SAT prep course?

Parents Forum
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<p>Hello, fellow parents! My son found this site a few weeks ago and loves it. I have to say after digging around the different forums on here that there's a lot of great information, especially here in the parents forum. I've been exploring for the past hour or so and am impressed by how many of you so willingly share your experiences and offer sage advice. It's also nice to know that I should take the more high-strung "you must have a perfect SAT" advice from the teenagers with a grain of salt. :-) My son was starting to get worked up about his scores!</p>

<p>With that in mind, however, we are looking seriously at SAT, ACT, etc. and how best to prepare. I realize of course that it can be very individualized, as to what's best. Our thinking (my DH and I) is that our son would probably do best with a combination of self prep and a prep course. He does well in school but has trouble with his focus on tests, especially stressful ones. </p>

<p>I have been researching options but haven't seen too many posts from parents on here about SAT prep courses. The course that is most catching my eye at the moment is called "SAT for Sophomores" from Princeton Review. It is supposed to help with testtaking skills but also academics and deciding which test is better for your student, the SAT or ACT. Is anyone familiar with this course or have any other experiences with Princeton Review's classes? So far I prefer them over Kaplan based on what I've read online; they seem to have a better reputation aside from the course offering. </p>

<p>I would appreciate any advice from other parents who have considered a prep course.</p>

<p>Thanks in advance!</p>

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<p><a href="http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/showthread.php?t=68210%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/showthread.php?t=68210&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p>

<p>it's a tough call. See the above link. If your S can work independently, then a course is not really necessary. But, some kids need the schedule rigor of going to a class to keep them focused.</p>

<p>My suggestion would be to purchase the collegeboard guide to sat's and have your S take one. It'll give you a good idea on where he needs help. A collegeboard program/test is also available online. The ACT works well for many kids, but not mine. (I'll speculate here and suggest that the ACT works better for more right-brained kids.)</p>

<p>btw: welcome to cc.</p>

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<p>i just finished (last week) the PR class. It was dreadful... i feel like i gained nothing out of a 1000$ class. I still have raised my score though thru self study and practice. thats all it really is:practice...over and over. You have to have self motivation.</p>

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<p>Thank you both...harry, what didn't you like about the PR class? I have mostly heard very good things. Can you elaborate?</p>

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<p>well first of all the teachers are different everwhere so my experience may differ Greatly. For starters the PR people in NC didnt really seem to care what kind of teachers or materials we had in class! I'm guessing because there were only 4 people in my class total. The first day of class the teacher asks us why we didnt bring our books to class. We all say we never got them. He acts surprised, calls headquarters and they say they made some mistake or something so we do the entire class w/o books (basically wasting an entire class). Secondly, it was the guys first time teaching the class and he admitted that he didnt even finish all the training because he had to come teach. Another reason the class may have been bad for me is because they usually have 3 levels of 'classes': low scores, medium scores, high scores, and they place you in which class you need to be by looking at your diagnostic test scores. Well all the kids in my class had very different scores, but we were all put in the 'medium' category. I already had a '1300(Old SAT of course :))' so (in terms of the PR) i would technically be placed in the 'high' categorybut i wasnt, and because of this i felt like i was helping the teacher explain stuff to the other students more than i was learning anything. Disappointing :(. Another major point i found shocking was the fact that after practice tests we would never go over them! i had to go to the teacher and request the booklet so i cud go over the answers i missed. I went into the class with an open mind but i came out disappointed. But this could be class specific since teachers are different everywhere. Ask around and if you hear good things about the teachers and the class in your area then go ahead and take the class. Also make sure that they dont switch teachers on you. I honestly felt though, that i had wasted a lot of money on nothing. Though i have raised my score a lot, its mostly because of my self studying and hard work. If your son can motivate himself to do SAT then there is no point taking the PR class, but if he can't then the PR will be good alternative. If anything i feel like the class gave me a routine to follow daily in terms of SAT prep and made me actually start to enjoy doing SAT on my own, though in class i learned nearly nothing. In conclusion: basically every course is different in every area, so don't let my negative experience discourage you from gettin SAT help for your son.</p>

