<p>What do you think is the school with the most international atmosphere? I'm looking for a school that has an international feel to it and has many foreign languages that are offered, particularly Arabic.</p>
<p>Jonathan--I thought you were applying to only that one day school this year, and only St. Paul's for 10th grade.</p>
<p>I am. I was just wondering.</p>
<p>BTW - If I like it at the day school, then I probably won't apply to SPS. There's excellent courses offered at the local school such as Middle Eastern Studies, International Relations, etc. Plus, it's close to University of Michigan so maybe I could take some Arabic classes there.</p>
<p>i dunno about the numbers of language offered... however from what i know hotchkiss modern language is one of the most rigorous programs....considering that at loomis, which is considered just a notch lower academically, their 4th year spanish can be AP or non AP while at hotchkiss...3rd year spanish is AP and most kids score 5s........
for all languages, you start speaking in that language first day even in first year classes and no english allowed at all.....</p>
<p>That's very interesting, Jonathan. What do plan to do when you grow up?</p>
<p>Bearcats--remember, how high a test score on a foriegn language AP test may be a measure of an exceptional language program, or it could be a sign of an academic, demanding school with bright students that are commited to learning, and have good test-taking skills.</p>
<p>Portsmouth abbey has students from 17 countries. They do not have arabic but they do require oneyear of latin. It appears to have a classical program. The problem is that on these threads no one may be interested in a school that accepts 50%. It is an intriguing school with a humanities program like St. Paul's during the sophmore year. It has other fine qualities and like all schools it has some draw backs.</p>
<p>Diman, the founder of St. george's school is also the founder of portsmouth abbey. He converted from Episcopalian to Catholic then founded the Abbey</p>
<p>actuallly test scores wasnt my main point, i was just saying...hotchkiss foreign languages are wellknown to be hard becoz they cover so much a year that kids in spanish reach AP level during their third year while kids at prep schools a notch lower academically do it during their fourth year...i m putting it out there..it's not neccessarily a good thing...for example...i get so much hw per day for spanish and for the first 2 years, about an hour a day in the language lab...</p>
<p>That's neat. I wanted to apply to Hotchkiss, but it was too far away from Boston.</p>
<p>Prepparent: Portsmouth abbey is to the Catholic tradition of education what Winchester College is to the Anglican Public School tradition--the most elite of the catholic preps. I think Bobby Kennedy after spending one semester being desperately unhappy at St. Paul's went to Portsmouth--his brother John went to Choate and Teddy to Milton. Portsmouth Abbey is indeed in the humanist liberal education tradition inspired by its Benedictine roots and John Henry Newman's "Idea of a University".</p>
<p>
[quote]
That's very interesting, Jonathan. What do plan to do when you grow up?
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</p>
<p>I want to go to Georgetown SFS and work for the US Department of State and eventually become an ambassador. Maybe I'd go onto law school instead. I haven't really figured it out yet. I still have a few years. lol</p>
<p>That's very ambitious, Jonathan. I frequently think about a career in law, but I wouldn't want to work for the governement.</p>
<p>paleozoic, is john henry newman responsible for the Oxford Movement?
I was unable to be at my D interview at Portsmouth Abbey, however, she apparently liked enough to apply. The one rub is the daily mass requirement. Although we are Catholic, my D and W are a bit concerned that this may have a negative effect on diversity (religious).
As you are aware SPS has about a 60% Episcopalian student body. PAS has about the same percent of Catholic students. This does not seem to be an issue at SPS, however they do not have a daily religious service like PAS.</p>
<p>Prepparent: The Oxford Movement was a High Anglican tractarian movement originally started by Pusey. In the course of exploring anglican foundations it moved so close to catholic spirituality that for all practical purposes they became indistinguishable.</p>
<p>John Henry Newman and John Manning started out as tractarians and ultimately converted to Catholicism. The one became a leading catholic intellectual figure, the other catholic primate of Britain.</p>
<p>My favourite tractarian and perhaps the most noble and spiritual is John Keble who remained anglican ( anglo-catholic) and whose quiet humility inspired the founding of Keble College in Oxford. </p>
<p>The last remnant of of anglo-catholicism in the US is Church of the Advent in Boston. Curiously enough this church was founded by the same person (George Shattuck) who also founded St. Paul's school. The spiritual family resemblance you pointed out between Portsmouth Abbey and St. Paul's School is thus grounded in history via St. George's school.</p>
<p>I would not worry about the diversity at either place. Both schools are grounded in a definite spiritual tradition which which characterizes the school. You might check the mass requirement at Portsmouth Abbey if it is of concern to you, but I am virtually certain that the daily mass you speak occurs at the adjoining Benedictine Abbey at which attendance is voluntary. </p>
<p>What may not be voluntary is a daily chapel at the school but this, like daily chapel at St. Paul's, is a non-denominational gathering of the school community and absolutely central to the educational philosophy at either place.</p>
<p>If your daughter likes Portsmouth Abbey, it would be a fantastic choice both academically and spiritually.</p>
<p>paleozoic, thanks for the info/education. Yes i will check with Portsmouth Abbey's daily mass requirement. I'm intrigued by their 2nd year Humanities program and latin requirement among other things. My D is in her second year of latin so I guess the requirement may not pertain to her so much.
