Schools best at providing access to poor and middle-income families.

[ucbalumnus]

@PurpleTitan

note that UVa and UNC say they meet full need for everyone as well. The only publics that do

Of course, selectivity for OOS is very high at those schools.

There are three other public schools where family financial resources are not an issue, but they are kind of special cases: USMA, USNA, USAFA.

[bclintonk]

@prospect1

“Schools like #136 WUSTL, #139 Boston College, #144 Wake Forest, #146 Villanova, #147 American, #148 Pitt, #151 George Washington, #152 Penn State, #153 Whitman, #154 Carnegie Mellon, #163 RPI, #165 Northeastern, #167 University of Miami, and #173 WPI are all schools that get a fair amount of attention on CC but do poorly on this index due to a combination of low numbers of Pell grant recipients in their respective student bodies and a high net cost for middle-income students.”

^^^^ And how many of these colleges have higher per-student endowments than NYU and BU? The outpouring of ire should be directed at them, not always so focused on NYU and BU.

Well, let’s see. WUSTL ($418K/student), Whitman ($300K/student), Wake Forest ($143K/student), Boston College ($137K/student), Pitt ($101K/student), RPI ($88k/student), and Carnegie Mellon ($75K/student) have endowments bigger than NYU ($67K/student) and BU ($44K/student). George Washington ($63K/student) is similar to NYU and a bit higher than BU. University of Miami ($49K/student), American ($46K/student) and Villanova ($42K/student) are about the same as BU. Penn State ($33K/student) is lower than both NYU and BU, though Penn State also gets some money from the state, which operates in effect as a substitute for endowment payout. Northeastern ($24K/student) is lower than either

With the exception of WUSTL and Whitman, these are not large-endowment schools. Most schools aren’t, public or private. Yet some low-endowment schools do much better on the NY Times index. An example would be #24 Knox College in Galesburg, IL, with only $70K/student endowment, which nonetheless manages to graduate 24% Pell grantees, yet maintains a moderate $19K average net cost for middle-income students, about the same as the public flagship, the University of Illinois. Or #33 Gustavus Adolphus College in St. Peter, Minnesota, with only $50K in endowment per student, but 21% Pell grantees and also a moderate $19K average net cost for middle-class students. These are both pretty decent LACs—not AWS, by any means, but good, solid colleges that seem to make it a high institutional priority to recruit, enroll, and graduate low-income students while keeping costs down for the middle class.

I’ve got nothing against NYU or BU in particular. They’re pretty good schools for those who can afford them. I wouldn’t particularly recommend either of them to low- and moderate-income students, but I would say the same of all the schools I listed. Or more precisely, I’d say “Go ahead and apply if you like, but temper your expectations about how affordable it will be. But you never know, lightning might strike and you might end up with an attractive FA package. Just know going in that most in your financial status don’t.”

*I say “marginally” more generous because we are talking about the top 179 most generous colleges with a 75%-plus grad rate.

I think that may be a misinterpretation of what the NY Times list represents. Sad to say, but I think these may be the only U.S. college and universities with a 75%+ five-year graduation rate.

[OHMomof2]

I think these may be the only U.S. college and universities with a 75%+ five-year graduation rate.

I was looking for Tulane on that list and realized it wasn’t there because it doesn’t meet that criteria! It was very generous with D, almost matched a school in this list’s top 10.

[prospect1]

It’s hard to compare the generosity of the publics on this list with the privates, since the publics are being measured on their generosity toward instate students. It is far cheaper to meet the needs of Pell students at instate tuition prices than to meet the needs of Pell students at universities costing $60k plus per year.

[prospect1]

@OHMomof2, I have heard that Tulane is very generous as well, although I do not personally have experience with that college. That’s good to know!

[OHMomof2]

It was an example of the NPC way underestimating actual aid/scholarships.

[bclintonk]

@ucbalumnus

PurpleTitan wrote:
note that UVa and UNC say they meet full need for everyone as well. The only publics that do.

Of course, selectivity for OOS is very high at those schools.

Selectivity for OOS students is also very high at Michigan. This year the OOS admit rate was right around 20%. Michigan gets about 50,000 applications a year, roughly 40,000 of them from OOS applicants.

I believe UNC Chapel Hill’s OOS enrollment is capped at something like 18 or 20% of its student body. UVA has limited its OOS enrollment to about 35%, but whether that’s a university policy or a legal requirement I’m not sure. Michigan isn’t subject to any such cap, and its OOS enrollment has gradually drifted upward, with recent classes upwards of 40% OOS. The state legislature has no say in the matter because under the Michigan constitution, the university is an autonomous, self-governing body, headed by a Board of Regents elected directly by the people. I’ve heard that the Regents intend to keep in-state enrollment at or above 50%, but that leaves substantial room for growth in OOS enrollment. I’m not sure meeting full need for OOS students will cause a big spike in OOS applications, though it could. I think the more immediate effect would be a dramatic increase in OOS yield, which of course would then allow the university to further ratchet down its OOS admit rate while further elevating SAT/ACT medians, etc.

[Hanna]

“I think these may be the only U.S. college and universities with a 75%+ five-year graduation rate.”

That’s right. Pretty brutal considering there are close to 3000 four-year schools not on the list.