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<p>SAT prep can be done on your own if your very motivated and organized (See SAT prep thread by Xiggi). However, both my kids used PR, and then did lots of practice tests and vocab study on their own. Having someone go over wrong answers with you is extremely important...the prep books don't always do a good job with this, and there are frequent mistakes in these books as well. (my kids got this from the PR tutors, and also from me for the verbal.) The important point is that prepping is time well spent...both my kids had significant increases in their scores afterwards. The two most important things that improved for my kids was their vocabulary--for analogies (old test) / reading comprehension, and their speed in order to complete the tests (this improvement was a huge factor for both my kids, who tend not to work quickly).</p>

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<p>Tomsmom, A few questions: Did your son take the SATs in sophomore year? If so, was there a section on he did significantly lower on than the other two? If he didn't take the sophomore PSAT, is there an area in his grades/abilities that is weaker than the other two? Is your son likely to spend additional time prepping based on the suggestions of the class he is planning to take or is he likely to just do what the class requires? If he didn't take the PSAT yet, have you had him try a copy of a REAL SAT test under timed conditions to see how he performs?</p>

<p>The reason I am asking, is that I personally feel that outside help is most effective when it is targeted towards a specific improvement and when test scores are not already in the top percentiles. Additionally, I believe that any prep class is only as good as the amount of EXTRA time you are willing to put into using the tools and techniques the class suggests. And, that extra time has to go above and beyond any "homework" assigned as part of the class.</p>

<p>My daughter had a very significant difference between her math and writing/verbal when she took the PSATs in 10th grade. When she took the PSATs in 11th grade, all her scores went up somewhat, but her math remained significantly lower than the other two scores, which were both somewhere above the 80th percentile (can't remember off hand). </p>

<p>We consulted with a very expensive private tutor who said she could help bring my daughter's scores up on all three tests but only if daughter spent several hours a week working on her own following the tutors method. We also looked into several test prep classes, including the PR class. </p>

<p>We finally decided to spend our money where it would count most: on her lowest score. We hired a private tutor to work with her specifically on her math. The method they used was: D. would take a test from the "real SAT" prep book, they would go over the answers - even the ones she got right - they would discuss strategies and tactics. It was personalized and very focused on my daughter's real weakness which is/was math.</p>

<p>Because I was nervous, I also enrolled her in a prep class. I decided against the PR class because they use their own proprietary materials, not actual test questions from the SATs. Unlike the PR classes, however, this class focused on using the real SAT book, which is questions taken directly from actual SAT books. The PR book does not use actual questions, bear in mind.</p>

<p>My daughter found the class incredibly UNhelpful simply because she soon realized that (1) she could have accomplished the same thing just by using the Real SAT book herself (2) the class bogged down discussing areas that she didn't need help in and there wasn't much opportunity for her to ask specific questions targeted at her weak areas.</p>

<p>The bottom line? We spent about $500 over the course of the year for the Math tutor. Her math scores rose 100 points. Daughter felt the prep class was a waste of time and actually did not attend the last two sessions. Total cost of that class was $680. Daughter's reading scores did rise on the reading first take, but both she and I felt it had more to do with a reading intensive curriculum in school then anything she learned from the class. Her writing scores, which were high to begin with, stayed pretty much the same.</p>

<p>This is not to say that prep classes can't pay off for some kids - I think they can. But, I think you need to go back to my original questions and see if a child falls into any of those categories. If there's a signficant weakness, it may make sense to hire a tutor to work privately with your child. If your child's test scores are already high, chances are you won't see a 100 point improvement on each section, just based on statistical increases on the test overall. And, if your child is looking at the class as an easy way to avoid test prepping on his own, it may not be worth the money.</p>

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<p>yeh i believe prep classes only help you if you have <1150 after mulitple tries</p>

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<p>Tomsmom, in the past three years, negative stories about the GENERIC PR classes must run 9 to 1, and that 1 is very generous. The organized classes offered by the National chains are very dependent from the tutors they hire. The minimum qualifications are abysmal, and training is often limited to having taken the same class the students will take. </p>

