (in tandem with the Xiggi info):</p>
<ol>
<li><p>Send the report to no schools until you get the results (less stress on the student - worth a few bucks).</p></li>
<li><p>As part of practicing for the miserable test, include pretest preparation such as breakfast, taking a walk, best time to wake up. My son's best breakfast was lox/bagel and a banana. Heavy breakfast was bad (worth about -50 points per section), coffee AND mountain dew required a retest of the old SAT II writing (concentration problem for reasons you can likely guess: score improved by 120 points with only coffee and a little prep on grammar and strategy on essay). </p></li>
</ol>
<p>He also found that taking a walk with the dogs was relaxing and got the blood stirring.</p>
<ol>
<li><p>Jumping up and down between the sections or doing a little yoga is useful.</p></li>
<li><p>Pick a different test center - speak to the administrator about breaks and water. Your D was dehydrated and her brain was not working at top efficiency. That's likely half of the missing points.</p></li>
<li><p>If she's really got the gitters, many sports psychology books include exercises on positive visualizations that actually help calm one down. I use "That Winning Feeling" for dressage - a sport with a huge mental component. </p></li>
</ol>
<p>Good luck on all of this. Most of our children have have various adventures with the testing and survived - its just not much fun when it happens. By the time my son was done with it all he was pretty good at standardized testing - but it was rocky for a while.</p>
<p>Tell her that with the ACT score of 28, she automatically qualifies for $22,750 in merit money (over the 4 years) at Ohio University, where my son is. As I said before, it's a beautiful campus, not too gigantic (16,000 undergrads), and a deserved reputation for extremely friendly students. My son is EXTREMELY happy with the place. Tell her to take a look. . .</p>
<p>Merit awards: <a href="http://www.ohio.edu/admissions/gateway/%5B/url%5D">http://www.ohio.edu/admissions/gateway/</a></p>
<p>See the campus: <a href="http://www.ohio.edu/weru/video1/%5B/url%5D">http://www.ohio.edu/weru/video1/</a></p>
<p>tons of really good colleges are SAT-optional. look into those. you can't have sent SAT scores to every single college out there :)</p>
<p>here's a few: sarah lawrence (really good women's college, pretty prestigious so your daughter will NOT think she's a dummy), mt. holyoke, bates college, eckerd college, bowdoin, dickinson, wheaton...</p>
<p>Quite frankly, zoosermom, the colleges will probably look at your daughter's ACT score and think "This is a really smart kid" and then look at her SAT score and say "She must have been sick that day." Really, really, really. Don't sweat this. Even the very elite schools confirm that they look at the highest scores on whichever test. My brilliant med school roommate just couldn't take those darn standardized tests. It took her twice to pass her specialty boards because all those multiple multiple guess questions either plain bored her or messed with her mind. But she had a BA from Carleton, and a MM even BEFORE she went to med school. Give your daughter a hug, tell her that the SAT suqs, and don't change ANYTHING about her application strategy.</p>
<p>To all other rising seniors and juniors: Despite the temptation to send your SAT scores (including SAT IIs) to colleges before you know the result because you get 4 schools for free, DON'T DO IT! Spend the extra $$ later and send them individually to the schools you desire.</p>
<p>I would just like to thank all of you for the kind words and excellent advice. I shudder to think what this day would have been like without that.</p>
<p>The Ohio University merit awards are based on the ACT. If you look only at SAT-optional colleges, that might severely limit your options. But keep in mind that for many areas outside of the Northeast, the ACT is the test on which they base things on. So instead of saying "the ACT may be submitted in lieu of the SAT" the official line might be: "The SAT may be submitted in lieu of the ACT."</p>
<p>As for SATII tests, many places might require SATIIs or the ACT. Check into it.</p>
<p>Zoosermom, please do not get nervous about this lower score having a lingering effect on your daughter's application. Retakes are there for a reason! </p>
<p>If the schools you target seem to favor the SAT, you should not hesitate to recommend a retake to your daughter. Based on her scores, something really wrong did happen that day. If the test date was one where the released tests are offered, please purchase it and check your daughter's work. Given her 28 on the ACT, she should score a lot higher than what you shared with us. However, the lower scores are gone, and people "on the other side" will more than probably think something caused those scores to be "bad." Heck they may think the scantron were defective. On this issue, do not underestimate the chances to misbubble an entire section, not applying sufficient pressure on the pencil, or even forget pages. </p>
<p>The only reason to look at the past test and score is to uncover any specific weakness that could be corrected in October and November. Again, since she did well on the ACT, she does not seem to have a problem with test taking skills or ... speed -since the ACT requires more speed, but less reasoning. </p>
<p>Have your daughter jump in the saddle again, she just had a small false start. The race is still on. :)</p>
<p>"To all other rising seniors and juniors: Despite the temptation to send your SAT scores (including SAT IIs) to colleges before you know the result because you get 4 schools for free, DON'T DO IT! Spend the extra $$ later and send them individually to the schools you desire."</p>
<p>Excellent, excellent, excellent advice!!</p>
<p>Thanks MomoaKnight- You "validated" my gut feeling about the SAT vs. ACT. To add a piece to this puzzle- it seems learning styles may come into play. Alot of kids who are into sports or performing arts may have kinetic learning styles. This may explain why some sports kids seem to do better on ACT test. I believe the ACT is much more straight forward and a quicker moving test than the SAT. I think with some study of the results of both tests, there may be a definite pattern as to the type of kid who would do better on one test than the other. I do believe though, that for the majority of kids, their scores for both exams would be comparable.</p>
<p>Xiggi- I know you are very sincere and have been so helpful to many kids on these boards- but I honestly believe that for some kids, all the studying in the world is not going to bring up their SAT score. If there is a marked difference with the SAT vs. ACT- just move ahead and go with the ACT score!!</p>
<p>Oh thank you Xiggi. I'm going to tell her that very thing AND not send any scores till we see them first.</p>
<p>The debate about the ACT versus the SAT has been raging on CC for a ... long time. Here's a small proof:</p>
<p>
[quote]
Post by By Foosguy on Sunday, September 16, 2001 - 04:25 pm:
My principal told me that the ACT tends to be easier than the SAT. I got 1160 last time I took the SAT, and he suggested I try the ACT instead of taking the SAT again. Is this a good idea? </p>
<p>Answer By Dave Berry on Sunday, September 16, 2001 - 06:46 pm:
Hey Foosguy, do you play foosball? Just kidding. From my experience, the ACT may be easier for you if you're good at subject-oriented tests (the ACT) rather than concept-oriented tests (the SAT). Taking the ACT may not be a bad idea, but I strongly recommend that you familiarize yourself with the test format and typical contents before you take it. There are any number of good study guides available for the ACT published by the same folks who do the SAT study guides. </p>
<p>In my opinion, it's easier to improve your SAT score by doing some prep than it is to goose your ACT score. As I mentioned, the ACT is much more subject-specific than the SAT, so you're going to have to know more concrete information, especially in its higher-level math. Give it a shot and let us know what happens. Good luck!
