I don’t think NYS has herd immunity, however there is at least one part of Queens that does. An interview with a local clinic director reported that about 70% of the residents have antibodies.
You will know the US has massive exposure without vaccine when there are millions dead from covid. Serology results even in NYC (you can google results across boroughs IIRC from TWIV) and Spain and the UK indicate depressingly low population numbers with antibodies. Even with a margin for error in serology tests. And even if there is a positive result, no one knows if there is actual immunity or how long it lasts.
Herd, as in cattle.
** Great news from Amherst! ** We just received a message from the president on a Webinar for students and families tomorrow saying “At this point we have not changed our plans and do not anticipate that we will.” They are having a Zoom meeting tomorrow with students and families to emphasize the rules and expectations for students returning to campus along with potential consequences for violating them. I fully expect students to receive a message later in the week (before the start of move-in on Saturday) similar to that of Williams, basically saying they will swing the hammer for students who flagrantly disobey the rules.
I’ve seen this justification before, but I can’t get behind it. Why do people think healthcare workers “signed up” to jeopardize their own lives? They took an oath to help others, but not to risk their own safety. Healthcare workers are supposed to have appropriate PPE and precautions in place so that they can do their jobs while NOT risking themselves. I don’t know why people use the argument it’s okay that healthcare workers have been risking themselves these past 5-6 months, because they are healthcare workers.
From your mouth to God’s ears.
@waverlywizzard Denison has invited all students back to campus though any student can elect to continue remotely. I think I’ve heard something like 10-15% have elected to go remote OR defer (that is NOT the number of deferrals), but I don’t know the precise count. Classes are either in-person, with social distancing, or virtual, depending on the professor. @tkoparent was saying that her student’s courses this fall happen to be virtual.
Classes at Denison are typically capped at between 18-28 students depending on the level and subject – though fine arts, foreign language and upper level seminars are smaller. As a result, Denison did not have the challenge of figuring out how to do social distancing for larger lecture classes. I understand that space which had not been used for teaching in the past has been adapted as classroom space to allow for social distancing.
@Midwestmomofboys I hope Denison succeeds this fall! If we can see schools have in person classes and profs do not get sick, then maybe the word will spread to faculty at other schools that the chances are low as long as the kids have masks on and stay socially distanced. That’s the only chance that any college will have in person classes for spring. Otherwise, it’s going to be back at mom and dad’s house or in an off campus apartment with remote learning ala spring 2020.
Haha… Isn’t that what we have been doing for over 12,000 posts… Lol…
There are going to be rise and falls no matter what people do. Wear the masks, don’t touch your face, social distance (yes when wearing your masks), and be kind and respectful of others. Yes, I added the last 2 items ?.
I mean next fall! A year from now…
One major difference–not fair but true–is that we CAN do our job remotely. I would love for all workers to be able to, but that some can’t, is not an argument that others shouldn’t.
Also, no, healthcare workers didn’t “sign up for” risks. But they know they are more likely. My H has permanent scars in his lungs from getting TB as a physician several decades ago. He did know there were risks. He shouldn’t need to run the same or worse risks now as a HS teacher.
His healthcare work made him hi-risk as a teacher. And he, as much as anyone, knows the different risks that are, or should be, expected of teachers.
Also as others have said, the experience of sitting in a room with young people who may or may not be wearing masks, with questionable air filtering, for extended periods of time in small rooms, including talking for much of it, is in no way the same as customers walking in and out of stores. Customers have fleeting contact, can be asked to leave, and do not need to hold conversations, among lots of other differences. and yes, food workers should be getting hazard pay for sure.
I don’t wish it on anyone, as the virus becomes more and more of a reality in those places where that is the majority’s opinion now, and they or people they love test positive and (God forbid) get seriously ill or die, I can’t imagine that they won’t come to the conclusion that Covid-19 IS real, and that reality bites. Of course, there will always be some stubborn flat-earth people out there, or people who are overly concerned that their makeup will get smudged by a mask and Just Can’t Deal with that prospect, who will find ways to rationalize their “thinking,” but a few days in an ICU might even be a wake-up call to them.
In response to the question posed earlier, I really think it’s extremely unlikely that spring will be different than fall semester this year. But dear God, I can only pray that by NEXT fall we will have this thing under control. These “kids”–including my son–are at a crucial point in their lives, and need to be able to start living them–just not at the risk of putting their own and others’ health and lives in danger.
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I am classified as an essential worker. I worked through the worst of this in my area. I don’t consider myself disposable any more than we consider doctors and healthcare workers disposable. At my age, I was borderline to being high risk and could have sat it out. Some of my coworkers did. I would think those in a high risk category, such as older staff would get a pass.
I’m not considering adjunct profs any more disposable than myself. It could be an opportunity for more of them to get work experience that could increase chances of more permanent positions.
I’m a bit perplexed that teachers, professors, school staff do not consider themselves essential workers.
Not quite. My hope for fall 2021 (barring a safe and efficacious vaccine) is that if treatment and testing breakthroughs are accompanied by following the rules and foregoing unnecessary large, indoor gatherings, that infection rates will go down enough that face to face education can happen safely and more students can return to campus. Whether masks or social distancing would still be required, I could not say. Successes and failures will help us to refine and improve plans for the future.
If one part of Queens does, who is to say NY and other states with low numbers don’t have herd immunity. More antibody testing is needed to know for sure. But it would make sense.
To be fair. It was Dr. Fauci who at first came out and told everyone not to wear a mask and they don’t work. He also, along with the WHO, downplayed it when they said there would be no human to human transmission, and no animal to human either (assuming it came from a bat and not from a lab)
FWIW in California (and most likely other states), public school (k-colleges)/ government employees are considered ESSENTIAL workers in the event of disaster (i.e, earthquake, etc). They can be tapped to and are expected to assist with efforts. They take an oath to say they will do so. Whether they do or not come an emergency is another story.
So different slicing and dicing of what is considered “essential” and under what circumstances, and who gets to make the rules!
That’s not what I said. It’s what the healthcare workers I know are saying, and it’s a direct quote.
Of course they should have the PPE they need to do their jobs. Who’s saying they shouldn’t?
I didn’t say it was okay. I’m just passing on what I was told. Those I know in the healthcare industry have been risking themselves because they believe their mission is to help cure people. I don’t believe that extends to all healthcare workers though. I can understand nurses and doctors feeling that way, but home health aides and other types of healthcare workers probably expect different levels of risk.
We should be trying to unite (not divide) the country so we tackle this problem as a whole, not leaving it up to individual communities and states to “figure it out themselves”. This is a global crisis, not a states rights issue…IMO
At first the states all complained. They all wanted to have the right to decide how each state would open according to guidance put forth by the governme
COVID is a global pandemic,
A reminder to steer clear of politics. A number of threads have been edited and one deleted.