<p>On the other hand there are TRUE professionals in the industry, and most will be found working independently or for small to medium companies. It is REALLY important to check the qualifications and ask for verifiable testimonials. Successful tutors will not be insulted when asked about their success or to explain their methodology. Reputable tutors won't have a problem in evaluating your son. In this regard, it would most helpful to take a test under test conditions. Given that I am a big supporter of self-studying, I would advise spending a few days working through the preliminary steps I advocate, then take a real test, and show the results/improvement to your selected tutors. </p>

<p>The best results will often result from one-on-one interaction, but there are organized classes that have an excellent reputation. I would also advise AGAINST paying much attention to recommendation from your high school or past parents. Most of them are really clueless about the SAT. In the same vein, I would advise to stay away from HS teachers who teach a few haphazard SAT classes or at a minimum place them under higher scrutiny than the tutors. Teachers can be wonderful and acclaimed in HS but be worthless for the SAT, as a lot of the techniques go contrary to the typical HS work. This also applies to the essays.</p>

<p>PS You have to the right place: you'll meet a great number of parents who can't wait to help and know a LOT! </p>

<p>Good luck</p>

<p>PS You'll hear this many times, but key is to practice. Be in a self-arranged manner or in an organized class. Most students possess the theoretical knowledge but lack the awareness of the arcane ways of the test.</p>

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<p>My general impression, just from what I've picked up from various comments:</p>

<p>If the student has mid-range to low scores, these courses might be pretty good. (Those kids probably do need a lot of structure and a comprehensive overview of the test, with lots of practice).</p>

<p>If the kid has higher scores or specific area of weakness, it is probably better to use a service that provides individual tutoring - or hire a tutor who comes well-recommended - or perhaps find courses geared to the specific area of weakness - such as a a math or essay-writing workshop. </p>

<p>So far my daughter hasn't done either, though I've lined up the private tutor for her - if she wants tutoring, all she has to do is call.</p>

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<p>heres the truth: If ur kid doesn't wanna do it, then they'll never learn anything. I was shocked when kids in my PR class would complain about how they were not going to come next time or about how they hated the class. SAT prep is all about self motivation and determination. You have to WANT to succeed</p>

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<p>I agree harry3734, a lot of parents think the course will "force" them to study and they get resentful. I knew one boy that went twice a week, sometimes until 10pm and he was so tired when he got out. Then he still had to do his homework. The time "lost" to him made him miserable and he only got 50 points higher in one catagory. To be fair though, one guy at my gym had his son go to Kaplan classroom instead of driving lessons (with my son) and he emailed me that he gained 200 points on his June SAT compared to the March. That put him high enough to not take it again (no ivies here) and in line for some scholarships at certain colleges. He felt his 980. was well spent.</p>

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<p>I totally agree with a previous poster that your son should take a practice test from the College Board book to see where he currently stands. I'm not clear on what year your son is - sophomore? junior? Does your school allow sophomores to take the PSAT? The College Board also offers an online prep course for a relatively low cost on its website.</p>

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<p>I just got a memo from son's school that they are offering a SAT/PSAT review class this fall after school. It is cheap ($100). </p>

<p>My question is this - are the PSAT and the SAT similar enough that you could take the same class to prepare for them? Son will be a junior and took the PSATs as a sophmore with mediocre results. (He had strep throat the day he took them though.) Thanks for ideas.</p>

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<p>SATs, PSATs are similar, except that the SAT is longer, has an essay, and has some higher level math. I know some who used the SAT book to study for the PSAT with excellent results. In my opinion, you don't need to pay a lot of $ for a course. Just buy the "Official" book and sit down on Saturdays, take the practice tests and go over them in detail. Do this over a couple months-- don't wait until the last minute. Do everything in the book. The student needs self discipline to stick with it. You might have to help your kid with this--time the tests and go over answers with him to see what kinds of questions trip him up, be his personal coach.</p>