[/quote]
</p>
<p>Yep, that is THE College Confidential's Dave! </p>
<p>This said, since the paleolithic age when Dave roamed the boards, the situation has become as clear as a bottle of Chinese ink. There are still a few differences between the two tests, but the demarcation line is rather fluid. Take the ACT's Math and whatever goes in what the Midwesterners sarcastically dubbed Science, and you have the SAT Math section. The English sections are comparable in contents, but depart a bit in style. All in all, the ACT is slightly less polished that is SUPPOSED to follow a high school curriculum a bit more closely. Again, whatever that is supposed to mean! </p>
<p>The reality is that people do react differently to the two test, and everyone should pick the one that appeals more. The ACT does present a number of loopholes in college admissions. A number of schools -for some incomprehensible reason- are still accepting the ACT in lieu of the SAT Subject Tests. Further, the ACT still practices score choice. </p>
<p>Better use when it is still there! :)</p>
<p>For the record, my D unexpectedly aced the ACT on the first go, so NEVER even took the SAT (lost out on National Merit $, though, by making this decision) and was accepted to all colleges she applied to. Only the rare student who wants to attend a very few select colleges MUST take the SAT (or report the results). If your child is happy with their ACT result, and National Merit money is neither here nor there for them, there's no need to sweat over the SAT for most colleges.</p>
<p>Zoosermom:
I sincerely believe that schools really do only consider the highest scores for each student. This year, my S somehow dropped 100+ points the SECOND time he took the SAT I (despite the fact the he missed the entire last page of the math section the first time around because he thought he finished the section and didn't turn the page. Ugh.) The only score that went up the second time was the essay, on which he scored a 12. Despite everything his dad and I told him, he was convinced all the schools he applied to would reject him because he was probably the only person in the world who managed to lower his scores on a retest. :) </p>
<p>Fast forward: he was accepted to six of the seven schools he applied to, rejected only by his reach -- which was a silly crazy reach anyway, no matter how you sliced and diced his SAT scores. </p>
<p>Oh, and I won't even go into the disaster that were his SAT II scores. Good grief! Another round of panic because those scores went to all of his schools even though only the reach required them. Like you, we considered cancelling them because S knew he had crashed and burned. We didn't, but he wished he hadn't requested that the scores be sent to all of his schools.</p>
<p>The lesson I've learned is that GPA and strength of schedule carry a whole lot of weight, and I think admissions officers give the benefit of the doubt to kids (like your D) who really stretched themselves in HS. S is an IB diploma candidate w/ a very high GPA in one of the best public high schools in the country, with ECs that demonstrate passion and commitment. Some very bright kids don't do well on the SAT (though S is still quite proud of the 12 on his essay, and rightly so because he wants to be a journalist). For those kids, the SAT simply cannot be looked to as an indicator for "likely successs in college," and admissions officers know that. At least the good ones do. :)</p>
<p>Oh, and S was offered merit money from all but one of the schools that accepted him. :) His SAT was a few points below the 1300-1350 SAT minimum for merit at some of the schools so we didn't think they'd offer him any merit aid. They did, though, because of his GPA and IB work.</p>
<p>Your D will be fine! We came late to CC so I never considered the merits of taking the ACT over the SAT, though S likely would have scored higher on the ACT. I think most of the schools he applied to would have taken either, but the ACT isn't pushed in our part of the country. Now that I know better, our artistic, creative D will certainly take the ACT -- and look to apply to SAT- optional schools.</p>
<p>Sorry it happened, OP. Both Xig and Marny are right, it's just that we don't know your kid.;)</p>
<p>The very first lesson I learned on CC was "Never send the scores before knowing what they are". And it was Xig who taught me the most important follow up , which he somehow failed to mention (late night Xig?), never list your high school. LOL. Those people can screw up your best laid plans by helpfully xeroxing ALL TEST SCORES on to the back of your "official" transcript :eek:. And folks , I mean all. In Texas that meant for my kid TAKS, PSAT, TAAS and Draw the One-eyed Pirate.</p>