I guess there must also be a connection with Groton and Brooks as well since both were founded by Endicott. Is that correct? It's also interesting how Middlesex was so closely aligned to Harvard in the early days. Many of the who's who's of Harvard were Directors and/or major supporters. Middlesex was also closely aligned to Exeter in that apparently exeter purchased MX bonds that were eventually bought back from pea.</p>
<p>Tractarians as I understand were part of the Oxford movement. The 90 "tracks of the times", how did this lead to a conversion?</p>
<p>Reduced to its barebones I suppose the Tractarian (Oxford) movement was about being English as much as about being Christian. The roots actually go back to Arnolds' educational reforms at Rugby--which underies much of the philosophy of the new american preps beginning with St. Paul's School. So there is a resemblance. </p>
<p>The problem became one of harmonizing the catholic spiritual approach to education--I believe in order to understand (Credo ut intelligere) with the evangelical tone convictions of 19th century England. The protestants at that time still flew by Luther's educational dictum " I believe because it is absurd " (Credo quam absurdum). </p>
<p>It was one of the mysteries of english life that this educational conflict was embedded in the prayerbook where the liturgy and poetry clashed with the theology of the 39 articles. When Newman pointed this out in the famous tract 90 he was forced to choose between being english or being catholic. There was no conversion. If you read the Apologia you will find him saying " what I believed in 1856 I believed in 1831" there was just no further conflict between the catholic and protestant
approach to truth. Therefore his most enduring book I believe is "The Idea of a University". </p>
<p>St. George's like St. Paul's and Groton are explicitly anglo-catholic school. The humanities programmes are thus grounded in the conviction that there is a certain god created order in the universe (Actually Einstein believed that also). Hence the sense that civilisations and history contain discoverable patterns of meaning and intelligibility. Therefore the prepschool conviction that Tacitus or Thucydides are vastly more meaningful than yesterday's newspaper.</p>
<p>You are right. Historically Middlesex was founded by Harvard Alumni as a prepschool for Harvard. The founder of Groton however was Endictt Peabody, also Anglo-catholic but not related at all to the founding of St. George's.</p>
<p>it happens that Hotchkiss is founded by maria bissell (husband of the gunmaker) under the encouragement of the president of yale as a prepschool for yale</p>
<p>back on topic, please.</p>
<p>paleozoic, I meant to say that E. Peabody also founded Brooks School. Hugh Diman founded SGS, Portsmouth Abbey and apparently another technical school somewhere in Rhode Island. Another tid bit of info on Middlesex. Apparently its founder Winsor felt that an endowment was not important because he had plenty of money backing the school. This may account for MX lower endowment. It may have been his one blunder for such a school. </p>
<p>Paleo, let me ask you, recently Mx had a capital campaign raising well over 100 million, does this all go toward improvements, teachers, etc. Does any of this money ever go toward the endowement? Last year they had an alumnus offer to match up to six million (matching), of course they raised the six million and he added six million. It says that six million of this is to go to FA. Does that mean they add six million directly to FA or does some of that go to other things aligned with FA but not directly to FA.</p>
<p>Endowment is a bit of a catch all term for funds that are intended to supplement operating income and to maintain the fabric of the school. The donors can designate either restricted or unrestricted purposes. If you donate to the FA or library fund it means it can only be used for FA or library purposes. If you donate unrestricted a portion drops into supplemental operating revenue ( which can also be FA) and a portion into capital items like building a new science building or library.</p>