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<p>FWIW, I would NOT pay too much attention to prior PSAT results. The PSAT is NOT always easier and the students approach it with different level of preparation, including many who never saw a SAT test. On an indvidual basis, I still find the PSAT harder to ace than any SAT. For some reason, I always find a few "dubious" questions on the PSAT. </p>

<p>In the range of ideas to motivate your kids, why not PAY them $100 per Saturday test? The sight of a crispy bank note has been known to motivate the laziest among us. And the parents come way ahead.</p>

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<p>Weenie, my daughter took the $100 prep class at her school. Historically she was a high scorer on achievement tests, but her soph and junior PSATs seemed to be under her potential (she was quite sick for the junior). The class only met 8 times, and she had to miss a couple of those, but they took about 3 complete tests during that time, and discussed missed questions. She thought it was a pain, but helped in one way - forced her to take practice tests enough in advance of the real test to allow her to know what to review or practice. She spent the last week before the test doing what was for her "intense review", about 30 minutes per night - but that seemed to be enough.
Xiggi knows his stuff - the real secret is practice taking the test, and focussed review. I would ask how many practice tests or practice subsections do they do in the class, and how many people are in the class. Then consider your child. DD would say the class was a waste of time, except it identified for her what she knew and didn't know. Most of the time spent going over the questions did not help her, because there was such a wide range of abilities in the class, but it was worth the $100 to have the proctored, structured practice test.</p>

<p>My unscientific opinion is that a student's prior grades in algebra, geometry and English, plus their past performance on standardized achievement tests, should give you a pretty good idea of their potential performance on the SAT. There are some tricks to the test, soem types of questions peculiar to the test that the student may not be familiar with - that is why practice, and reviewing the answers is important, but they really cannot learn the content, they can only review, refresh and relearn what they used to know.</p>

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<p>Cangel, school grades don't give much of an indication of score because even in a school with strict grading standards, school tests are given under different circumstances - usually without similar time constraints. That is, even though there is a time limit in class to complete an exam, it usually doesn't require the same time-per-question rate that is common for standardized tests. A math exam usually has fewer, but more difficult problems; it is not multiple choice; the students are expected to show their work; and teachers usually award partial credit if the student shows that they have the formula or concepts right, even though they make a small error that leads to the wrong answer. An English grade is more likely to be based on essays and papers that were prepared over time, with plenty of time for revision -- not the quality of a handwritten essay that can be produced in 20 minutes. </p>

<p>Of course things can be a lot worse than that, depending on the school. My daughter once came home with a geometry exam where she had an A+ grade - with only 37% right. The teacher was absolutely terrible, taught the kids nothing, but he graded on a curve - and my d. was always top of the curve. (And in case you are wondering, I looked at the exam - the questions were not particularly difficult). My d. had a much better teacher for advanced algebra the following year -- all A's -- but my d. recently informed me that she didn't do well on the tests - her good grades came from the fact that she worked her tail off on her homework. So I now know that my daughter understands math concepts well, and given adequate time can handle all the math she's been taught -- but simply can't do math at the speed required for the standardized tests, and also tends to make a lot of dumb arithmetical mistakes when under pressure. </p>

<p>And I'm not sure Shakespeare would have done well with the 20-minute essay. I mean, good writing sometimes requires more than 20 minutes just to think about what you are going to write.</p>

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<p>


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<p>Excellent idea, I wish more parents thought like that! That would definitely get me to crack open the books.</p>

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<p>I took a PR course. It was okay, but the competence of the instructors is wildly discordant. In addition, their "200 point guarantee" is a total scam. They give you a diagnostic test loaded with the hardest questions they can find and use an unofficial scaled score, and say thats what you would have made on the SAT if you'd taken it before you came to them. I got a 1980 on the PSAT, then an 1810 on their first diagnostic (originally scored as a 1900, but they change dit after they said they'd been using too liberal of a scale). I then got a 2030 on the March SAT. A 50 point increase from my PSAT was decent I guess, but I actually went down 10 pts in math. I'm confident that if I use the Xiggi test method and get some private tutoring for geometry I can get over a 2100. A bigger jump for a fraction of the cost of a PR course.</p>